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NATO Invites Finland & Sweden To Join NATO

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by esmith, Jun 29, 2022.

?
  1. Yes

    95.7%
  2. No

    4.3%
  3. Not Sure

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. esmith

    esmith Veteran Member

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  2. F1fan

    F1fan Well-Known Member

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    What makes the USA safe is not being part of Europe. NATO having US support does help strengthen Europe and our alliance with it. As we have seen having alliances that focus on economics and stability has been the best thing for all nations. Russia's aggression illustrates how war is disruptive and catastrophic for stability and the global economy. The pandemic was bad enough, and then to be followed by a war?
     
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  3. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
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    I didn't answer the poll because the question is whether they "should" join NATO, and I'm not sure if that's the issue.

    They haven't joined NATO yet. Turkey has dropped its opposition to their entry, but it still has to be ratified by all 30 members (and their parilaments), so it's not a done deal yet.

    I agree with the statement above that Finland and Sweden joining NATO won't make the U.S. any safer, but I'm not sure if that's the issue either. The U.S. is just as safe either way. I don't even think Finland or Sweden are in any real danger at this point, even if Putin is making a lot of noise about them. For all intents and purposes, the Russians have lost their war in Ukraine.

    But if Finland and Sweden want to join NATO at this point, NATO would probably accept them - although I don't know if all the NATO member countries (and the factions within them) are all on the same page on this issue.

    What's also interesting is that South Korea, Japan, Australia, and New Zealand are also attending the upcoming NATO summit as guests. China is a bit rankled by that.
     
  4. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    This is part of sending Russia a message which also includes Lithuania and Kalinigrad as well as Norway and Russia over Svalbard as well as other measures including helping Europe and America field test all their weapons and so forth.

    Putin is immune to pressure but he's surrounded by people who can get the message about his war with Ukraine.
     
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  5. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.

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  6. Stonetree

    Stonetree Dashing Member
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    CNN did not author that report(imo). CNN,probably reported on a FOX news story:....Russ Vought is the president of the Center for Renewing America and was President Trump’s Director of the Office of Management and Budget...This gentleman wrote the opinion...
     
  7. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Given that there were a few people of integrity trying to do the right thing in spite of Trump, I'm willing to ask for more info before deciding if they're actually telling the truth or not.
     
  8. Stonetree

    Stonetree Dashing Member
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    If you read(past tense) the opinion stated in the report, I take its meaning to be an opinion that is a view on US international affairs based on economic considerations plus Mr.Vought's suggestion that with more NATO members the US defenses would be spread thin and this would be a real danger for the US. I'm sure Mr.Vought is not alone in his opinion. I find no fault in any American expressing such a concern...As to how this news was reported or who reported the news, I find that to be tangential to the issue...
     
  9. Suave

    Suave Simulated character

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    I have little doubt this NATO expansion encroaching upon the Finnish-Russian border will likely prompt Russian President Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin to have hypersonic nuclear missiles based in Kaliningrad well defended by the next generation surface to air missile system.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. The Hammer

    The Hammer Fork-Beard
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    I think they'll try. But I seriously doubt there is much they can actually do to stop them from joining.

    Like the US, their nuclear armament is more of a deterrent, then something to be actually used.
     
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  11. The Hammer

    The Hammer Fork-Beard
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    They should absolutely join, as should any other European country that seems to do so in light of what's happening in Ukraine.
     
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  12. Quetzal

    Quetzal A little to the left and slightly out of focus.
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    Yes, they should 100% join it.
     
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  13. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    It does not matter if he does that. NATO is after all a purely defensive alliance. They key thing is that Russia will be deterred from mounting an offensive operation against NATO members.
     
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  14. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    Yes exactly. The point of NATO is to protect Europe, so that the USA does not have to incur the enormous costs in blood and treasure that it had to in 2 previous world wars.

    A new war in Europe would do huge damage to the USA, regardless of whether or not it was itself under any military threat.
    We can see, even with the current Ukraine war, how much these wars affect everyone in the world.

    Any notion that the USA could stand aside from a conflict in Europe and carry on unaffected is fantasy.
     
    #14 exchemist, Jun 30, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2022
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  15. Flankerl

    Flankerl Well-Known Member

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    The gig is up for Russia.
    There will be even more cooperation with Korea and Japan which means Russia on the Pacific becomes indefensible.


     
  16. ideogenous_mover

    ideogenous_mover Well-Known Member

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    I thought I heard something not long ago about how it's harder for them to get stuff to Kaliningrad. Is that true?

    Are you talking about the satan 2? I thought that's the one I keep seeing articles on. Is that one hypersonic? I don't understand, at all, what difference the distance thing makes with all this. Retaliation would occur from sea, no matter how fast the first strike is. And I suspect that neither side can really get total bearing on where the subs are
     
  17. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    The only difference, according to my understanding, is that it is harder for an anti-ballistic missile system to defend against a hypersonic missile, due to its speed and, I think, ability to manoeuvre in flight. But as far as MAD goes, I think you're right: it makes no difference.

    What may also be important is that Putin's ability to assemble many of these is likely to be hamstrung by the embargo on supplying sensitive micro-electronic components to Russia. There are already accounts from Ukraine of Russian missiles containing repurposed microprocessors out of washing machines.
     
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  18. Secret Chief

    Secret Chief Leaderless Animal

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    That sounds like something out of a Douglas Adams book!
     
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  19. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    The reports were some weeks ago now. I've have to see if they are still around. I suppose it could have been disinformation by Ukraine.
     
  20. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Libya and Syria prove the NATO is anything but defensive.
     
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