My OT class

[Squirt]

^^^ my post was to squirt not nutshell

Well how many fathers do you know who have no gender?

 

[i believe in tranquility]

thats the whole point dude...what makes you think God is a father. The "BEGINNING" is where the whole concept starts. That kind of why I used Genesis 1

 

[dan]

NOW WHEN TRANSLATING THIS TEXT INTO ENGLISH, THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE THE ENGLISH TRANSLATION TO MAKE GRAMMATICAL SENSE IS TO REPLACE THAT (3rd person masculine singular) WITH "he". NOTE: the WORD "HE" in Hebrew is:
הוּ
English would be like so: Hu

THIS WORD IS NOT In THIS PASSAGE OF THE BIBLE, THEREFORE we can assert that when we read Genisis 1:27- So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

Take out the he/his and you get no gender. THAT IS WHY I SAY THAT GOD HAS NO GENDER.

Another goofball trying to teach us a language he doesn't understand. The first sentence in Hebrew already has a verb conjugated in the masculine and a personal name that is masculine. To add the pronoun "he" would render the syntax a joke. The "he" is there for the sentences that refer to the previous subject, but don't use the subjects name. You have to put in a pronoun in order to clarify who the subject is. The Hebrew word for "he" isn't used because, in Hebrew, the verb conjugation already clarifies it. It is pure idiocy to think a totally literal translation will reveal something different than a translation that conveys the full meaning of the Hebrew.

 

[Deut 13:1]

ok sry bout taking a couple days...stuff happens

Perhaps it would be in your best interest if you took a year off of this site, went to Israel or a college, studied Hebrew, and finally come back before you your pitiful attempt to explain why "who" isn't their in the text. As I stated on page 5, it is either conjugated either M or F, there is no Non-gender. However, if you want to believe in idiocy, i believe in tranquility, then more power to you, although the tooth fairy is just as believable as your knowledge of Hebrew...

NOW WHEN TRANSLATING THIS TEXT INTO ENGLISH, THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE THE ENGLISH TRANSLATION TO MAKE GRAMMATICAL SENSE IS TO REPLACE THAT (3rd person masculine singular) WITH "he". NOTE: the WORD "HE" in Hebrew is:
הוּ
English would be like so: Hu

Didn't you read my earlier post? Hu is on first!

THIS WORD IS NOT In THIS PASSAGE OF THE BIBLE, THEREFORE we can assert that when we read Genisis 1:27- So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

You are correct in saying that he(who) is not on first(rishon) base, but you fail to explain the verb conjugations...

Take out the he/his and you get no gender. THAT IS WHY I SAY THAT GOD HAS NO GENDER.

Woul dyou like a list of reasons why I think my IQ dropped from reading this post of yours? or will this do?

 

[Aqualung]

ok sry bout taking a couple days...stuff happens

No problemo.

I think dan and deut did a good job explaining that, but in case you didn't get it:

I don't read hebrew. I can't tell you for a fact whether or not the 3rd person, singular, masculine pronoun is there or not. What I can tell you, however, is that all verbs in hebrew are conjugated to either carry masculinity or femininity, and that therefore you know through verb conjugation that God is at least referred to as male.

 

[i believe in tranquility]

Another goofball trying to teach us a language he doesn't understand. The first sentence in Hebrew already has a verb conjugated in the masculine and a personal name that is masculine. To add the pronoun "he" would render the syntax a joke. The "he" is there for the sentences that refer to the previous subject, but don't use the subjects name. You have to put in a pronoun in order to clarify who the subject is. The Hebrew word for "he" isn't used because, in Hebrew, the verb conjugation already clarifies it. It is pure idiocy to think a totally literal translation will reveal something different than a translation that conveys the full meaning of the Hebrew.

Dan, first off there is no reason to mock. I agree with you, but what I am saying is that he is added by English translators. If you are in disagreement with me, then please do not lash out, but speak with a peaceful heart and mind.

Perhaps it would be in your best interest if you took a year off of this site, went to Israel or a college, studied Hebrew, and finally come back before you your pitiful attempt to explain why "who" isn't their in the text. As I stated on page 5, it is either conjugated either M or F, there is no Non-gender. However, if you want to believe in idiocy, i believe in tranquility, then more power to you, although the tooth fairy is just as believable as your knowledge of Hebrew...

Duet, again, there is no reason to mock me. I wasnt "attempting" to explain why "who" isnt in the Hebrew text... IM SAYING THAT THE WORD IS NOT THERE. I HAVE NO USE FOR EXPLAINING WHY, BECAUSE IT IS NOT THERE. Again I agree with you that every word is either M of F (i know that), so to give an example: the word for hand in hebrew is F, so we can assume that God's hand is female. Do you see what i'm asserting? Im trying to understand these text and talk with fellow human beings about them, not be ranted on. The whole reason of me doing this is because I believe that God is Male NOR Female, one because the Jews said that God is indescribale to the human mind, two because I dont think that God is Male AND Female, and because I dont beilve that God is MALE OR FEMALE. When God becomes associated with gender, a clash appears and the opposite group of people feel like that are under control.

Can anyone relate?...if not, whatever..

 

[i believe in tranquility]

so to clear things up I UNDERSTAND that a pronoun is required in Elohim. and I UNDERSTAND that the word ordering of Enlish and Hebrew are COMPLETELY Different (thats why this whole translation is complicated).

 

[Deut 13:1]

So, how in English would you convey the point that the verb is masculine in your fantasy 'literal' translation.

 

[Aqualung]

Okay, so "who" is not there. But you can't deny the fact that the verb is conjugating in a 3rd person, singular, masculine fashion. The pronoun is not there due to redundancy, and you can't just go assuming that because it is necessary in English to convey gender and number, that it is also necessary in Hebrew, and therefore the lack of the pronoun mean lack of gender and number.

 

[i believe in tranquility]

yes i agree, but remeber that just because the masculility of the word doesnt mean that the word itself is masculine. Like I said before, if you want to say that God is male, then you have to assert that God's hand is female, because the word for hand in hebrew is feminine. thats all im saying...

 

[Aqualung]

Yes it does mean that. I'm not talking about a noun being feminine like hand. I'm talking about a verb conjugation for god himself being feminine.

 

[Squirt]

thats the whole point dude

I'm not a dude, dude.

...what makes you think God is a father. The "BEGINNING" is where the whole concept starts. That kind of why I used Genesis 1

I think God is a Father for several reasons. First of all, the scriptures tell us that He is the "Father of Spirits." Secondly, Jesus referred to Him both as His Father and as our Father constantly.

And another thing... If Jesus was truly a human being, He had a total of 46 chromosomes. He got one strand of 23 from His mother. Where did He get the other stand of 43 from? In my opinion, He got them from His Father -- not from some genderless "thing."

 

[Deut 13:1]

yes i agree, but remeber that just because the masculility of the word doesnt mean that the word itself is masculine. Like I said before, if you want to say that God is male, then you have to assert that God's hand is female, because the word for hand in hebrew is feminine. thats all im saying...

Dan and I would both agree that HaShem has no gender, but the reasons you give to support your claim are idiotic and untrue.

 

[i believe in tranquility]

squirt: sorry about the "dude", but since you insint that God is male, Who is God's wife, since life is only possible with the joining of a male and female...

 

[i believe in tranquility]

^ insist*

 

[Aqualung]

Dan and I would both agree that HaShem has no gender, but the reasons you give to support your claim are idiotic and untrue.

Dan wouldn't.

Oh, unless you meant that the word "HaShem" has no gender. I don't know about that. But I'm dan thinks the Father is truly male.

 

[Aqualung]

Let's start with something funny my teacher said. Esau is a hunter. He's the man's man. Jacob is quiet and lives in tents. He's the Pee Wee Herman of the family, really effiminate, and a momma's boy.

Jacob is a pure sociopath. A good definition of a sociopath (IMO) is a person who is interested only in their personal needs and desires, without concern for the effects of their behavior on others. Jacob pretty much only displays this. Let's take for example when Esau comes back from the hunt. Now, in those days, people would go out hunting for days at a time, and usually not catch much if anything at all. When Esau said that he was starving almost to the point of death, I'm inclined to believe him. But then Esau comes to Jacob looking for some food, and what does Jacob say? "Not unless you promise me your birthright." This disregard for another's life, and pure interest in personal desires is very indicative of a sociopath. A definite testament to Esau, though, is he gives it. He's not like Cain, who kills Abel right away. He actually gives in and is a nice boy. Why did God choose Jacob?!

After he takes Esau's birthright, Jacob takes Esau's blessing. He does this by disguising himself and tricking his own father that he is Esau. Does he show any remorse for this at all?! Of course not. All he can think about is his own gain.

Jacob is also like us. When God appears to Jacob (when he sees the "ladder" extending to heaven), that's not enough for him. He won't just follow the deity that appears to him. INstead he says, "If god will watch over me, and keep anything bad from happening to me, then I will worship him." This is a lot like what modern people say. They ask, "How can I be expected to worship a god that won't do everything for me?!"

I think that's about all I have to say about Jacob at the moment. I might think of something else later, though.

 

[Squirt]

squirt: sorry about the "dude", but since you insint that God is male, Who is God's wife, since life is only possible with the joining of a male and female...

I don't know anything about God's "wife." I do know, though, that Mary was Jesus' mother and that God was Jesus' father. I also know that mothers are female and that fathers are male. Why would Jesus have constantly -- I mean over and over and over again -- called God "Father" if He wasn't His Father. He could have just called Him "God" and been entirely accurate. Why did He refer to His Father by the pronouns "He" and "Him" instead of "It." "It" is not such a horrible word. If God has no gender, why didn't Jesus use that word instead? I'm only going by what the Bible says; what are you going by?

 

[i believe in tranquility]

I don't know anything about God's "wife." I do know, though, that Mary was Jesus' mother and that God was Jesus' father. I also know that mothers are female and that fathers are male. Why would Jesus have constantly -- I mean over and over and over again -- called God "Father" if He wasn't His Father. He could have just called Him "God" and been entirely accurate. Why did He refer to His Father by the pronouns "He" and "Him" instead of "It." "It" is not such a horrible word. If God has no gender, why didn't Jesus use that word instead? I'm only going by what the Bible says; what are you going by?

EXACTLY^^^

God is JESUS's FATHER, BUT you me and every other human here ALREADY HAVE OUR OWN FATHERS. For me to call "God" my father would be incorrect, for me to call "God" my teacher, my giude, my loving, caring supporter would be more accurate.

 

[Aqualung]

EXACTLY^^^

God is JESUS's FATHER, BUT you me and every other human here ALREADY HAVE OUR OWN FATHERS. For me to call "God" my father would be incorrect, for me to call "God" my teacher, my giude, my loving, caring supporter would be more accurate.

Yes, but (as I already pointed out) that reasoning is flawed, because christ called God our fathers as well.