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My GODLESS life is very HAPPY, WEALTHY and SUCCESSFUL. WHY????

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by tr3, Dec 21, 2004.

  1. oracle

    oracle Active Member

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    If a man knew God, his wealth would become worthless to him, because wealth has no spirituall value. Men are born naked and naked they will return. All the money a man can earn, all the happiness the material world offers, has no real value, but is an illusion: a vapor that quickly vanishes along with your physical life. If you find pleasure in what quickly vanishes after death, then you find pleasure in thin air... If a man famishes his flesh, leaving his spirit starving, when the flesh dies and his spirit lives on after death, what has he gained? He has gained nothing but spiritual poverty. This man was born empty, and yet he will return empty...

    [font=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Luke 18:25For it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."[/font]
     
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  2. oracle

    oracle Active Member

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    If you seek God only in times of trouble, then you are decieved by your own selfishness. You are decieved by your own ego. Neither does a man or women who does such not know God, but insult Him by using Him for their own bidding.

    [font=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Luke 13:[/font][font=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]27 But He will say, 'I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.' [/font]
     
  3. linwood

    linwood Well-Known Member

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    Damn..I should be so lucky.

    This atheism just isn`t working to it`s full potential for me.

    :)
     
  4. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    But this guy is not only happy materialistic wise, but in survival wise, knowing wise and also the general acceptance of the life he has. Why does he need God?
     
  5. Linus

    Linus Well-Known Member

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    No matter where or to whom you ask this question, you are gonna get a million different answers, so here is mine:

    Salvation. Not for this life, but for that which is to come.
     
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  6. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    Are you referring to the afterlife? There is perhaps a chance this person does not believe in such things, so, should he prepare for something that he does not (or may not) believe in?
     
  7. Linus

    Linus Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't matter whether or not he believes in the afterlife. All that matters is whether or not it exists.
     
  8. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    Um..I wasn't sure what you really meant, but let's say it doesn't exist. Would he still have to believe in it?
     
  9. _salam_

    _salam_ Member

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    I'm glad that having the good job, the money, the cars, the nice wife, and the various other material things makes your life a happy one. However, what about when you loose all of these things (cause you will, either when you die or before then), will you still be happy? I'm happy without all of these things because my happyness is built in my relationship with Allah. In fact I feel much happier, and secure, knowing that my life is based in Allah rather than material possesions because I will always have Allah (unless I choose to leave, which I don't see happening) whereas you will not always have these material things. What if your jobs go under, or you wreck your car, or your house burns down, or your wife dies, then what do you have? All the things that were making your life "perfect" will be gone one day and then you will have nothing, however, I will still have Allah and thats all that matters to me, not any of these other things.
     
  10. Linus

    Linus Well-Known Member

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    Well, let me explain.

    Believeing in something does not make it true or untrue. You can believe in Santa Clause, or the tooth fairy, or God, or Satan, but that does not make it true. Just because you don't believe in something, doesn't mean it does not exist. That is what I meant.

    Anyway, if an afterlife does not exist, then no of course he wouldn't have to believe in it.
     
  11. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    Actually I thought he would be more dead than happy.
     
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  12. oracle

    oracle Active Member

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    This reminds me of the story of Job.
     
  13. oracle

    oracle Active Member

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    A person may survive through the physical, but spiritually he or she may be in poverty. There is worldy knowledge, and spiritual knowledge, but worldy has no spiritual value. If a man accepts the life he has without God, that is up to him, but he is caught in a snare. So did the rich man when he denied to give up his possessions to follow Jesus, because his heart was attatched to meaningless things. A piece of gold or diamond may have much earthly value, but no riches in the world can buy wisdom. Nor can the wealthiest man buy unconditional love. Although a person measures his or her life with possessions, in reality they have nothing. Let me give you an analogy. Would you invest in the stock market knowing that it will later crash? And if you invest your time in things that will vanish, what logic exists in that? If the afterlife exists, he will just continue where he left off with... perhaps with little, or maybe even nothing.

    After his death he will be forgotten, just another simpleton living life, just another person with a home, car, and wife. But hey, if you're happy with a cookie cutter life, no amount of talk will change that, untill he percieves these things of having no true value, and believes in an afterlife. That is why...

    [font=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Luke 18:25 For it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

    If you do not have God, then you do not have love, because God is love (I'm not talking about emotions, rather that love is a word that describes a connection), and without love, you have nothing. If these possessions didn't exist, what does this man have? nothing... Because he embraced nothing.


    [/font]
     
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  14. _salam_

    _salam_ Member

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    I agree completely.:D
     
  15. _salam_

    _salam_ Member

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    Here is some advice on the subject from the Qur'an. Enjoy!

    "Fair in the eyes of men is the love of thigs they covet: women and sons; heaped-up hoards of gold and silver; horses branded (for blood and excellence); and (wealth of) cattle and well-tilled land. Such are hte possessions of the world's life; but nearness to Allah is the best of the goals (to return to)." 3: 14

    "As in the case of those before you: they were mightire than you in power, and more flourishing in wealth and children. They had their enjoyment of their portion: and ye have of yours, as did those before you; and ye indulge in idle talk as they did. They!--- Their works are fruitless in this world and in the Hereafter, and they will lose (all spiritual good)." 9: 69

    "Know ye (all), that the life of this world is but play and amusement, pomp and mutual boasting and multiplying, (in rivalry) among yourselves, riches and children. Here is a similitude: how rain and the growth which it brings forth, delight (the hearts of) the tillers; soon it withers; thou wilt see it grow yellow; then it becomes dry and crumbles away. But in the Hereafter is a penalty severe (for the devotees of wrong). And Forgiveness from Allah and (His) Good pleasure (for the devotees of Allah). And what is the life of this world, but goods and chattels of deception?" 57: 20

    "These people love this fleeting world and have put the thought of a Momentous Day behind their backs." 76: 27

    "The life of the world is nothing but a game and a diversion. The abode of the hereafter, that is truly Life, if they only knew it." 29: 64

    "As for the abode of the hereafter, We shall grant it to those who do not seek to exalt themselves in this world or to cause corruption in it....." 28: 83

    "... Allah has given those who strive with their wealth and themselves a higher rank than those who stay behind...." 4: 95

    "You who believe! Do not let your wealth or children divert you from the remembrance of Allah. Whoever does that is lost." 63: 9

    "Set forth to them the parable of two men: for one of them We provided two gardens of grape-vines and surrounded them with date palms; in between the two We placed corn-fields. Each of those gardens brought forth its produce, and failed not in the least therein: in the midst of them We caused a river to flow. (Abundant) was the produce this man had: he said to his companion, in the course of a mutual argument: "More wealth have I then you, and more honour and power in (my following of) men." He went into his garden in a state (of mind) unjust to his soul: he said, "I deem not that this will ever perish, nor do I deem that the Hour (of Judgement) will (ever) come: even if I am brought back to my Lord, I shall surely find (there) something better in exchange." His companion said to him, in the course of the argument with him: "Dost thou deny Him Who created thee out of dust, then out of a sperm-drop, then fashioned thee into a man? But (I think) for my part that He is Allah, my Lord, and none shall I associate with my Lord. Why didst thou not, as thou wentest into thy garden, say: 'Allah's Will (be done)! There is no power but with Allah!' If thou dost see me less than thee in wealth and sons, it may be that my Lord will give me something better than thy garden, and that He will send on thy garden thunderbolts (by way of reckoning) from heaven, making it (but) slippery sand! Or the water of the garden will run off underground so that thou wilt never be able to find it." So his fruits (and enjoyment) were encompassed (with ruin), and he remained twisting and turning his hands over what he had spent on his property, which had (now) tumbled to pieces to its very foundations, and he could only say, "Woe is me! Would I had never ascribed partners to my Lord and Cherisher!" Nor had he numbers to help him against Allah, nor was he able to deliver himself. There, the (only) protection comes from Allah, the True One. He is the Best to reward, and the Best to give success. 18: 32-44 (Hey this one sounds just like our friend tr3 and the attitude he has, and how I warned him about what will happen).

    Oh, and this last one here has to do with that attitude that tr3 has.
    "Do not avert your face from people out of haughtiness and do not strut about arrogantly on the earth. Allah does not love anyone who is vain or boastful." 31:18
     
  16. linwood

    linwood Well-Known Member

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    Well, I`d usually say no but considering I`ve been preparing for the arrival of Santa Claus I`d feel just a bit hypocritical.

    :)
     
  17. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    ROFL Linwood.

    Anyways, if a man is happy in his Earth-life without God or believing in God, then he shall not need to worry about what happens whence he dies, for he will not be in the heavens with God, but purely non-existant.

    I cannot imagine a corpse getting up from his grave to feel deprived.
     
  18. _salam_

    _salam_ Member

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    But he will exist after death and therefore he should worry about the afterlife.
     
  19. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    But if he does not believe in the afterlife, will he still "experience it"?
     
  20. eternity

    eternity New Member

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    What will your happiness do for you when you're dead?...that could be tomorrow....
     
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