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my boyfriend worships Thors and i dont understand please help!

Discussion in 'Paganism DIR' started by Heather82, Jun 10, 2011.

  1. Heather82

    Heather82 New Member

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    Excuse me. I came here asking for answers and trying to be more accepting and tolerant because I actually wanted to learn. Sorry for offending everybody and sorry that you don't want to help people learn and become more accepting. Won't bother you anymore.
     
  2. Klaufi_Wodensson

    Klaufi_Wodensson Vinlandic Warrior

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    To be honest I think Quagmire was referring to Skwim, and not you. But then again I may be wrong.
     
  3. blackout

    blackout Violet.

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    Is it any less bizarre to you that
    otherwise intelligent and fairly normal people
    believe in a super hero God named Jesus?

    Just wondering. ;)
     
  4. blackout

    blackout Violet.

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    Why do you think your BF doesn't want to explain it to you?

    Hopefully as a couple,
    you are genuinely open and interested in him,
    who he is, what he thinks, in a loving way,
    and
    hopefully he wants to share that with you. no?

    Paganism is so different, unique, for each individual.
    Certainly It can't hurt to find out what others think,
    however,
    you will never know what he thinks about it
    unless HE tells you himself.

    Maybe stop asking him about why he thinks Thor is 'real',
    and ask him instead
    what Thor MEANS to him.
    This comes off as interest, instead of condescention or confrontation.

    As well, the question is more relevant/revealant,
    if you truly want a deeper understanding of him,
    and the way he views life.
     
  5. Mike182

    Mike182 Flaming Queer

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    A couple of things come to my mind concerning this post.

    Any religious belief is going to sound weird to someone who doesn't hold religious beliefs, regardless of what that belief is. Socially however, not all religious beliefs are held to the same notion of 'weirdness', some are simply viewed as more weird than others. That factor comes through limited familiarity with those beliefs.

    You have admitted yourself that you are not familiar with your partner's beliefs, I sincerely commend your efforts to do this. Others who are more versed in Norse matters have already posted some good reading material, which should go some way towards aiding you in this matter.

    Secondly, Though I think the reading materials posted previously will help with this anyway, you need to put to one side certain preconceptions that you have. Most notabley, the preconception that a religious tradition has to be taken on face value. Thor being the God of thunder is a prime example because on face value, followers of the Norse tradition believe that thunder only happens when Thor wills it. To most if not all followers of the Norse path, this is simply not the case.

    Looking past one's own preconceptions when studying another faith is an important issue because, as you say, right now you hate and despise your partner for having these beliefs. I suspect that in reality you hate and despire him for having beliefs that you believe him to have, which he actually doesn't.

    Thirdly, you mentioned in a later post that some of the things you have read online freaked you out. This is not surprising, there is a lot of stuff on line. I would say that if you find some information which you find to be objectionable or weird, post the information here and ask for responses from the Pagan/Norse community. Sometimes it will be the case that the information is incorrect and the community will point you towards something more accurate, and sometimes it will be the case that something has a meaning beyond the face value that could be explained better.

    Either way, I hope you continue to post and learn here.

    My regards.
     
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  6. waitasec

    waitasec Veteran Member

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    seems to me you need to get out...
    pretending never solves anything. if this presents a problem for you...then either go head to head with him or get out...
    but that's just me

    welcome to the forum :)
     
  7. Dujanka

    Dujanka New Member

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    Saw that.. Thor is the god of thunder and Midgard/Earth is one of his kingdoms and he oversees mankind. Tyr is the Norse god of war.

    It wasn't just the Scandinavians it was quite a chunk of ancient Europe and is extremely similar to pre-Christian Celtic/Gaul beliefs.

    No harm done.
     
  8. Ravenheart

    Ravenheart Seeker

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    +100000 ultraviolet (sorry for the spam but I just had to agree)
     
  9. The Peacekeeper

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    Well, I didn't know that Asatru existed up until a few years ago, and I didn't thought that crazy, but very interesting and also a good way to preserve the old Norse tradition and culture... I don't think that being Asatru is scary in any way... I mean they are not mean large vikings who would come and plunder your home or something, they won't hang people in a tree as a sacrifice to Odin either... that was made quite a long time ago hehe.

    So... I don't see the creepy part. Freaking out was maybe taken by your bf as you having something against his belief. I suppose his belief is strong. :) There are people with strong belief in all religions...

    Try to read first, read about the old Norse myths, about the gods. You'll find it interesting. Then try and discover what Asatru are. Norse myths are more or less reality based... don't think you can really compare them with LOTR. Tolkien himself enjoyed studying that aspect. :)
     
  10. The Neo Nerd

    The Neo Nerd Well-Known Member

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    I ran into this when i dated a Wiccan. It was a bit of a shock that she took it as seriously as all the christians that i new. But i honestly didn't have problems with it. She didn't force her beliefs on me, but i found it really interesting so she was happy to tell me all about it.

    May i ask why you are struggling so much to accept that he believes what he believes?

    -Q
     
  11. Anonimus2

    Anonimus2 New Member

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    Ah honey, be happy he doesn't worship Zeus as some people here AKA I. Just let it be, we all believe different things. If his worship will ever affect you give him a space in the household to give offerings and just live him alone. It's all going to be fine.
     
  12. GoodbyeDave

    GoodbyeDave Well-Known Member

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    To clarify a little, saying Thor is "a good of thunder" doesn't mean that they're worshiping storms! It just means that Thor manifests himself, when he does, as thunder. In Hellenism, Zeus is viewed similarly, but as Plutarch pointed out, to say "Zeus is thunder" is to commit yourself to a choice between superstition (i.e. worshiping an inanimate object) or atheism (denying a god). The Nuer in the Sudan regard lightning as a sign from god but, as an anthropologist pointed out, they would say "lightning is god" but never "god is lightning". Similarly for a Hindu, Surya is not the actual physical sun.

    Polytheists believe that each god has a particular area of interest, as it were. Those of us who acknowledge a supreme being would say that they allot these responsibilities. But a god is much more than that: for a Heathen, Thor is not just responsible for the weather.
     
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  13. Reddawg6

    Reddawg6 New Member

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    I didn't take it as offensive, and I can't imagine Thor's skin so thin as to be offended by an honest inquiry. Ignorance is curable, but butt-hurt, sadly, is for life.
     
  14. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    Thor frowns upon thread necromancy.
     
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  15. The Sum of Awe

    The Sum of Awe Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.

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    It's just a res-erection
     
  16. MD

    MD qualiaphile

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    It's ALIVEE!!! :run:
     
  17. misteralarming

    misteralarming New Member

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    I think I just found a new life's motto
     
  18. EyeofOdin

    EyeofOdin Active Member

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    "Do you believe there is an actual God named Thor that exists and that it wasn't just made up by people who didn't have modern science?"

    "Thor", like most names of deities, is actually a title or description. Names were invented by humans, not gods. We use names and nouns to better organize and understand whatever we're interacting with. "Thor" comes from Old Norse "Þórr", which is from Proto-Germanic "Þunraz", which means simply "Thunder". Do I believe that on some astral plane, there is a red bearded man with fiery eyes, a crown of stars and flames, bearing a hammer who rides on a chariot drawn by goats? No. Rather, these are all spiritual and culturally specific symbols which are ways to better understand the thunder god. The crown of stars and flame mean that he probably has more than brute strength and that there is a mystical quality to him. The Hammer is a Viking warrior's weapon employing force and strength and is also phallic and fertile. Goat and sheep were the meat of the common man, representing Thor's relateability. Stormy and fiery eyes depict his stormy and angry qualities.

    So what we've learned about Thor based off of the symbols our ancestors attributed to him are that he's a protector, especially of the common man. He, on occasion, employs magick. He's a god of fertility and of strength in war. Lastly, he doesn't screw around.

    Here's another example: The Egyptian god Horus. He's depicted with the head of a falcon, carrying a scepter and wearing a hat that would look very alien to us. Egyptians probably didn't actually believe that Horus lived in the sky exactly as drawn with the semi-anthropomorphic figure carrying all of the bizarre tools.

    The falcon is a bird of prey, and was always seen in the sky. Horus, being a god of the sky, naturally had this animal attributed to him. This is also how he became god of war and the hunt, because Egyptians noted the falcon's fierce and predatory nature. The scepter is a symbol of authority to the pharos. Horus is said to be an ancestor of the pharos. Lastly, the funky hat. This is actually a crown, consisted of two pieces both representing a part of Egypt. One for Upper Egypt in the south, the other for Lower Egypt in the North. In this way he's a god of order.

    What we've just learned about Horus is that he is, in the animistic sense, connected to the sky (meaning it's believed his spirit manifests in the sky, just like the falcon). Horus is a protector and a god of war and hunting. He's a god of authority and patron to the pharos. Lastly, he's a god of order, justice and peace.

    "Do you believe that thunder and lightning is a result of a God or a result of a cold front meeting a warm front?"

    There's no denying science. It's just as foolish for a pagan to deny static electricity in storms than for a Christian to deny evolution. Our ancestors attributed many natural forces to the gods. We can't exactly say that lightning is caused by Mjolnir. Rather, most people would believe today that the gods can manifest in a force of nature. Is every lightning strike from the gods? Maybe, maybe not. Are they capable of communicating or making change in Wyrd (heathen's word for destiny) by making thunder storms? Absolutely.

    This question also touches on Mythology. Most Pagans view mythology very liberally and abstractly. In The Eddas, it's said that the world was created by a realm of ice (Niflheim) and another realm of fire (Muspelheim) pouring into a void (Ginnungagap)creating an immense giant (Ymir) who would then become disassembled by Odin, and his brothers Vili and Ve, to create The Universe (Yggdrasil).

    Do I take this literally? No. Do I think that there's any scientific weight to this piece of Lore? Probably not. Do I think that this story tells a cosmological and spiritual truth? Yes. Opposites, fire and ice for example, can come together and create something which can be worked with (in this case, by Odin and his brothers). All that said, scientifically speaking, The Big Bang is probably the way to go.

    Another example, hopefully a myth you know better, how Perseus had slain the gorgon Medusa. It reads that to slay her, Perseus had to consult three old witches sharing one eyeball, borrow the flying sandles of Hermes and a pack from the Hesperides (suggested by Athena), use his shield to see her, lest he look at the monster in the eye and be turned to stone, and cut off her head so that he could turn his mother's jerk fiancé into stone.

    Did all of this REALLY happen? No. But what does this mean? Perseus risked his life and worked through all of his endeavors were to protect his mother, and through it he had the help of the gods. What this story means is that if one has an ethical intention, the gods will assist in your trials, even when against a psycho snake woman ready to petrify you.

    "What exactly is it that you believe?"

    This is a simply question demanding a complicated answer, but I shall try my best.

    There are many terms for the religion regarding the Nordic gods. Asatru (Icelandic for "faith in the gods"), Heathenry, Heathenism, Germanic Polytheism, Nordic Polytheism, Germanic Paganism and many more which are specific to a Germanic tribe such as Saxon Neopaganism or Teutonic Polytheism. For simplicity sake, I will refer to all of these by the term "Germanic Polytheism" and "Heathenry" and the followers as "Heathens".

    Germanic Polytheism is a self explanatory term. Germanic means being or of relating to the cultures of Northern European peoples linguistically, ethnically and culturally descended from the Proto-Germanic peoples (Including Scandinavians, mainland peoples of Germania or Gaul, Anglos, Saxons and Jutes in England, Denmark and The Goths in Poland). Polytheism means the belief and worship of multiple deities. Therefore, Germanic Polytheism is the worship of many deities being or of relating to the Germanic Northern European culture.

    There are three main religious focal points of divinities in heathenry: Ancestors, Nature and The Divine.

    Ancestors are highly honored in Heathenry, and are sometimes regarded as minor deities. Many people have varying beliefs about the afterlife and ancestors, but generally they are fully capable of interacting with us and there are gods connected to them or some of their realms, as well as some of the darker aspects of the cosmos. The worship of these gods in considered taboo by some while it isn't thought of twice by others. These deities firstly include Hella and Modgud (although they are increasingly being seen as semi benevolent goddesses of the ancestors) down to less popular entities such as Loki, Jormungand, Fenrir, Angrboda and various giants (also called Jotunnar) who are completely shunned in extreme cases.

    The Land is also honored in Heathenry. The Land Spirits (Called "Landvaettir" or "Land Wights") are often given offerings to, especially if someone is outdoors or moving into a new home. A land spirit which has had his or her territory built over by a house is called a House Wight, and you might see Heathens try to maintain good relationship with house wights.

    There is another group of gods connected to the Land, called the Vanir. These are deities of fertility, agriculture, Nature and magick. They include Frey, Freyja, Njord, Nerthus and sometimes Ostara. There are also two groups of spirits which can be grouped in the Land focal point, Alfar, or Elves, and the Dvergar, or Dwarves. The Dwarves aren't silly miniature people as seen on The Hobbit, and Elves aren't the cute arctic helpers for Santa Claus. Dwarves are entities of craftsmanship and metalwork. They create the magickal weapons for the gods, such as Thor's Hammer or Odin's Spear. Elves are entities of beauty, magick and sexuality. Frey, a Van god, is considered to be the ruler of the realm of the Elves "Alfheim".

    The last focal point of Heathenry is The Divine. These divinities would be the Aesir. These are gods of war, civilization and order. These deities include the most popular Thor and Odin, along with Tyr, Sif, Frigg and Heimdall as well as many many others. These deities are considered the youngest gods, while the Vanir are considered the eldest. These deities are also the overseers of the Cosmos. Thor is the protector of Midgard while Odin can see all things from his throne in Valhalla. Tyr resides in the North Star ready to give protection wherever he sees fit.

    How we honor or gods and the spirits varies also. Some common group rituals you'll find are Blot and Symble.

    "Blot" means blood, referring to sacrifice. Sacrificial offerings aren't common anymore, but if you look hard enough, you'll find them. What's more common are food offerings or, more commonly, libations of alcohol (usually mead or beer). The alcohol is placed in a drinking horn, charged with the energy of the group and poured as an offering to whatever Holy Power the group is worshipping, whether it be a god, ancestor or wight.

    Symble means "feast". The ritual practiced today are drinking rounds or alcohol, usually again mead or beer. The drink is poured into the horn, some is given as a libation, and the drinking horn is passed around as everyone makes a toast. The first round is typically for deities, second is for ancestors and third is oaths, boasts and toasts (where someone can brag on something or someone, even oneself "I lost 10 pounds!" "Hail weight loss!")

    Privately these rituals aren't practical, as they're very social rituals. In private, someone will typically have an altar with various items on it. Mine has a black drinking horn with red design, black rune stones with red script for divination, an offering glass, a red candle, and a black and red altar cloth (woohoo color coordination xD). I also have sanitary, disposable lancets underneath the altar because I do give a couple drops of my blood when I'm called to give it, which is the proper way to give blood offerings.
     
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