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Mussolini was not a war criminal!

Spiderman

Veteran Member
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Fascism is intrinsically spiritual and Religious where Democracy is not. Fascism is the most intrinsically religious and spiritual form of government I know to exist, which is my attraction to it.

Mussolini was executed in cold blood without trial. Most Germans and Japanese had trials. The Allies had a list of war criminals and Mussolini was not on it.

Napoleon was put into exile, escaped, killed some more, then was put back into exile, and he was worse than Mussolini.

First off, Mussolini's favorite person in History was Saint Francis of Assissi, and it was Mussolini who got the Pope to declare Saint Francis to be the patron Saint of Italy. Gandhi showed up half-naked with a goat, and the Duce smiled at him like a giddy child and later declared that Gandhi made a greater impression on him than any other visitor. How could such a man who values such peaceful people be entirely bad? Gandhi praised the Duce as well. Tagore was criticized for being a lover of peace yet "Singing the praises of Mussolini", and he described Fascist Italy as passionate like flames of fire, the Duce as a very kind hospitable man who had read all of his writings that were translated into Italian, and said he was in debt to the Duce. Winston Churchhill spoke highly of him and he was the Pope's right hand man who gave the Church the Independent Vatican City state that exists today.


I told my Dad Rachel Mussolini, his wife, who was born my birthday, April 11, is my favorite female of modern time, my favorite author of modern time, and we see eye to eye on everything. My Dad said, "maybe that's a sign you are Mussolini's b****." I told him "Well, yes, in the sense that I look to him as a strong Father figure to show me what it is to be a man, something I needed but never had from you."

Trust me, I love Gandhi and I chose Saint Francis of Assissi as my confirmation name and hate violence and bullying. I would not love and exalt Mussolini if he was a sociopath or had no charity in his heart.

Rachel Mussolini is an awesome woman, hated war, is highly critical of her husband, was a female version of James Bond, was charitable, compassionate, poor in spirit, meek, humble, and who doesn't cover for Mussolini's faults, who fought with him on so many issues, but knew him since he was 7, and is the most trustworthy person regarding who he was. She vents about how much some of Mussolini's choices sometimes broke her heart or angered her. He was a tough guy, a street fighter, and got bloody in sword duels for fun, got in lots of physical fights beginning as a child, but was also deeply compassionate. a lover of poetry, a history nerd, an eloquent writer, and the most lenient, fun, down-to-earth, sensitive, thoughtful, noble, benevolent Dictator I have ever heard of in the history of Humankind.

Rachel Mussolini actually encouraged her husband to be more stern, for he wasn't court martialing people for even what America would consider court martial offenses. She wanted to be hidden from the public so that no one would recognize her and she could be his secret agent, finding out what his leaders were doing and getting the bad ones busted. Mussolini usually just didn't take serious the warnings until it was too late or assigned them to different posts and corrected them for offenses Stalin would have killed them for. He trusted people to the point of naivete when his wife, as his secret service agent, found out the king, many people that served him for up to 20 years even, and countless others, were just pretending to be his friends.

Men were jealous of the Duce for obvious reasons and so many were his friends for selfish reasons and betrayed him as soon as it became convenient to. They also placed on him impossible expectations. Some actually resented how kind and hospitable he was, how much he promoted Catholicism or sacrosanct customs that were regarded as too important or valuable to be interfered with. Some guys didn't like how their wives nearly fainted over him and wrote him romantic letters. He made men feel insecure in their masculinity and intelligence because he outdid them, and jealousy was the cause of the first murder in Scripture, so it isn't surprising he was killed in cold blood, desecrated, urinated on, stoned, and hung upside down by his own people, and was blamed for everything including all kinds of things he wasn't guilty of.

Hitler despised it as a weakness and disappointment that the Duce appeared so tough in his speeches but in person was very compassionate and considerate of others, criticizing him repeatedly for his love for peace, not rounding up the Jews after the alliance, for his many attempts at getting Hitler to change his mind, for warning Hitler that an invasion of Russia was doomed, for stalling Hitler in his annexation of Austria, and invasion of chzecklosovakia.

Rachel explains in her book how her husband did all he could to avoid the war, Hitler's constant psychological war, while at the same time flooded with letters from Germany glorifying each quick victory which was making the Italian people jealous, and there was peer pressure to get Benito to grab some spoils before it was too late. Rachel explains in her book how the French and English drove Italy into Germany's arms as well.


The Italian people were amazed by the German advances and quick victory after quick victory like nothing less than a triumphal march. This had an impact on the Fascist party who thought Mussolini was being a wimp when he could help spread fascism and grab some territory, restoring some of the glories of the Roman Empire.

Some Italians played a guilt trip on Mussolini for not abiding by the “Pact of steel” and not honoring Hitler for his crucial help in the Spanish Civil war and his hate for Communism. Hitler was personally sending constant letters after every victory as well.

There’s something else we can be sure of—whether we go into the war or not, the Germans will occupy Europe. If we’re not there with them, They’ll be able to dictate their conditions to tomorrow’s Europe, and that’ll mean the end of Latin civilization. God is my witness that I have done everything to keep the peace. I can’t let beloved Italy suffer the fate of Poland, Holland, and so many other countries. Hitler will soon be at our gates. –Benito Mussolini

“The army of The Reich are too harsh with the local population. When they forage they raze everything to the ground. The victors should behave humanely toward the inhabitants of conquered countries.” – Benito Mussolini

Italian Fascists displayed wild enthusiasm for the prospect of Hitler getting to grips with Marxism and it looked like certain German victory so Mussolini sided with someone he didn’t like, and it’s obvious why.

Mussolini admired Chamberlain and supported his efforts to keep the peace, but despised how much the leftist French Government was constantly bashing Fascism, and how so many of his enemies fled to France after his rise to power to continue fighting him and making false accusations. When France was so quickly on the verge of surrender, days after the blitz, it looked like Hitler would win the war, and Hitler had bluntly threatened an invasion of Italy if Italy was "not faithful to the pact of steel" by remaining neutral. Mussolini was pale at this point and worried about his children and all Italian children, plus he was human, he wasn't a saint, and was tempted with pride like any other man.

Mussolini loved Austria so much that he declared he would side with England and France if they promptly declared War on Germany if they invaded Austria. He despised the invasion of Poland. When Hitler threatened to invade Czechoslovakia, Mussolini argued with Hitler and begged him not to, postponing the invasion, but only for 24 hours.


Hitler spoiled Mussolini rotten with raw materials and hospitality before Italy entered the war to coax him, made him jealous of the German military machine, and helped him save Spain from Atheist Communism, (keeping prayer in schools, and crushing the spread of Russia's errors, while also trying to appear to be a friend of Christianity which Mussolini valued), so Mussolini made a mistake most men in his position would have made.

especiall in view of this quote from him lol: "Hitler doesn't drink or smoke, neither do I. Stalin and Churchill smoke like chimneys and drink like fish. We haven't a chance of getting on."

He slso saw that he had an opportunity to be Caesar of a restored Catholic resurrection of the Roman Empire, an opportunity to grab land and spoils from a war that looked certain to be a German victory, avoid the horrors of a German invasion of Italy, and uproot his greatest enemy, Communism, as well as be on the right side of the banking war.

I'm not racist, anti-semetic, and am deeply compassionate, and still would have fallen into his errors by entering the war on the wrong side, and am quite certain most men would have in that position, because who wouldn't want to be a 20th century Caesar to restore Rome to her former glory, as well as exalt God, faith, and morals, which were under attack by the greatest atheist Empire and greatest killing machine of all time.
Mussolini also had reason to feel in debt to Hitler for helping him stop Communist take over in Spain and declared that if France and Britain had helped him in the Spanish Civil War, he would have lost a big reason for siding with Hitler.

"I go to meet with Hitler. If all goes well my son, I shall be bringing back a marvelous present for you. You know what? A peaceful world for children to grow up happily in. -Benito Mussolini

Russia's only aim is to export communism. Our only chance of keeping out the Americans and Communists would have been to build a United States of Europe. But we didn't, and it'll be an expensive mistake." -Benito Mussolini

Wars are like avalanches; no one can tell in advance how long they will last or where they will lead. I shall do everything I can to keep this one from spreading. --Mussolini

It will be impossible to not enter the war now, and impossible and dangerous now for me to not go in on the side of Germany. --Benito Mussolini
(to be continued)

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Spiderman

Veteran Member
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Mussolini agreed that fighting the Soviets was noble, but warned Hitler that an invasion of the Soviet Union would be a failure and he should learn from World War 1 and Napoleon's invasion of Russia. He didn't know America would enter the War, and when he entered, he thought all Hitler had left to do was finish off Great Britain, which was already quite defeated and crippled, and knew he would have to enter the war anyway, that Hitler was getting angry at him, that Italy might be next, so wanted to be on the winning side of what he saw would be a "United Europe". Had Hitler heeded Mussolini's advice, the evidence is great in favor of an argument that the axis powers were almost certain to have victory.

He sided with Hitler also because he wanted a Europe that was a united anti-Bolshevik bloc, not because he liked Hitler, and Mussolini resented that he and his dark Mediterranean people weren't part of Hitler's stupid "Master race" idea, and condemned the idea that there was any master race, having fascist Jews as highest members of the fascist party. He eventually caved in to Hitler's demands and I know about the stupid manifesto, but all people make mistakes, especially when in severe crisis. The Prophets in the Old Testament were often no better or even worse, annihilating entire cities.

Mussolini thought maybe the war was an evil that would lead to a greater united more prosperous Europe and less suffering in the end.

Keep in mind that Mussolini is a religious figure who I look to for wisdom and an example of what it is to be a man, and who declared Fascism to be a religion. I believe him to be purified of his defects and errors and a new creation. He is sacred, purified, a prophet, and dear to my heart as a Shinto practitioner, where he is my favorite Kami (All the dead become Kami in Shintoism which means Spirit/Divinity). I've already seen the images of him mutilated and hung upside down so please don't post them.

I totally disagree with his wars of aggression, but can't bear to see a man with so much good qualities be so misunderstood, almost only demonized, and his good deeds forgotten. I think we should look to him for inspiration and learn from his mistakes.. Plus I love his wife. Regarding his defeat and death, Christ was crucified and mutilated too, and Christianity was a tiny sect that was fed to wild animals and tortured to death by Pagan Rome, but that doesn't mean we call Christ a failure.

Each day I march to Capitol Hill in honor of his march on Rome and he and I pray for politicians. That is where I do my fascist studies and pay homage to the spirits of fascists who have gone to their eternal reward. Christ has enough people who love him, so I feel Mussolini needs a follower who isn't some stupid racist skinhead or lover of violence as so many people who claim to be Fascist are, giving him a bad name. Sometimes I bring cardboard with pictures of the Duce taped to it and ask people if they have a minute for Mussolini. One girl told me she was going to pepper spray me hahaha, the security don't like me, and when I walked into one of the chambers during a session to preach Mussolini's Gospel, they grabbed me and dragged me out...hahaha...All for the Duce!.

He got me going back to daily mass and receiving Holy communion for his intentions, and greatly motivated me to be a self-disciplined man. The Doctrine of Fascism is peaceful, humane, rational, religious, ingenius, healthy, and not racist. Try reading it before you bash fascism.

Why look to Mussolini?

What draws me to Mussolini is his strength, his courage, and his ability to be a good writer, nerd, politician, and yet a strong physical fighter as well. Usually nerds can't knock their enemies out like he could, so of course I would like to be that gifted. I like how he didn't ask Rachel to Marry him as a teenager but told her they would be married, snatching her from the arms of another man, dragging her home, pulling a gun on her mother when she threatened to call the police and how they got engaged at that moment. It's not nice but still classic and entertaining. Plus he was young. That's also cool that before his rise to power he was above the law and seized newspaper facilities he didn't like illegally, and when the cops were called, they liked him too much to arrest him.

It's fascinating that Mussolini peacefully got a first-world Democracy to override the Prime minister's declaration of a state of siege and ask him to step down when the police and military could have made short work of Fascist black shirt militia. That would be like a person so amazing that they march on Washington DC, and Trump steps down, so they become youngest president in American History to replace the constitution with their Doctrine, and the people like the guy so much that they let him dismantle Democracy and replace it with his idea, and then the economy booms, the trains run on time, more jobs are created, and farmers get free land. Such a person is so gifted they have license to be narcissistic and feel above others, if you ask me.

I like how in Fascist Italy there was pornography ban, kids could play outside without any worries, children carried guns and there were no school shootings, the patriotism was unprecedented, the schools prayerful, the government spiritual, the suicide rate low, the crime rate low, the unwanted pregnancy rate almost non-existent, I like the uniforms, the parades, the fascist fervor, the hysteria, the unity, and like how originally the people were so in love with him that he didn't need a secret police because after becoming prime minister, everyone and their mamma seemed to beat up the socialists, communists, and anti-fascists, and how Mussolini punished fascists for torturing his enemies and provided for the families of one of the guys who shot at him, feeling sorry for the pale trembling man when he saw him, and the way he condemned Nazi treatment of enemies after victory.
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LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Hmm... do you know the word "deontology"? Sounds like it might have an use in describing the ideals of fascism.
 

epronovost

Well-Known Member
Out of sheer morbid curiosity, what do you think about Mussolini's war crimes during his conquest of Ethiopia, a pure war of aggression with a colonialist and prestige design. Mussolini ordered the purchase and use of gaz round ammunition against Ethiopians.

Also I find it strange that you would consider fascism the most spiritual of all mode of governance considering that Mussolini himself declared himself an atheist and was known for his anti-clericalism. His disgust and contempt for the Catholic Church was particularly vehement. He was also a Nietzschean.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Out of sheer morbid curiosity, what do you think about Mussolini's war crimes during his conquest of Ethiopia, a pure war of aggression with a colonialist and prestige design. Mussolini ordered the purchase and use of gaz round ammunition against Ethiopians.

Also I find it strange that you would consider fascism the most spiritual of all mode of governance considering that Mussolini himself declared himself an atheist and was known for his anti-clericalism. His disgust and contempt for the Catholic Church was particularly vehement. He was also a Nietzschean.
His official mistress at that time was a Jewess, Marghetita Sarfatti. When the racial laws against Jews were promulgated, he got her fake documents and made her migrate to Argentina
 

epronovost

Well-Known Member
His official mistress at that time was a Jewess, Marghetita Sarfatti. When the racial laws against Jews were promulgated, he got her fake documents and made her migrate to Argentina

We can at least give that to Mussolini, he wasn't antisemite and mostly promulgated racial laws in Italy to appease Hitler and maintain his help and support. Of course, he was the kind of man who didn't mind sending Italian Jews to the slaughterhouse to sere his political ambition, but it wasn't out of hatred, but out of political conveniance. That makes him a different sort of monster. I'll late others choose what kind of monster they prefer.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
We can at least give that to Mussolini, he wasn't antisemite and mostly promulgated racial laws in Italy to appease Hitler and maintain his help and support. Of course, he was the kind of man who didn't mind sending Italian Jews to the slaughterhouse to sere his political ambition, but it wasn't out of hatred, but out of political conveniance. That makes him a different sort of monster. I'll late others choose what kind of monster they prefer.
Not a single Jew was deported before 1943.
In 1943 Mussolini was arrested by the king and the Nazis occupied Italy starting deporting Jews.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
A bit savage that another of his mistresses was killed alongside him and their bodies subjected to the same brutal treatment. :oops:
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
Out of sheer morbid curiosity, what do you think about Mussolini's war crimes during his conquest of Ethiopia, a pure war of aggression with a colonialist and prestige design. Mussolini ordered the purchase and use of gaz round ammunition against Ethiopians.

Also I find it strange that you would consider fascism the most spiritual of all mode of governance considering that Mussolini himself declared himself an atheist and was known for his anti-clericalism. His disgust and contempt for the Catholic Church was particularly vehement. He was also a Nietzschean.
@Laika @ChristineM and @LuisDantas apparently know nothing about this topic or they would not have rated such a flawed post "Winner". Your knowledge shows clear ignorance that is strangely prevalent. What you said was only true for a time. Mussolini was an atheist who hated Catholicism when young, especially as a socialist like his anti-Catholic Father, and later learned to love Catholicism like his Mother, and his Doctrine of Fascism says that Fascists have a duty to defend Catholicism when it is under attack by communists or others. Mussolini created the Independent Vatican city state and did more to promote Catholicism in Italy than any Saint did, bringing religious fervor to an Italy which had grown Lukewarm and he gave enormous amounts of money to the Church and built countless Churches, declaring it to be asinine for Italians to not be proud of the Catholic Church and practice Catholicism.

Mussolini believed wars of aggression were okay for Italy as long as they relieved suffering and made an area less impoverished, and improved the quality of life in the end, and Ethiopia was so full of poor leadership that he thought he could do a better job, creating less suffering and better use of Ethiopia's resources. Another justification for the attack was an incident during December 1934, between Italian and Abyssinian troops at the Wal-Wal Oasis on the border between Abyssinian Somaliland, where 200 soldiers lost their lives. Both parties were exonerated in the incident, much to the disgust of Mussolini, as he felt Abyssinia should have been held accountable for the incident.

Mussolini saw it as an opportunity to provide land for unemployed Italians and also acquire more mineral resources to fight off the effects of the Great Depression.

Mussolini wanted to compete with other European Empires and was under pressure from Italians to attack Ethiopia because of a previous war where Ethiopia defeated Italy. Mussolini also believed that creating a 20th century Roman Empire would in the end bring more joy and less suffering to the people and better uproot communism. The use of gas was to bring quick victory, which it did, and no worse than allied bombings of Germany or the use of Nukes on Japan. After the war, Mussolini was hoping Ethiopia would be governed better and there be less suffering. The Solomonic dynasty of the Ethiopian Empire was very corrupt and terrible at governing the lands of the Ethiopian Empire.

Mussolini did not believe the Solomonic dynasty really descended from Solomon of Israel or existed during 10th century BC as they claimed, and thought it was one big fairy tale and scam with no historical evidence to back up the claims, so resented them, and the dynasty ran the country poorly, committed much violence in parts of modern-day Sudan and South Sudan, and coastal areas of the Red Sea and Gulf of Aden which Mussolini thought they should be held accountable for, and wished to put an end to a ridiculous dynasty that cost a lot of Italian lives as well as killing an Italian officer shortly before the invasion.

Claimants to the throne in Ethiopia often fought each other, causing what Mussolini believed would overall cause more bloodshed than if they were part of an Italian Empire.

These weren't reasons for the war, but Mussolini also was mystified by Ethiopia for it's claim to have the original Ark of the covenant and he wanted the ark to be in his territory if the claim were true, and he loved the Lion of Judah, being a Leo himself, loving the Lion version of Christ, and being famous for the quote that it's better to be a Lion for one day than a lamb for 100 years, he liked the Lion on the Ethiopian flag, was interested in it's history, and thought the land to be sacred.
 
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Spiderman

Veteran Member
Also, when the peaceful Tagore was criticized for singing the praises of Mussolini he said, "every Italian I spoke with says the conditions of living are far better under Fascism than Democracy and they love their leader. Why should I not stand in admiration".
 
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Spiderman

Veteran Member
I would not defend Mussolini if he were a lover of violence, if he were racist, if he had no charity,....Hell no! and Rachel was a sweet, humble, prayerful, gentle, lowly peasant girl with values especially in the areas of charity, according to what people say of her and her writing style shows this. I believe her over anyone because she knew him since he was 7.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
It's My Birthday!
@Laika @ChristineM and @LuisDantas apparently know nothing about this topic or they would not have rated such a flawed post "Winner". Your knowledge shows clear ignorance that is strangely prevalent. What you said was only true for a time. Mussolini was an atheist who hated Catholicism when young, especially as a socialist like his anti-Catholic Father, and later learned to love Catholicism like his Mother, and his Doctrine of Fascism says that Fascists have a duty to defend Catholicism when it is under attack by communists or others. Mussolini created the Independent Vatican city state and did more to promote Catholicism in Italy than any Saint did, bringing religious fervor to an Italy which had grown Lukewarm and he gave enormous amounts of money to the Church and built countless Churches, declaring it to be asinine for Italians to not be proud of the Catholic Church and practice Catholicism.

Mussolini believed wars of aggression were okay for Italy as long as they relieved suffering and made an area less impoverished, and improved the quality of life in the end, and Ethiopia was so full of poor leadership that he thought he could do a better job, creating less suffering and better use of Ethiopia's resources. Another justification for the attack was an incident during December 1934, between Italian and Abyssinian troops at the Wal-Wal Oasis on the border between Abyssinian Somaliland, where 200 soldiers lost their lives. Both parties were exonerated in the incident, much to the disgust of Mussolini, as he felt Abyssinia should have been held accountable for the incident.

Mussolini saw it as an opportunity to provide land for unemployed Italians and also acquire more mineral resources to fight off the effects of the Great Depression.

Mussolini wanted to compete with other European Empires and was under pressure from Italians to attack Ethiopia because of a previous war where Ethiopia defeated Italy. Mussolini also believed that creating a 20th century Roman Empire would in the end bring more joy and less suffering to the people and better uproot communism. The use of gas was to bring quick victory, which it did, and no worse than allied bombings of Germany or the use of Nukes on Japan. After the war, Mussolini was hoping Ethiopia would be governed better and there be less suffering. The Solomonic dynasty of the Ethiopian Empire was very corrupt and terrible at governing the lands of the Ethiopian Empire.

Mussolini did not believe the Solomonic dynasty really descended from Solomon of Israel or existed during 10th century BC as they claimed, and thought it was one big fairy tale and scam with no historical evidence to back up the claims, so resented them, and the dynasty ran the country poorly, committed much violence in parts of modern-day Sudan and South Sudan, and coastal areas of the Red Sea and Gulf of Aden which Mussolini thought they should be held accountable for, and wished to put an end to a ridiculous dynasty that cost a lot of Italian lives as well as killing an Italian officer shortly before the invasion.

Claimants to the throne in Ethiopia often fought each other, causing what Mussolini believed would overall cause more bloodshed than if they were part of an Italian Empire.

These weren't reasons for the war, but Mussolini also was mystified by Ethiopia for it's claim to have the original Ark of the covenant and he wanted the ark to be in his territory if the claim were true, and he loved the Lion of Judah, being a Leo himself, loving the Lion version of Christ, and being famous for the quote that it's better to be a Lion for one day than a lamb for 100 years, he liked the Lion on the Ethiopian flag, was interested in it's history, and thought the land to be sacred.

Actually it seems like you, and italy who are denying the facts, i posted a link, there are many more. So are you saying this dictator did not instruct his troops to commit atrosities? Or are you saying he did not know what his troops were doing. In either case it makes him an incompetent leader.
 

Spiderman

Veteran Member
Actually it seems like you, and italy who are denying the facts, i posted a link, there are many more. So are you saying this dictator did not instruct his troops to commit atrosities? Or are you saying he did not know what his troops were doing. In either case it makes him an incompetent leader.
Mussolini did everything he could to keep the peace and stop world war 2, and regarding Ethiopia he was trying to relieve suffering and multiple other reasons. Atrocities are committed by every side in every war as a means of winning.

His humble wife Rachel is the kindest, sweetest, most simple person out there who knew him well, and I read her writings and trust her far more than your links. There are links that also say Mussolini bragged about raping a virgin, called peace a catastrophe, and all kinds of quotes that are not his. After reading a book by Rachel, a tender mother without ill will or desire for anyone to suffer, who hates war, I trust her over the Internet. She knew the man more than anyone else, and knew him since he was 7. The people that wrote the history were the people that hung him upside down and urinated on him.

Communists love to create false news. It's all North Korea gets.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
It's My Birthday!
Mussolini did everything he could to keep the peace and stop world war 2, and regarding Ethiopia he was trying to relieve suffering and multiple other reasons. Atrocities are committed by every side in every war as a means of winning.

His humble wife Rachel is the kindest, sweetest, most simple person out there who knew him well, and I read her writings and trust her far more than your links. There are links that also say Mussolini bragged about raping a virgin, called peace a catastrophe, and all kinds of quotes that are not his. After reading a book by Rachel, a tender mother without ill will or desire for anyone to suffer, who hates war, I trust her over the Internet. She knew the man more than anyone else, and knew him since he was 7. The people that wrote the history were the people that hung him upside down and urinated on him.

Communists love to create false news. It's all North Korea gets.

Do you sre saying he was incompetent, fair enough.
 
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