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Featured Muslim views on Jesus

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Prometheus85, Sep 15, 2019.

  1. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    Better start with the Qur'an with commentary. Read it 5 times with a dictionary and you're getting started.
     
  2. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    LOL. ¨I and the Father are one¨, ¨if you have seen me, you have seem the Father¨, "no man comes to the Father, but by me¨, ¨ before Abraham was, I am¨
     
  3. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    Great reason for not reading the Qur'an. I have difficulty imagining any Deaf person trying to all the way through.
     
  4. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    Well then your attempt to collect information can already be considered to have failed. :shrug:
     
  5. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    Guess you won't be seeing me in a mosque near you anytime soon, eh?
     
  6. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
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    How is that different from not worshipping the same God?
     
  7. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    Don't change the topic. You lied. Wait - you're a Christian, aren't you?
     
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  8. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
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    Hello.

    Muslims believe in the same God as Jews and Christians.

    They believe Jesus was a Prophet if God and Jesus says that Himself in the Bible. Muslims believe in the Gospels and Torah as the Word of God.

    They do not believe that Jesus was the physical son of God and the Bible doesn’t say He is. In the Bible Son if God us a title.

    It is said in Romans 8:14

    For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.

    So even according to the Bible Son if God is a spiritual station not a physical thing.

    In this respect Muslims understand the true station of Christ more accurately than professed Christians.

    To become a Muslim one MUST also accept Jesus and all the Biblical Prophets, the Gospels and Torah.

    In this respect through Prophet Muhammad billions of people who otherwise would not have accepted Jesus came to believe in Him. So the greatest Christian preacher really in history was Muhammad not Christians. There are over 1.6 billion people who accept Jesus now thanks to Muhammad that Christians did not convert.
     
  9. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    Christians think about Jesus a few different ways. Some have a lot more overlap with Muslims than others do. Others overlap more with Muslims in terms of how they relate to God. Many consider God and Jesus to be interchangeable in prayers and speech. This is absolutely not Ok to Muslims. Some Christians think of Jesus like he is God compressed into a man. Muslims find this appalling. Some Christians believe Jesus is a man touched by God like any other man can be. Some believe he is an angel. There is a spectrum in between of different relationships with Jesus.

    Muslims have a very authoritative God who sends wisdom in book form and through a representative speaker who has absolute authority. Christians believe in submitting to governmental authority and also to God's authority and only a minority believe the government should be religious based. Muslims overwhelmingly believe that the government should be religious guided, have ideas from Islam enshrined in government including criminal law, finance and in other aspects of government and that the religion should be the guide for the government. There are many political contests about it around the world.

    It is a little hard to say where Christians today have much common ground with Muslims. Muslims have an idea about worship which is foreign to liturgical worship and is more in line with evangelical style worship than with liturgical. Muslims say worship involves obeisance to God alone and not through bowing to one another serving one another. To a Muslim that is not worship while to a Christian it can be or not depending upon their denomination. You and I bowing to each other is not considered worshiping God in Islam and could be construed as idolatry, but Muslims all bow in the same direction frequently together and the bowing and kneeling are important. Some Christians believe that worship rises to God directionally similar to Muslims who pray facing specific directions.
    Christians run on a spectrum and consider God to be in each other or mostly up in heaven or in some other location and direct their worship that direction, but this varies from church to church. In addition some Christians worship with Jesus while others direct their worship towards Jesus. Again, Muslims find this unacceptable.
     
  10. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    On behalf of all of us ignorant Christians, thanks for trying to show us your version of unification of all religions. I suspect that not only have you failed to nudge even the dumbest Christian a little closer to Islam or to Muslims, you've managed to annoy a couple of us and distance us even further from your Baha'i beliefs. Well done. I look forward to seeing how well you progress in unifying Hindus, Buddhists, traditional Jews and Muslims.

    Something tells me that you're in for a big surprise.
     
  11. Firemorphic

    Firemorphic Activist Membrane

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    It's hardly of any value when a Christian says it (because frankly the ones that do don't think about it very clearly).

    Maybe Protestants created a new 'God' when they split from Catholics? Maybe Catholics and Eastern Orthodox worship different "Gods" too? Maybe Orthodox Jews and Hasidic Jews worship different "Gods" too? Maybe Sunni and Shia worship different "Gods" too?

    At some time you've got to notice how flawed that polemic is, it just amounts to "I have a smaller brain than [other group]", gets nowhere and invalidates one's very supposed understanding of "God" to begin with.

    And it also implies that the word itself that you use is your "god". (including the english word itself). It's just childish, plain and simple.

    Correct. But we don't hold a position of contempt towards Christians despite this.

    Between a Jew, Christian, Muslim, Atheist and a Buddhist is a lot of ground to think about these things.
     
  12. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

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    upload_2019-9-16_12-50-43.jpeg
    Christians do not worship the same God.
    Majority of Christian denominations worship a 3-in-1 God
    Some worship a 2-in-1 God
    Others worship a trio of Godhead
    Even weirder, some worship that Jesus is the Father and the Holy Spirit
    And the twists does not end there

    upload_2019-9-16_12-51-8.jpeg
    And it is not a surprise that Muslims do not worship the same God as the Christians
    And as well as the Hindus who believe there are 300,000,000 Gods
    And the Buddhist who do not believe there is such thing as a God

    But there is a God alright and there are true worshipers of the only true God.
    This is what Jesus said as recorded in the Bible:

    John 4:23-24 New International Version (NIV)
    Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

    [​IMG]

    They call him ʿĪsā ibn Maryam (Arabic: عيسى بن مريم‎, lit. 'Jesus, son of Mary')
    They say the crucifixion, death and resurrection is not believed to have occurred
    They say that Jesus did not physically die, but was instead raised alive to heaven
    Jesus in Islam - Wikipedia


    Ecclesiastes 7:29 New International Version (NIV)

    This only have I found:
    God created mankind upright,
    but they have gone in search of many schemes.”
     
  13. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    If we look at ancient tribal middle eastern cultures, they all had different ideas of the Divine Council, some saw it as a pantheon of demigods, and some as archangels...

    Muhammad tried to correct them to Monotheism, and instructs in the Quran to only worship the source of reality Allah, as it creates everything, therefore the angels, and prophets are all Allah's creations anyway.

    Yeshua tried to correct the Jews back to El Elyon (God Most High), which is Ala ilah in Arabic.

    The Jews no longer understood Yeshua Elohim's father is El (the Source of our reality)...

    Take into account 'when Yeshua prayed, "Eli, Eli" (My God), some thought he spoke of Elijah' (Matthew 27:46-47), which shows people had already forgotten 'that El is not like the Elohim' (Isaiah 46:9Deuteronomy 32:7-9).

    This is where people thought Yeshua was claiming himself to be God, as he said he fulfilled prophecy of being a Eloh (Divine Being).
    The promise given is that those who are worthy will be call children of God (El) again...

    Many Muslims I've spoken to, can accept we're all Allah's creation; so we can see it as all of our parent, like in code...

    Yet when people start talking about someone being biologically a child of God, and God needing to be a human being to have sex with humans; Muslims defend that Allah is beyond the reality, that it creates.

    The Quran makes clear we are not to make partners with Allah, Yeshua is the word of God & Messiah in the Quran, not some part of a Trinity.

    The problem comes from John, Paul, and Simon building their Christian ministries on 'jesus' being the son of God, and as Yeshua pointed out straight after calling "Simon the stone (petros) satan, that he followed the ways of man more than God" (Matthew 16:13-23).

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  14. Pastek

    Pastek Sunni muslim

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    "Reading 5 times the Quran with a dictionary .. " :rolleyes:

    Don't listen to him. That doesn't make any sense.
     
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  15. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    I am calm, muslims worship the abrahamic god whether you like it or not. They consider jesus a holy prophet whether you like it or not, comparing holy books is a futile exercise, different religions eh!

    Islam is an abrahamic religion for the simple reason they worship the abrahamic god.

    God in Abrahamic religions - Wikipedia

    You invited me to do nothing, @Prometheus85 asked two questions, i answered from my knowledge of having several muslim friends and discussing their faith.

    You jumped in with with a rather aggressive
    And a load of irrelevant bull from the bible?
     
  16. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Yea they do

    Different religions, different flavours of belief using same ingredients. Sorry you dont like the worlds second largest religion but consider, there is precisely as much evidence for the muslim faith as for the christian faith, the clue is in the word faith... I.e. zilch
     
  17. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    What do you mean?
     
  18. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    Evidence is irrelevant. We aren´t talking about evidence, we are talking about beliefs, doctrine.

    The Christian God is triune, the Islamic God is not. The Christian God was incarnated on earth,
    Allah was not.

    They cannot be the same.
     
  19. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    Not as futile as futile as changing your mind. Bye bye.
     
  20. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Can too, get over yourself

    Islam worships the abrahamic god.

    Unless you can drop your foot stomping incredulity and actually provid evidence
     
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