Well of course you have to establish your own credibility first, otherwise you have no leg to stand on. Why should people listen to you, when all sorts of people make such claims? Gotta do some groundwork first.
Well that just seems condescending.
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Musings on Hebrew Views About Yeshua
- Thread starter wizanda
- Start date
Well of course you have to establish your own credibility first, otherwise you have no leg to stand on. Why should people listen to you, when all sorts of people make such claims? Gotta do some groundwork first.
Well that just seems condescending.
Yeah was just about to edit it, and remove the word 'angels', as decided didn't like that aspect...
We're all on the same level really, and there are many angels down here, who don't like the evil religious dogma, and then many who don't notice...
This is the point in the Bed of Adultery (Isaiah 28:9-21, Revelation 2:22); it is to catch out those who jumped to the occasion to do evil, and don't notice.
Did you read the texts posted from the Bible, the son of man comes as a thief before the day to catch out those that are naked in their understanding; yet offering clothes to those who listen.
Because of the textual understanding, and objective evidence within the text...
Could go into detail of showing my name in most religions, explain prophecies I fulfill; yet people can claim that is all subjective...
Plus who wants them to accept me, if they just accepted what the text stated to begin with that would be a start.
Like your not understanding the prophetic implications from multiple angles: so along comes the son of God who gets killed by the demons as a sin offering, where they drink his blood, so a time of ungodliness is established, where we can catch out the demons who are blood thirsty in a large Snare, and then remove them all with fire.
Now you're saying go make friends with the demons, and get them to like you; so we can explain a complex algorithm designed to catch them all out for being hypocritical bigots who don't pay attention properly.
In my opinion.
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Yeah was just about to edit it, and remove the word 'angels', as decided didn't like that aspect...
We're all on the same level really, and there are many angels down here, who don't like the evil religious dogma, and then many who don't notice...
This is the point in the Bed of Adultery (Isaiah 28:9-21, Revelation 2:22); it is to catch out those who jumped to the occasion to do evil, and don't notice.
Did you read the texts posted from the Bible, the son of man comes as a thief before the day to catch out those that are naked in their understanding; yet offering clothes to those who listen.
Because of the textual understanding, and objective evidence within the text...
Could go into detail of showing my name in most religions, explain prophecies I fulfill; yet people can claim that is all subjective...
Plus who wants them to accept me, if they just accepted what the text stated to begin with that would be a start.
Like your not understanding the prophetic implications from multiple angles: so along comes the son of God who gets killed by the demons as a sin offering, where they drink his blood, so a time of ungodliness is established, where we can catch out the demons who are blood thirsty in a large Snare, and then remove them all with fire.
Now you're saying go make friends with the demons, and get them to like you; so we can explain a complex algorithm designed to catch them all out for being hypocritical bigots who don't pay attention properly.
In my opinion.
So then why teach at all, if everyone "down here" are demons?
And also, I don't see why you're making such a big deal out of texts. Again, a Protestant thing.
Because this is the point in the religious texts, here is down near Hell, and Arch Angels have incarnated down here to educate everyone...
Yet the people down here, would rather follow their leaders who tell them pleasant things; than accept they've got work to do to become better spiritually.
Because the text is there to substantiate prophecies, proves divine interaction, and through the contradictions educates people to be enlightened.
Without the texts to substantiate a case, there is no evidence to show people they are hypocritical; nothing for them to recognize the errors of their own comprehension, etc.
Can you explain what you mean by this, as i don't really study presuppositions of denominations, so don't fully understand the contexts?
In my opinion.
Well certainly you won't reach anybody with that attitude. Plenty of people do follow genuine spiritual leaders.
Because the text is there to substantiate prophecies, proves divine interaction, and through the contradictions educates people to be enlightened.
Without the texts to substantiate a case, there is no evidence to show people they are hypocritical; nothing for them to recognize the errors of their own comprehension, etc.
Can you explain what you mean by this, as i don't really study presuppositions of denominations, so don't fully understand the contexts?
In my opinion.
Well I'll answer altogether - this reliance on texts for authority is by no means universal. To rely on them as you seem to be doing here is mostly a trait of two traditions - Protestant Christianity and Orthodox Islam. It doesn't seem necessarily to me at all to be honest, especially as most of the world dispenses with it and still has flourishing spiritual traditions.
I certainly don't agree that one can't show people anything spiritually unless you use religious texts. You yourself acknowledge that all texts have undergone, at the least, human interpolation, I believe.
The text proves we're in a world of hypocrites, who go opposite to what they're taught, and thus what is the point in teaching them spiritual things?
It is like trying to convert demons to enlightenment; when we've already got enough who've decided to go the right way.
Unfortunately that is a problem as well, the Bible is looking specifically for enlightened leaders, for a time where everyone will know God and be infinite, thus we don't need followers.
Theology is so advanced compared to many of the world texts; the texts are just a way to prove who the hypocritical bigots are.
Personally don't rely on them, the prophetic eschatology globally match what i was told...
Whereas Christianity and Islam have been purposely set up, and if they read all the texts they'd see this blatantly; thus proving why we should pay attention to what has been put before us to test us.
The world doesn't recognize here is near Hell, and that 'I Am' consciousness is to be removed, instead it has become the main spiritual view point down near Hell, all the demons think that they're god.
Personally respect what different enlightened individuals have taught us; yet most of it has only given us ways to express what others believe...
Well aware it isn't the best method of instruction, as language its self becomes ambiguous without the color of an enlightened mind expressing its truths.
In my opinion.
The text proves we're in a world of hypocrites, who go opposite to what they're taught, and thus what is the point in teaching them spiritual things?
It is like trying to convert demons to enlightenment; when we've already got enough who've decided to go the right way.
Unfortunately that is a problem as well, the Bible is looking specifically for enlightened leaders, for a time where everyone will know God and be infinite, thus we don't need followers.
Theology is so advanced compared to many of the world texts; the texts are just a way to prove who the hypocritical bigots are.
Personally don't rely on them, the prophetic eschatology globally match what i was told...
Whereas Christianity and Islam have been purposely set up, and if they read all the texts they'd see this blatantly; thus proving why we should pay attention to what has been put before us to test us.
The world doesn't recognize here is near Hell, and that 'I Am' consciousness is to be removed, instead it has become the main spiritual view point down near Hell, all the demons think that they're god.
Personally respect what different enlightened individuals have taught us; yet most of it has only given us ways to express what others believe...
Well aware it isn't the best method of instruction, as language its self becomes ambiguous without the color of an enlightened mind expressing its truths.
In my opinion.
OK, so, how exactly do texts show that people are hypocrites?
Can explain the other religious texts as well; the Biblical reason is claiming to follow some 'genuine spiritual leader', then doing the exact opposite by following someone who contradicts everything they've taught, and then trying to follow both at the same time, is the definition of hypocrisy...
So for instance Yeshua challenged the Sanhedrin for murdering the prophets as atoning sacrifices in Matthew 23:27-38, Mark 7:1-13, and the Parable of the Wicked Husbandman (Matthew 21:33-46, Mark 12:1-12, and Luke 20:9-19)....
So then to follow that Yeshua came to die as an atoning sacrifice, as John, Paul, and Simon taught it, is blatant hypocrisy, and was prophesied to happen.
Many people follow what they think are requirements to gain reward, and not really go the extra mile by going further then their leader showed...
This is why Yeshua was a Snare to catch out mankind, and not giving out free salvation; as this had already been seen multiple times in religious culture...
So instead it is all the opposite to see who is paying attention, and most have already failed...
Those chosen have been removed from this reality (Revelation 6:9-11), and shall return at the Age of Enlightenment.
In my opinion.
Can explain the other religious texts as well; the Biblical reason is claiming to follow some 'genuine spiritual leader', then doing the exact opposite by following someone who contradicts everything they've taught, and then trying to follow both at the same time, is the definition of hypocrisy...
So for instance Yeshua challenged the Sanhedrin for murdering the prophets as atoning sacrifices in Matthew 23:27-38, Mark 7:1-13, and the Parable of the Wicked Husbandman (Matthew 21:33-46, Mark 12:1-12, and Luke 20:9-19)....
So then to follow that Yeshua came to die as an atoning sacrifice, as John, Paul, and Simon taught it, is blatant hypocrisy, and was prophesied to happen.
Many people follow what they think are requirements to gain reward, and not really go the extra mile by going further then their leader showed...
This is why Yeshua was a Snare to catch out mankind, and not giving out free salvation; as this had already been seen multiple times in religious culture...
So instead it is all the opposite to see who is paying attention, and most have already failed...
Those chosen have been removed from this reality (Revelation 6:9-11), and shall return at the Age of Enlightenment.
In my opinion.
i.e. they haven't understood it in the same way you have? Isn't that to be expected, that people interpret things differently? And in any case, most people don't follow any texts anyway.
Of course everyone has different forms of intelligence, and some are more astute than others...
Plus since people have been purposely guided the wrong way by the Pharisees John, Paul, Simon, and then led that way by the church, rather than reading the text unbiasedly, of course many have got a different understanding.
Understandably I've had prior knowledge since birth, was told certain bits, wasn't allowed to read Paul's writings before knowing the Gospels first, etc.
Is this fair on them, to have not been given the same guidance, this is where we feel distraught at times, that maybe we can educate people to see these things differently...
Yet unfortunately it is more complex than that, as they like it that way, that is why they've made declarations my soul has never been able to, as I see them bits as evil...
So whereas I've done tons of research to make sense of it legalistically; they just accept and allow things that cause hypocrisy, with it being purposely made this way to test the hearts of the whole of mankind.
This is a crucial point, and do ponder that we've only had the Bible to read in our own languages for the last few hundred years; thus really people have been purposely misguided, with no real way of knowing the text to see the flaws...
Thus do think everyone should be given a better opportunity to understand it grammatically; yet there are so many layers of lies, where people are not going to admit they're wrong to help fix it.
Also take into account people only sign up to a surface level of the text, like celebrating Christmas, Easter, etc, and not actually knowing they're being ungodly by doing so...
Thus again they do need a better opportunity to understand it; yet personally feel some of the crucial aspects that need fixing first is Judaism's responsibility, as Islam and Christians will go mad if they realize all of this was already explained in Hebrew.
In my opinion.
Of course everyone has different forms of intelligence, and some are more astute than others...
Plus since people have been purposely guided the wrong way by the Pharisees John, Paul, Simon, and then led that way by the church, rather than reading the text unbiasedly, of course many have got a different understanding.
Understandably I've had prior knowledge since birth, was told certain bits, wasn't allowed to read Paul's writings before knowing the Gospels first, etc.
Is this fair on them, to have not been given the same guidance, this is where we feel distraught at times, that maybe we can educate people to see these things differently...
Yet unfortunately it is more complex than that, as they like it that way, that is why they've made declarations my soul has never been able to, as I see them bits as evil...
So whereas I've done tons of research to make sense of it legalistically; they just accept and allow things that cause hypocrisy, with it being purposely made this way to test the hearts of the whole of mankind.
This is a crucial point, and do ponder that we've only had the Bible to read in our own languages for the last few hundred years; thus really people have been purposely misguided, with no real way of knowing the text to see the flaws...
Thus do think everyone should be given a better opportunity to understand it grammatically; yet there are so many layers of lies, where people are not going to admit they're wrong to help fix it.
Also take into account people only sign up to a surface level of the text, like celebrating Christmas, Easter, etc, and not actually knowing they're being ungodly by doing so...
Thus again they do need a better opportunity to understand it; yet personally feel some of the crucial aspects that need fixing first is Judaism's responsibility, as Islam and Christians will go mad if they realize all of this was already explained in Hebrew.
In my opinion.
Well for one, most people on the planet are not Christians of course.
But secondly, OK, sure, so you do think it's worth trying to educate people. Now, you need to do that holistically if you're gonna achieve anything, not just post stuff on a forum that gets lost in noise by people who might well think differently if they could actually see you in person and pick up the vibe of your authenticity.
31% of the planet are Christian...
Plus these same prophetic ideas are in Zoroastrian, and Hindu texts as well...
Therefore you'd think there would be more people actually trying to fix the blatant hypocrisy.
I think it is unfair not to give them a fair chance to understand it, that it isn't a just test, unless you allow people to have all the information presented.
Yet so far in 14 years of trying, and i used to sell timeshare, this is harder selling Christ to Christians, Muslims and Jews.
Personally deal with math in most of my thinking, give me one person who actually spends the time to understand it online...
So far no one is even interested that the world could be saved if they acknowledged it.
In my opinion.
31% of the planet are Christian...
Plus these same prophetic ideas are in Zoroastrian, and Hindu texts as well...
Therefore you'd think there would be more people actually trying to fix the blatant hypocrisy.
I think it is unfair not to give them a fair chance to understand it, that it isn't a just test, unless you allow people to have all the information presented.
Yet so far in 14 years of trying, and i used to sell timeshare, this is harder selling Christ to Christians, Muslims and Jews.
Personally deal with math in most of my thinking, give me one person who actually spends the time to understand it online...
So far no one is even interested that the world could be saved if they acknowledged it.
In my opinion.
Firstly, most people's personal religion actually has very little to do with any texts! Especially the case when you leave the Abrahamic sphere, but even within that.
Secondly, people make much of their decisions and form much of their opinions emotionally, not rationally. That is how people are, it's a reflection of what really moves us and forms us and brings forth the worlds we live in. So a dry rational argument is very unlikely to get anywhere.
Tho it is possible to see people creating their own religious values from contributing factors throughout their life; this doesn't ever exclude that religious values often started from opinions of the religious texts to begin with.
Abrahamic beliefs are all very specific to which eye they're looking through, and all claiming to see clearly; when they only take on board parts of the textual data available to us.
Starting at a root of a problem, is far easier than patching up at the end...
Which is where appealing to the textual data is needed for the sake of scholarly justification for the scholarly things; when they are attended to, it makes the spiritual matters far easier to comprehend globally.
'Some' people...
Thank you for the perception, hadn't really thought of some people being more animal brain driven, rather than logic based with religion.
"If the truth can be told, so as to be understood, it will be believed." - Terence Mckenna
Like i get your point that some people need an identity to associate the information with, and that without that source they haven't got someone to follow... Like they are emotional led like animals in packs as well.
Thus did think whilst in school day dreaming about explaining to Christianity one day; how it might be useful to get world famous first musically...
Tho a Christian in a chatroom the other day pointed out i love your music, your poetry; yet just not your religious correction...
That same Issue will always happen, unless we can logistically get some of the text properly understood by its founders, so then we can educate the rest.
In my opinion.
Tho it is possible to see people creating their own religious values from contributing factors throughout their life; this doesn't ever exclude that religious values often started from opinions of the religious texts to begin with.
Abrahamic beliefs are all very specific to which eye they're looking through, and all claiming to see clearly; when they only take on board parts of the textual data available to us.
Starting at a root of a problem, is far easier than patching up at the end...
Which is where appealing to the textual data is needed for the sake of scholarly justification for the scholarly things; when they are attended to, it makes the spiritual matters far easier to comprehend globally.
'Some' people...
Thank you for the perception, hadn't really thought of some people being more animal brain driven, rather than logic based with religion.
"If the truth can be told, so as to be understood, it will be believed." - Terence Mckenna
Like i get your point that some people need an identity to associate the information with, and that without that source they haven't got someone to follow... Like they are emotional led like animals in packs as well.
Thus did think whilst in school day dreaming about explaining to Christianity one day; how it might be useful to get world famous first musically...
Tho a Christian in a chatroom the other day pointed out i love your music, your poetry; yet just not your religious correction...
That same Issue will always happen, unless we can logistically get some of the text properly understood by its founders, so then we can educate the rest.
In my opinion.
Thanks for being receptive here, wizanda.
But I still think you're overestimating how important religious texts really or can be to people. I think most people form their relationships with the Divine and their views on the world with little or no recourse to any text - and to me that seems totally great.
Some people interested in religious texts, hang around on forums; so you never know, could meet someone smart enough to understand it one day.
I'm happy for those who naively feel safe in a religious belief that is totally wrong, as no one was really interested in understanding the texts properly too...
The ideas of God are presented to us in a way that already shapes our opinion, as imagine if Judaism accepted Yeshua's fulfillment in prophecy as an Avatar, then help removed the false text from the Bible, that Islam has always claimed are there, world peace.
Yet why would they ever remove it without textual data, to substantiate the whole case in detail?
In my opinion.
Some people interested in religious texts, hang around on forums; so you never know, could meet someone smart enough to understand it one day.
I'm happy for those who naively feel safe in a religious belief that is totally wrong, as no one was really interested in understanding the texts properly too...
The ideas of God are presented to us in a way that already shapes our opinion, as imagine if Judaism accepted Yeshua's fulfillment in prophecy as an Avatar, then help removed the false text from the Bible, that Islam has always claimed are there, world peace.
Yet why would they ever remove it without textual data, to substantiate the whole case in detail?
In my opinion.
Well, I have never seen texts as necessary, but you evidently do, and that's cool. Shall we leave it there brother?
As someone who was spiritually guided to understand reality, personally don't even like religious dogma... Yet was asked to read it to get mankind out of its own mess.
Plus after all the demons are removed who follow the bloodthirsty dogma, then we can have a world without it, with just the spiritual people...
Yet currently they're about to be destroyed according to their own texts, so it is compassionate to try, and reach them whilst we can.
By all means you don't need to get involved in trying to help people who won't listen to their own religious dogma; yet it is all enlightening when understood, and beneficial that our actions are righteous.
In my opinion.
As someone who was spiritually guided to understand reality, personally don't even like religious dogma... Yet was asked to read it to get mankind out of its own mess.
Plus after all the demons are removed who follow the bloodthirsty dogma, then we can have a world without it, with just the spiritual people...
Yet currently they're about to be destroyed according to their own texts, so it is compassionate to try, and reach them whilst we can.
By all means you don't need to get involved in trying to help people who won't listen to their own religious dogma; yet it is all enlightening when understood, and beneficial that our actions are righteous.
In my opinion.
Well, you'd need most people to 1) accept the legitimacy of texts and then 2) accept your understandings of them. Why not skip 1 and 2 altogether and just teach about the Divine?
So if the text proves it is real, that there has been a systematic Snare, and Curse put on the whole of mankind, to remove all the ungodly in one go...
Do we need people to accept the legitimacy of the text for them to be charged by it?
Over 50% of the world (31% Christian 22% Muslim) claim to accept Yeshua as Messiah; yet all ignore his teachings, and you're hinting to do the same?
Tho it is true, that since point 1 & 2 can't be successfully achieved; will remember to maintain teaching the easiest path one knows to 0neness.
If we show the world how multiple dimension quantum physics works for example, do you think they will use it wisely; whilst fundamentally nothing has changed?
It is like teaching the savages how to use 'magic' tools for healing... They use them to cut each other's arms off.
If we wait until after the cleansing, there is no need to teach anyone, and the Snare will systematically remove everyone we don't like anyways; so then there is no need to teach everyone about things they should have already known about from reading the texts.
Just find it is unfair they've all been lied to, and can't change the global eschatology of the great battle, and then the time of Enlightenment.
In my opinion.