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Mohammed in the Bible

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Islam, Sep 1, 2006.

  1. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

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    From what I have read in the Gospel of John, there seemed to be a clear indication that the Spirit of Truth or Comforter, referred to the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit is mentioned again and again.

    From what I understand it, the Holy Spirit is not simply a manifestation of another divine being. What Jesus referred to Father, can mean God or the Holy Spirit. He can be see as one and the same.

    However, I don't believe in Jesus to be one and the same as God.

    It doesn't mention anywhere the Trinity. The Trinity was idea that began not with Constantine, as most of Muslims would seem to indicate. Trinity can be seen as early as the 2nd century CE; Constantine just grasp only flavour of the Trinity, possibly for his own purpose or possibly because of particular Christian sect that he followed (though he didn't convert until his deathbed).

    But as I said, I don't believe in the Holy Spirit or any other spirits, including that of God or angels, demons or djinns. But from the way I see John's gospel, I don't see it as this spirit being Muhammad.

    Are you telling me that this spirit of truth, whom you claimed to be Muhammad, had fathered Jesus before Muhammad was born? So Muhammad was really Jesus' father? Do seriously believe that?

    That seemed even more far-fetched then the Christian belief of the Holy Spirit being Jesus' father, or the idea of Trinity or the idea of Gabriel visiting Muhammad.
     
  2. Mujahid Mohammed

    Mujahid Mohammed Well-Known Member

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    We have free will right. Being told how and what to do is different than doing it.

    Yeah in the bible which is not an evidence of ABSOLUTE truth.
    First Allah's is your Allah. For your arab christian brothers call God Allah. And the right they have is to follow the path of all the Messengers is to worship and submit to God only and to not ascribe partners to him. This is what they should have done and they have failed miserabley by denying the Message of Allah and refusing to only worship him alone.

    Again you keep saying Muslims were given the lands. when I have told you that the property of the people is not taken from them by the muslim government. The muslims just took over as a governing body for the land belongs to the one who created it and that is Allah. And He wants the most just of his creation who will implement His laws in the land. But it must be done in accordance with what Allah said. Again I gave you the example.

    You keep saying conquest and it is funny the only people opposed to this expansion were the oppressive regimes. For they looked at it as a loss of land. The muslims looked at is as an expansion of relgion. The muslims were going out in the world settling in different areas helping people establish governments so they can function by themselves within the Islamic state. They did their own thing and was given protection at the same time.

    Again Instead of stealing the lands from them. Or oppressing the people or implementing the laws of the conquerers and pushing the inhabitants to the lowest of society and many times subjecting them to slavery. That happens many times. The people are raped of their dignity, their wealth and property and all their customs. This is every example except for a righteous muslim leader. For the people are given many times the abiltity to govern themselves and it improved the quality of life for the people I already gave you the example.

    That is every empire ever. every empire spread by going into foreign lands but muslims do not want the land. They just want you to believe in the One who created you and follow His laws in the land He created for us.

    You keep saying take their land. Why when it is clear that the property of the people is kept by them and protected by the muslims. People pay taxes no matter the reason especially in those times. The Romans taxed their civilians. what about the Persians did they also not tax their civilians. Paying taxes to a government for them was not a new thing. The difference is in the transference of power. Now it was a government who established it rules and principles on a very just system securing the rights of the citizens. It is almost like America you can worship and practice the religion of your choice and you get the rights as a cititzen of that government.

    That is a general statement. And the same can be said about anybody the Christians, Jews etc. are no exception. At least the muslims allow them to keep their lands, their religion and customs, and give them equal status while at the same time protecting them as if they were muslim. They do not go in a slaughter everyone rape the women, steal all the property, and put the people in bondage. Taking the land subjecting the people to slavery.

    The question should be asked not whether they are muslim or not but ARE THEY IMPLEMENTING THE SHARIAH OF ALLAH COMMISSIONED BY THE MESSENGER PBU AND FOLLOWED BY HIS COMPANIONS.
     
  3. Mujahid Mohammed

    Mujahid Mohammed Well-Known Member

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    the reason I asked the question and i think you missed it, is because you stated "I don't believe in any miracle or spririt because I see no evidence of one." So how do you believe in the holy spirit then, but thanks for the gnostic explanation
     
  4. Snowbear

    Snowbear Nita Okhata

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    What happens to the people who choose not to convert to Islam and follow the Islamic version of 'His' laws?
    What happens to the people who turn down the Muslim's 'offer of assistance?]
     
  5. shema

    shema Active Member

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    Isn't it true that Muslims believe that the Bible has been tampered with and currupted?
     
  6. Snowbear

    Snowbear Nita Okhata

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    Yes they do. But that never stopped anyone from taking what they wanted from it and twisting it to say whatever they want it to :sarcastic


    (Yes, I know - there are non-Muslims, including some Christians, who do the same thing)
     
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