1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Misconceptions about Jesus and Krishna

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Sirona, May 9, 2021.

  1. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

    Joined:
    May 1, 2014
    Messages:
    1,037
    Ratings:
    +914
    Religion:
    Hinduism
    @SeekingAllTruth and others.

    My faith as I understand it forbids me to engage in “quarreling” but given the fact that no other Hindu has taken up the challenge yet, I will try to sort this out.

    Yeshua and Krishna were called both a God and the Son of God.
    Krishna is called “Bhagavan / Bhagwan” which can be rendered as “God”. “The Son of God” is a Christian title which is not given to Krishna. Krishna is the 8th incarnation of the Hindu God Vishnu.


    Both were called Savior, and the second person of the Trinity.
    Krishna is described as sort of a saviour God in the Bhagavad Gita. His followers are saved by faith in him alone (among other things).

    The “Hindu trinity” is an invention of Westerns encylopedists. There is a “trimurti” worshipped in Hinduism consisting of Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva, but it doesn’t play the same prominent role the Trinity does for Christianity. The most important “denominations” in Hinduism worship Vishnu, Shiva and Shakti (the Goddess), respectively.

    Both had adoptive human fathers who were carpenters.
    Krishna’s foster father Nanda was a cowherd. Krishna grew up in a cowherd village and tended cows as a child.

    Jesus was conceived by a god. Krishna was the reincarnation of a god.
    Correct.

    Both were killed by piercing--Jesus by nails and a spear, Krishna by an arrow.
    Correct, but seeing similarities here is a bit of a stretch.

    Both resurrected.
    The concept of resurrection doesn’t exist in Hinduism. Hindus believe in reincarnation. Krishna died from an arrow and went straight back to his divine abode.


    This list is not exhaustive. It would take up too much space to list Jesus' similarities with all the dying/rising gods before him--Zalmoxis, Dionysus, Horus, Mithra, Romulus--who inspired the gospel writers to copy them.

    Instead I want to mention a few details of Krishna's birth that convince me Jesus is an amalgamation of many other earlier stories.

    Kamsa, the evil king ruling the land hears a voice from the sky predicting that a child will be born and will kill him. The king is terrified. He orders all the children born to his sister, who is the one who will give birth to the child, to be killed.

    Kamsa was predicted to be killed by the 8th child of Vasudeva and Devaki. Therefore, he kept his sister and his brother-in-law in prison. Vasudeva and Devaki handed their first seven children over to Kamsa, who killed them. When Krishna was born, he first appeared in his form as Vishnu, who made the gates open and the guards fall asleep. Vasudeva then took the baby Krishna and took it to the cowherd village of Braj, where he gave Krishna to Nanda and Yashoda, who were cowherders. Braj is not a “far-away land” as Vasudeva could reach it on foot. Vasudeva then returned to prison.

    It becomes clear that the Jesus story is just another legend based on many earlier legends that were floating around the area at that time.
    Probably true. However, the stories of Jesus and Krishna contain certain “tropes” common to storytelling. For example, Luke Skywalker is also a “saviour child” who was taken away from his royal parents and placed with his father's stepbrother, Owen Lars, and his wife Beru, to live a modest life as a “moisture farmer.”
     
    #1 Sirona, May 9, 2021
    Last edited: May 9, 2021
    • Informative Informative x 5
    • Winner Winner x 4
    • Useful Useful x 2
  2. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Messages:
    13,791
    Ratings:
    +5,140
    Religion:
    Pelagianism
    This is very useful and interesting. Thank you.
     
  3. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2020
    Messages:
    2,877
    Ratings:
    +477
    Religion:
    Christian
    Luke Skywalker a moisture farmer, really? What does a moisture farmer do?
    With all the gods and god/men that Jesus story is meant to be copied from or similar to we find that although the lies have spread about this, the facts do not correlate with the similarity claims.
    You pointed some of this out in what you wrote. Here are some sites with other similarity claims debunked.
    This sort of thing can be done with nearly all the rubbish parallels that people have come up with and which are not true.
    The last site I give, from The India Observer gives more of a view from the Hindu side and says that the birth narratives about Krishna do not appear until the 3-4th centuries AD, and why they may have appeared at all.
    The dating they give for the birthday of Jesus is completely wrong however, it is sometime in warmer weather, not winter.
    Is Jesus Simply a Retelling of the Mithras Mythology? | Cold Case Christianity
    Is Jesus Simply a Retelling of the Horus Mythology? | Cold Case Christianity
    Krishna, Christ, and Parallelomania
    JANMASHTAMI — the controversy over Krishna and Christ. -
     
  4. SeekingAllTruth

    SeekingAllTruth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2020
    Messages:
    1,570
    Ratings:
    +844
    Religion:
    agnostic deist

    Christian apologetic websites. We'd expect denials from them. Try CARM. maybe Matt Slick will find some similarities.
     
  5. MatthewA

    MatthewA Active Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    775
    Ratings:
    +607
    Religion:
    Christian
    Hello Sirona,

    Thank you for the information. Interesting picture.

    The most important “denominations” in Hinduism worship Vishnu, Shiva and Shakti (the Goddess), respectively.

    When it comes to Hinduism, is there also denominations like Christian church, and have different subjects that they may believe about their religion?
     
  6. SeekingAllTruth

    SeekingAllTruth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2020
    Messages:
    1,570
    Ratings:
    +844
    Religion:
    agnostic deist
    Do you see a similarity between Krishna being taken away to escape Kamsa's wrath and Jesus being taken to Egypt to escape Herod's wrath?
     
  7. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    33,640
    Ratings:
    +18,873
    Religion:
    Christian
    I liked your post until this. The story of Jesus was not made up or a mixture of other stories. Such views are basically conspiracy theories for those who have negative views of Christianity. It is not a historical or scholarly view.
     
  8. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    33,142
    Ratings:
    +17,925
    Religion:
    Saivite Hindu
    Not Sirona, but yes, there are many subsects. A specific subset is called a sampradaya, and even more specific, if it has a teaching lineage, a parampara. It also varies widely by geography, as India is such a big place. Many languages, food, style of worship, etc. That said, unlike Christianity, any Hindu will enter any other Hindu temple of all of Hinduism and feel quite at home. The congregational stuff isn't there, and individuals have more just a relationship with God. So groups are loosely defined for the most part.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. SeekingAllTruth

    SeekingAllTruth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2020
    Messages:
    1,570
    Ratings:
    +844
    Religion:
    agnostic deist
    You liked her post when she disagreed with perceived similarities between Jesus and Krishna but you immediately disliked it when she agreed there is a similarity between the two and you dismiss all similarities or parallels between Jesus and all other dying rising gods as conspiracies. I rest my case. :rolleyes:
     
  10. Jainarayan

    Jainarayan ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2011
    Messages:
    21,113
    Ratings:
    +9,312
    Religion:
    śrī kṛṣṇasya sevāyām - “In Lord Krishna’s service”
    I’ve done this a number of times over the years. Whoever has come up with these “similarities”, or rather, trying to force them, is so far off the mark it’s laughable.

    http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jckr1.htm

    Similarities Between the Lives and Teachings of Christ and Krishna The section about their names is so wrong it’s wronger than wrong. There is no linguistic or etymological connection. Krishna means dark, or attractive... two meanings for the same word. Hare in Hare Krishna can be a name for Vishnu or Goddess Rādhā. Sanskrit has the most synonyms of almost any language and play on words. That’s why you can’t read it at face value or out of context. Sanskrit is almost as dependent on context as it is on grammar. Anyway...
    KRISHNA AND CHRIST

    My opinion? Same story, same lessons, same missions different players in different times, for different audiences, using different methods. Jesus said things relevant to his audience. He didn’t talk about things that were not part of the culture, e.g. reincarnation. Krishna said things relevant to ancient India. They didn’t predict air travel either because it was irrelevant. Certain truths transcend time and place. In the Bhagavad Gita Krishna says he takes birth in many ages for righting wrongs. He tells Arjuna that he (Krishna) remembers all of his births, while we do not.

    God can do anything he wants or needs to. If they are both incarnations of God, those are just two of possibly thousands over the millennia, and maybe throughout the universe. It’s human hubris to limit God. I don’t have a problem with the possibility that God has used the same recipe. What I have a problem with is people trying to force the issue, defend, refute, over analyze it, make phony and laughable comparisons, try to pound square pegs into round holes, see things that aren’t there and not see what is there... like their lessons on righteousness and devotion to God. Oh yeah! Like trying to make a better world! Not whose mother was a virgin. :rolleyes:

    Just my opinion.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  11. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Well-Known Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2020
    Messages:
    2,566
    Ratings:
    +4,936
    Religion:
    Hindu
    I'm just waking up(and I haven't had my caffeine yet), so my thought process isn't real profound, but...

    Why the heck does anyone feel the need to compare Krishna and Jesus anyways? Why not let Krishna be Krishna and Jesus be Jesus, and leave it at that? Why would anyone feel the need to stuff all divine figures into the same box? If we do that with people, we're sure not viewed very favorably.
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
  12. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    33,142
    Ratings:
    +17,925
    Religion:
    Saivite Hindu
    Living in the past. Coming at religion from a historical lens, a universalist lens, or just an intellectual argumentative lens. There are lots of reasons I'm sure, although none of them make any sense to me, or apparently, to you. Have a nice day, gobble that coffee.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  13. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    33,640
    Ratings:
    +18,873
    Religion:
    Christian
    Yes, because it's garbage that has nothing to do with history or scholarship. You haven't presented a shred of evidence for your claims. Just a Wikipedia link about a Hindu myth. That's all. Buzz off and stop trolling me, unless you have reputable evidence for your claims, which I already know you don't because I've discussed this subject and researched it starting over a decade ago. I know you have nothing, so you may as well just go away or try to fool someone less educated about it than I.
     
  14. Rival

    Rival Iiu em hotep.
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2012
    Messages:
    20,165
    Ratings:
    +28,933
    Religion:
    Kemetic Pagan
    ***THREAD MOVED TO RELIGIOUS DEBATES***
     
  15. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,564
    Ratings:
    +1,358
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe the Bible has the Word of God and the Bhagavad-Gita does not.
     
  16. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,564
    Ratings:
    +1,358
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe I am similar to Krishna also. I was born.
     
  17. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,564
    Ratings:
    +1,358
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe the object was not to view them as the same but to denigrate Jesus.
     
  18. Jainarayan

    Jainarayan ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2011
    Messages:
    21,113
    Ratings:
    +9,312
    Religion:
    śrī kṛṣṇasya sevāyām - “In Lord Krishna’s service”
    I believe the Bhagavad Gita is spoken by God directly to one man and the Bible is not. It is a collection of contradicting stories written by men passing them word to mouth. Prove me wrong and yourself right. You made the statement, the burden of proof is on you.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    33,369
    Ratings:
    +11,705
    Religion:
    Inner Child Healing
    Nice. Krishna was a real person?
     
  20. Jainarayan

    Jainarayan ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2011
    Messages:
    21,113
    Ratings:
    +9,312
    Religion:
    śrī kṛṣṇasya sevāyām - “In Lord Krishna’s service”
    Yes. He is believed to have been a historical person. For devotees he is a historical person who is an incarnation of Vishnu, i.e. God.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
Loading...