Merkel: Europe 'can no longer rely on allies' after Trump and Brexit

[Quetzal]

Mrs Merkel said she wanted friendly relations with both countries as well as Russia but Europe now had to "fight for its own destiny".

It follows the G7's failure to commit to the 2015 Paris climate deal, talks Mrs Merkel said were "very difficult".

President Trump has said he will make a decision in the coming week.

"The times in which we could completely depend on others are on the way out. I've experienced that in the last few days," Mrs Merkel told a crowd at an election rally in Munich, southern Germany.

Merkel: Europe 'can no longer rely on allies' after Trump and Brexit - BBC News

Thoughts, concerns, questions? I know Trump threatened to bail on the climate deal, doesn't seem like he is going to let up.

 

[LuisDantas]

Europe can't really afford to neglect the climate issues, so I must assume that Merkel means it and is accurate.

It seems to me that the EU will basically have no choice but to take some distance - strategically, militarily, economically, diplomatically - from the UK and even more so from the USA.

Even if Trump eventually decides to do something about climate change, it is just not wise to trust his commitment any.

That will probably reflect into better economical perspectives for Europe and worse ones for the USA in the next decade or so. A decade or so later there will be a cultural follow-up.

I don't think it is a good time to be American.

 

[sun rise]

I agree with her. Everyone needs to treat the current US regime with distrust.

 

[Quetzal]

I don't think it is a good time to be American.

With Trump at the helm, this is accurate.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I think her speech is tentative. There's no telling what Germany and Europe will choose to do. They have a lot of changes and challenges. The powers-that-be were already headed towards an independent military and EU state; so this perhaps just an opportunity to bolster EU opinion in that direction. While Trump may be the subject of comic cartoons in the EU he is not the US Congress. He's the head diplomat who negotiates trade deals, but the US Congress may choose whether to ratify them or not and ultimately can make deals without him if necessary. We're talking about modern times where we do need to send diplomats to other countries. We have internet.

 

[Flankerl]

I agree with her. Everyone needs to treat the current US regime with distrust.

It was already under "Obamas regime" that every single German was spied upon by the NSA, that the NSA had its spy-equipment directly next to the Reichstag and Chancellery and so forth.

So pleeeeeeeease don't act like the US and Germany are the biggest pals in the history of friendship.

Countries don't have friends, they only have common interests.

While Trump may be the subject of comic cartoons in the EU

He is not. In Germany there is constant/daily/hourly media coverage on anything Trump does.
Jokes? Cartoons? Nope.



And as someone who has to live in a Germany under Merkel with no end in sight this longrange love affair foreigners have for her is quite disgusting.

 

[tytlyf]

It was already under "Obamas regime" that every single German was spied upon by the NSA, that the NSA had its spy-equipment directly next to the Reichstag and Chancellery and so forth.

Our allies spy on each other, this isn't anything new. What Obama doesn't do is share classified information with our enemies.

 

[Brickjectivity]

It was already under "Obamas regime" that every single German was spied upon by the NSA, that the NSA had its spy-equipment directly next to the Reichstag and Chancellery and so forth.

That was terrible, and I'm so sorry that happened. It was inexcusable.

He is not. In Germany there is constant/daily/hourly media coverage on anything Trump does.
Jokes? Cartoons? Nope.

That is surprising. He is lampooned daily here.

And as someone who has to live in a Germany under Merkel with no end in sight this longrange love affair foreigners have for her is quite disgusting.

We also make fun of Merkel even though we did her wrong by spying on her phone. We are terrible to her, but we like her. She's in the news a lot, because we like her. I don't always agree with her policies (and don't always comprehend the situations), but I think she's serious and takes her job seriously. If she were to show up here, she'd get a lot of respect.

 

[Flankerl]

Our allies spy on each other, this isn't anything new. What Obama doesn't do is share classified information with our enemies.

Name one foreign country that keeps the records and details of every single phone call in the US.

That was terrible, and I'm so sorry that happened. It was inexcusable.

Uhm it still happens. Every single day.

we did her wrong by spying on her phone. We are terrible to her

No one in Germany cared about her stupid phone.
They cared about the other far more numerous stuff the NSA does to this day.

I don't always agree with her policies (and don't always comprehend the situations)

They are absolutely horrible.
People haven't seen their income rise since the 90s. The prices weren't stagnant in that time.
More and more people need to get welfare money even though they are working full time because the salaries are so low.
Germany exports like a champ and all the money stays with the company owners due to the liberal market reforms.
Temporary contracts are all people get.
Low income workers get a 6 months trial period, but they are laid off before the 6 months end because the company would've to pay them more afterwards and give them a longer contract.
These low income workers are all under an infinite number of temporary work agencies. Because of that these workers aren't under the umbrella of the trade unions.
And of course these workers can't organise their own trade unions as they are laid off if they try.
People can't plan a family because of the insecurity.
The only people who still have open ended contracts are the people from before the 2000s.
Rents are ever rising.
More and more seniors have to work till they die or search for deposit bottles in the trash.
Pensions are down the drain. Due to the voting power of the elderly they are raised every other year but because not enough people pay into the funds people like me will never see a single Euro of their state pension.
The answer of Merkels party? Tough luck you should've invested somewhere else. Which most can't because they have no money to do so.

And I haven't even really started yet...

 

[Sunstone]

Name one foreign country that keeps the records and details of every single phone call in the US.





Uhm it still happens. Every single day.




No one in Germany cared about her stupid phone.
They cared about the other far more numerous stuff the NSA does to this day.




They are absolutely horrible.
People haven't seen their income rise since the 90s. The prices weren't stagnant in that time.
More and more people need to get welfare money even though they are working full time because the salaries are so low.
Germany exports like a champ and all the money stays with the company owners due to the liberal market reforms.
Temporary contracts are all people get.
Low income workers get a 6 months trial period, but they are laid off before the 6 months end because the company would've to pay them more afterwards and give them a longer contract.
These low income workers are all under an infinite number of temporary work agencies. Because of that these workers aren't under the umbrella of the trade unions.
And of course these workers can't organise their own trade unions as they are laid off if they try.
People can't plan a family because of the insecurity.
The only people who still have open ended contracts are the people from before the 2000s.
Rents are ever rising.
More and more seniors have to work till they die or search for deposit bottles in the trash.
Pensions are down the drain. Due to the voting power of the elderly they are raised every other year but because not enough people pay into the funds people like me will never see a single Euro of their state pension.
The answer of Merkels party? Tough luck you should've invested somewhere else. Which most can't because they have no money to do so.

And I haven't even really started yet...

Sounds like Trump's idea of paradise.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Uhm it still happens. Every single day.


No one in Germany cared about her stupid phone.
They cared about the other far more numerous stuff the NSA does to this day.

I try to bring up the danger of Big Brother when I can. Its not what busy people want to hear, and when they do hear it they say "I cannot do anything. Its out of my hands. Maybe things will work out." Even after Snowden we are still not facing reality, and Homeland Security is not taking its own big-brotherness seriously. They are not thinking about the long run and are trying to argue against citizen protections such as end to end encryption.

They are absolutely horrible.
People haven't seen their income rise since the 90s. The prices weren't stagnant in that time.
More and more people need to get welfare money even though they are working full time because the salaries are so low.
Germany exports like a champ and all the money stays with the company owners due to the liberal market reforms.
Temporary contracts are all people get.
Low income workers get a 6 months trial period, but they are laid off before the 6 months end because the company would've to pay them more afterwards and give them a longer contract.
These low income workers are all under an infinite number of temporary work agencies. Because of that these workers aren't under the umbrella of the trade unions.
And of course these workers can't organise their own trade unions as they are laid off if they try.
People can't plan a family because of the insecurity.
The only people who still have open ended contracts are the people from before the 2000s.
Rents are ever rising.
More and more seniors have to work till they die or search for deposit bottles in the trash.
Pensions are down the drain. Due to the voting power of the elderly they are raised every other year but because not enough people pay into the funds people like me will never see a single Euro of their state pension.
The answer of Merkels party? Tough luck you should've invested somewhere else. Which most can't because they have no money to do so.

And I haven't even really started yet...

I have heard that you have no college tuition there, and generally the news is wonderful. I am not aware that your middle class is being forced into the welfare system. What we hear in the USA is that you have lots of manufacturing jobs, and many of us feel jealous. Our manufacturing jobs have been going away for decades, mostly replaced by robots. We used to have a huge textile industry, but it was sent to other countries. I know one fellow who worked at three manufacturers that closed, and he was laid off three times because of it. He thinks Germany is the place to be and wants to move there. He says Germany re-trains people who's jobs go away. We do not do that here.

 

[Flankerl]

I have heard that you have no college tuition there

atm there is no regular college tuition in any state unless you study too long. But even those costs are rather mild compared to the US.

But keep in mind that German University life is tough. There is no dorm life, no one at the University gives a crap whether you show up or not. If you don't get your life together then no one will help you.

I am not aware that your middle class is being forced into the welfare system.

What middle class?
There are two types of people.
Those who really belong to the middle class. these have it good while they become less every year.
And then there are those who believe they belong to the middle class but don't. They get told by their politicians how nice their life is and actually believe it.
Especially the second type of people make actual change rather difficult.

What we hear in the USA is that you have lots of manufacturing jobs, and many of us feel jealous

Sure that exists. Too bad they employ the cheap workforce I wrote about before.
Nothing of the revenue ends up with the regular workers.

He thinks Germany is the place to be and wants to move there.

Which he can't unless he's got the money.

He says Germany re-trains people who's jobs go away. We do not do that here.

Yeah sure but as what are they retrained? Correct as the lowest skilled workers. Usually some warehouse work.
Those people who end up in the temporary job agencies...

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

Europe can't really afford to neglect the climate issues, so I must assume that Merkel means it and is accurate.

It seems to me that the EU will basically have no choice but to take some distance - strategically, militarily, economically, diplomatically - from the UK and even more so from the USA.

Even if Trump eventually decides to do something about climate change, it is just not wise to trust his commitment any.

That will probably reflect into better economical perspectives for Europe and worse ones for the USA in the next decade or so. A decade or so later there will be a cultural follow-up.

I don't think it is a good time to be American.

I see it the other way. If there was ever time to abandon the good ship new-saudi Arabia(aka mainland Europe) under captain Merkel(that fat pig) now's it.

 

[LuisDantas]

I see it the other way. If there was ever time to abandon the good ship new-saudi Arabia(aka mainland Europe) under captain Merkel(that fat pig) now's it.

The logic being...?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

The logic being...?

The logic being?

Have you any idea what is going on over there?

 

[LuisDantas]

The logic being?

Have you any idea what is going on over there?

I asked first.

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

I asked first.

Unless life at the bottom of the ocean suites you, it's best to not be chained to a sinking ship;which Europe is, both socially and economically.

 

[LuisDantas]

Unless life at the bottom of the ocean suites you, it's best to not be chained to a sinking ship;which Europe is, both socially and economically.

Oh, fantasy. It is a nice thing, isn't it?

Reality has its advantages, though. And a tendency to bite us back when we neglect it.

 

[Koldo]

Unless life at the bottom of the ocean suites you, it's best to not be chained to a sinking ship;which Europe is, both socially and economically.

A sinking ship is still better than the bottom of the ocean, which is where most of the world is.
It will take a long while before this ship actually sinks.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Our allies spy on each other, this isn't anything new. What Obama doesn't do is share classified information with our enemies.

And not to mention that Obama did continue that, it seems many have forgotten he didn't even start it.

Too bad they employ the cheap workforce I wrote about before.

What you wrote seems much like how many in America are turning to "independent contracting" (a very broad term here that basically potentially covers everything and nothing depending on how the work is set up) for some form of work. And of course temp agencies, which leave a bad a taste in the mouths of many workers here because no matter where you go you get paid less than everybody else and get none of the benefits, and you may even be called as you are lacing your shoes to be informed that your period of working wherever is done with - they'll call you when they have something.