Men Without Work

[We Never Know]

Its a long video. His point is that all of these men not working is itself a crisis, and he wonders how to resolve it and is asking people for help figuring out how to resolve it. He's not calling for a pity party.

If more help wanted signs will fix it then great.

Why only males?

 

[Brickjectivity]

Why only males?

His book is about males, and that is also why I posted in the men's health section. He does make a comment about women in his video, but I don't remember at the moment what.

He presents a series of charts showing this to be particularly related to males. That I recall.

 

[Brickjectivity]

The presenter mentions that 2 out of 5 receive a disability check of some type at some point in their lives, so that also partially answers how they are getting food and lodgings.

I want to add to this comment I made to @PureX that a disability check does not mean a person cannot do better. Motivating people to do better is still possible and would help our economy and families. That is why this amounts to a crisis -- because we are losing a lot of umph. Its like we're walking on a sleepy foot.

 

[PureX]

I guess (but this is only one possible answer) that it is a sickness. It is a feeling of shame and uselessness which afflicts men and hooks into our natural self destructive tendencies. When someone sees that you are ill they may decide to try and convalesce you rather than simply cut you off. So we have a lot of men being taken care of who are not working. Someone who cares sees them shut down. Perhaps girlfriends, parents, friends or family take care of them; or perhaps they live off of a bank account. The presenter mentions that 2 out of 5 receive a disability check of some type at some point in their lives, so that also partially answers how they are getting food and lodgings.

I suspect that it is our social/economic systems that are 'sick', not these men. I think these men have experience that systemic failure in ways that have caused them to reject the system that has rejected them. It's the system that is not including them that drives them to stop trying to be included.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I suspect that it is our social/economic systems that are 'sick', not these men. I think these men have experience that systemic failure in ways that have caused them to reject the system that has rejected them. It's the system that is not including them that drives them to stop trying to be included.

Slavery was abolished in England by first making it unprofitable, then nobody defended it. They avoided the hard path that America took. Social changes are made permanent if we change motives.

 

[PureX]

Slavery was abolished in England by first making it unprofitable, then nobody defended it. They avoided the hard path that America took. Social changes are made permanent if we change motives.

The motive of greed is destroying societies and cultures all across the planet. And the more damage it does to people, the more greedy the people become as a method of self-preservation. So it's a self-reinforcing 'cascade' of destruction. And anyone not willing or able to serve it's cause will find fewer and fewer possible ways of avoiding it. Drugs, homelessness, criminality and death seem to be the common possibilities at the moment.

The victims aren't the problem. The rest of us are. But we are not going to acknowledge that, and even if we did, none of us seems to know what to do about it. We have created a culture and economic system that now owns and controls us, and we don't know how to stop it, or fix it. And many of us are so caught up in the greed that we don't even want to.

If those guys found a way out without falling into drugs, homelessness, criminality or suicide then maybe we should be applauding them.

 

[JustGeorge]

I wonder, what can be done... what the person, rather than the collective or authorities, can do.

I feel there would be some benefit from adding basic skill courses to high schools, colleges, or even things offered at libraries, the Y, or other public places. I think in trying to address inequalities, we've been so focused on empowering our young women, that we've forgotten that our young men need the same thing. This isn't an 'either/or situation. I see a lot of young men that simply don't have the life skills they need to make it. These would include skills that lead them to obtain and keep employment.

We're also making a shift in society's attitude that's somewhat down on men. I can't imagine this doesn't get to a young man's self esteem. Constantly being told you're part of the ills of society has to be a downer, and when we're down, we're less likely to take care of ourselves(much less others).

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

It seems a hard point to convey, that it's about people
who can work but choose not to. Other posters
always try to morph what I say into denying assistance
to those in need.

And how about people like me, the severely mentally ill, who if they worked couldn't afford their medications, and would be underemployed no matter what job they were qualified for?

 

[Brickjectivity]

I wonder, what can be done... what the person, rather than the collective or authorities, can do.

I feel there would be some benefit from adding basic skill courses to high schools, colleges, or even things offered at libraries, the Y, or other public places. I think in trying to address inequalities, we've been so focused on empowering our young women, that we've forgotten that our young men need the same thing. This isn't an 'either/or situation. I see a lot of young men that simply don't have the life skills they need to make it. These would include skills that lead them to obtain and keep employment.

We're also making a shift in society's attitude that's somewhat down on men. I can't imagine this doesn't get to a young man's self esteem. Constantly being told you're part of the ills of society has to be a downer, and when we're down, we're less likely to take care of ourselves(much less others).

I'm thinking: targeted advertising. We can use advertising systems to find out what these men don't have, and then we make them want some of it? Or maybe we can make them believe that there is something to be gained by stepping out of their slug caves?

 

[Revoltingest]

We're also making a shift in society's attitude that's somewhat down on men. I can't imagine this doesn't get to a young man's self esteem. Constantly being told you're part of the ills of society has to be a downer....

I recall being lectured about my ilk being the problem.
Didn't get me down. I just thought....
**** them!
Haters gonna hate.
We should all consider the source,
retain our equanimity, & sally forth
to feel & do good .

 

[Brickjectivity]

And how about people like me, the severely mentally ill, who if they worked couldn't afford their medications, and would be underemployed no matter what job they were qualified for?

You are probably being wasted, yes. If we could get you working that would help the economy, families and the whole system. I can see that as a possibility. Of course it depends on how capable you are, whether you can work under a supervisor with other employees or need your own personal supervisor....things like that. If there is a job you can do (with sufficient pay) then absolutely why shouldn't we help you get to working?

 

[Revoltingest]

And how about people like me, the severely mentally ill, who if they worked couldn't afford their medications, and would be underemployed no matter what job they were qualified for?

Didn't I already address this?
Taking on your case....
You should work.
But you should also get needed assistance.

 

[JustGeorge]

I'm thinking: targeted advertising. We can use advertising systems to find out what these men don't have, and then we make them want some of it? Or maybe we can make them believe that there is something to be gained by stepping out of their slug caves?

As someone who took care of a 'slug' for years, I'm not sure the targeted advertising would work. My ex knew there were new game systems and games and movies, so he tormented me or stole from his father to get these things.

I recall being lectured about my ilk being the problem.
Didn't get me down. I just thought....
**** them!
Haters gonna hate.
We should all consider the source,
retain our equanimity, & sally forth
to feel & do good .

I think you're a little tougher than some. And that's great. But for the sensitive men(whether or not they're hiding it), I think it does more damage and sometimes breeds hostilities.

Didn't I already address this?
Taking on your case....
You should work.
But you should also get need assistance.

Its kinda tricky. I've known some folks that had medication they couldn't do without. If they work, they'd lose their state insurance(which generally pays for most necessary medications) because they'd make too much to qualify. But the job wouldn't provide adequate income to obtain the medication... Its kind of a vicious cycle.

 

[Revoltingest]

Its kinda tricky. I've known some folks that had medication they couldn't do without. If they work, they'd lose their state insurance(which generally pays for most necessary medications) because they'd make too much to qualify. But the job wouldn't provide adequate income to obtain the medication... Its kind of a vicious cycle.

We clearly need reform in our social welfare system.
2 gals I know (single moms) applied for assistance.
They were both told that if they quit their jobs, they'd
get more overall compensation/benefits than if they
worked.
(I like that they both continued working.)
Assistance programs shouldn't incentivize both sloth
& dependence on the dole. I blame conservatives &
liberals for this.

 

[JustGeorge]

We clearly need reform in our social welfare system.
2 gals I know (single moms) applied for assistance.
They were both told that if they quit their jobs, they'd
get more overall compensation/benefits than if they
worked.
(I like that they both continued working.)
Assistance programs shouldn't incentivize both sloth
& dependence on the dole. I blame conservatives &
liberals for this.

I was a single mom, too. I was told the same. I also continued working, because otherwise all my money would be tied up in the hands of other people. I didn't want people I didn't even know having that kind of control.

And much to the horror of family and officials alike, I wouldn't go after child support. The system in Iowa is cruel, and I couldn't send a severely mentally ill person through something that could mess up their finances for years to come. My husband once worked with a man who, after working a full 40 hour week, received exactly 72 cents after they took his back child support.

When my ex finally 'grew up', he opted to help out in his own way, and without the aid of the government, we agree on what he needed to do to help out. Sometimes he would contribute money, if we expressed there was a need. Once, he gave us his old car when ours died. When our son broke his school computer, it went without saying that he'd cover the extra expense. Its very informal, and a plan that works for both parents, and the active providing step parent.

If we'd have gone for child support, it would have taken him years later to finally become financially efficient enough to stop 'slugging around'. The child support system needs to be addressed in such a manner than men are still required to provide for their children, yet can put a roof over their own heads and food in their own mouths in the process. Homeless, hungry men struggle to gain and keep employment.