Massive star two and a half MILLION times as bright as sun...vanishes

[dad]

It has been posted. You have ignored it.

Not true. Link?

The same way I can get information about a boat at sea by looking at it through a telescope. Or the way I can do measurements of distance using trigonometry

No clue in other words. OK. You cannot see time in a telescope. Really. As for trig, it works fine as long as we know what the lines represent. In the case of deep space and drawing a line to a star, you assume that space and time are the same in all three lines, one of which is in this solar system area.

 

[dad]

You are a master of hypocrisy. My post required only the evidence that I am not surprised. While you never post evidence to support your claims. You are shouting in the dark at your own fear and ignorance.

Tap dance all you like you have nothing. It is science that assumes all things were as they were and must evidence the claim. Pretending other beliefs have some burden of proof for you is hypocrisy.

 

[dad]

I believe that what they called “superstition”.

Believing in something that’s not real with some sorts of entities of the “spirit-kind”.

Spirits, ghosts, deities, angels, demons, jinns, shen, deva/devi, Brahman, kami, fairies, etc, are just some of superstitious beliefs.

Although Jesus supposedly taught to the masses in Galilee and Judaea, he didn’t write any of the gospels, letters and apocalyptic texts in the New Testament.

Much of church survival was dependent on Paul’s teaching, who never met Jesus who was described in those gospels.

You have no way of knowing what Jesus wrote from heaven, and piped it down through men as He promised He would,

 

[Tiberius]

Try posting intelligent stuff rather than venom.

I have done. You have utterly failed to argue against and so you pretend it was never produced.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Tap dance all you like you have nothing.

Tap dance all you like, you have nothing.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

You have no way of knowing what Jesus wrote from heaven, and piped it down through men as He promised He would,

Tap dance all you like, you have nothing.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Not true. Link?



No clue in other words. OK. You cannot see time in a telescope. Really. As for trig, it works fine as long as we know what the lines represent. In the case of deep space and drawing a line to a star, you assume that space and time are the same in all three lines, one of which is in this solar system area.

Tap dance all you like, you have nothing.

 

[dad]

I have done. You have utterly failed to argue against and so you pretend it was never produced.

It is not intelligent to pretend you made a case for your so called science when you failed. Link?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Right, I notice how they grab a few articles of faith from their little theory bag to use to possibly explain one of the most massive stars in the area up and disappearing! The choice they forgot to offer us was 'maybe our whole darn faith based, godless methods of modelling God's creation are wrong'.

It has not up and gone.
We are simply unable to detect its present state.
and so are unable to determine what that state is.

There is always something else to learn.
That this is the first of its kind, that we know about, is hardly surprising as we can not detect it or them.
There are probably umpteen more that we have never been able to detect either.

At least we now know that there is something to try to find.
Even if it turns out to have become a black hole, as some scientists have suggested.

There is massively more for us to find out about the universe than we have already learned.
this is just one such example.
There is no need to just give up and say "God did it."
That is a cop out.

 

[oldbadger]

Naturally, science is clueless as to why.

"From 2001 to 2011, the light from the galaxy consistently showed evidence that it hosted a 'luminous blue variable' star some 2.5 million times brighter than the Sun. Stars of this type are unstable, showing occasional dramatic shifts in their spectra and brightness. Even with those shifts, luminous blue variables leave specific traces scientists can identify, but they were absent from the data the team collected in 2019, leaving them to wonder what had happened to the star. "It would be highly unusual for such a massive star to disappear without producing a bright supernova explosion," says Allan."

A cosmic mystery: ESO telescope captures the disappearance of a massive star

Could it be their theories are wrong?

Ha

You said that science is clueless, and then showed that they have clues. Duh!

These massive stars can have very short lifespans, and possibly the most massive do not explode in to supernova at the point of producing iron, maybe they are so huge that they implode in to black holes? Maybe they just disappear?

These stars are massive, for instance the red giant betelgeuse which is nearing its end is so big that its surface circumference would reach out to Jupiter. Amazing.

 

[Polymath257]

Not true. Link?

No clue in other words. OK. You cannot see time in a telescope. Really. As for trig, it works fine as long as we know what the lines represent. In the case of deep space and drawing a line to a star, you assume that space and time are the same in all three lines, one of which is in this solar system area.

And if you get consistent results, those assumptions are verified. Given the short time period (less than a few hundred light years), the curvature of space and/or time is small (and can be measured via lensing effects). So parallax and trigonometry are accurate to within a percent or so. Furthermore, you can measure the speed of the events on some stars (decay of radioactive elements, for example) and that tests whether time works the same at that distance.

The net result is that there *are* places where space and time curvature are relevant, but not those stars within parallax range (relevant for neutron stars and black holes). Nor are these major factors for even close galaxies. And that is quite sufficient to destroy the literal timeline of the Bible.

Now, I predict once again that you will go into denial.

 

[Polymath257]

Tap dance all you like you have nothing. It is science that assumes all things were as they were and must evidence the claim. Pretending other beliefs have some burden of proof for you is hypocrisy.

And that burden of proof is met by the consistency of the results. if the basic model was not basically correct (spacetime distortions large enough to destroy distance measurements, for example), that would be quite clear in the details.

 

[Polymath257]

You have no way of knowing what Jesus wrote from heaven, and piped it down through men as He promised He would,

Nice myth. Any evidence?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

It is not intelligent to pretend you made a case for your so called science when you failed. Link?

Tap dance all you like, you have nothing.

 

[dad]

It has not up and gone.
We are simply unable to detect its present state.

Well, it left no trace and you cannot detect it. The issue here is not whether you can speculate that it is still here or not.

That this is the first of its kind, that we know about, is hardly surprising as we can not detect it or them.

If it was really a star as big and bright as they they claimed, it would be surprising indeed. If their idea of what is really out there and how it all works was wrong...not so surprising.

There are probably umpteen more that we have never been able to detect either.

The one that was detected is the issue here.

At least we now know that there is something to try to find.

Right, a star that is millions of times brighter than the sun, and more than twice as big that you think is playing hide and go seek!

Even if it turns out to have become a black hole, as some scientists have suggested.

I think someone posted that it would take some time to see evidence of that. How long do you think it would take?

There is massively more for us to find out about the universe than we have already learned.

The issue here is with what they think they learned already and is false.

There is no need to just give up and say "God did it."

I do not see any need for God to run around making stars blink, or etc. It seems He set up nature and rules that result in things happening. On earth, part of the system He set in order for nature is spiritual beings! There are angels in charge of the air, the sea, etc.There is also a clear and distinct spiritual component to the universe and stars! The real reasons for many things we see are not known.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Ah, the tap dancing continues. Still no evidence for the wild claims against science.

 

[dad]

You said that science is clueless, and then showed that they have clues. Duh!

Absolutely false. They have claims! Not clues. NO distances to any star are known and no sizes. When they spout off claims of a star so far away and more massive than the sun, etc that is not clue based, but belief based.

These massive stars can have very short lifespans,

You have no idea how small or massive they are, or lifespans.You are reciting facets of your system of belief.

and possibly the most massive do not explode in to supernova at the point of producing iron, maybe they are so huge that they implode in to black holes? Maybe they just disappear?

Maybe the cookie monster eats them? You can guess all the day long.

These stars are massive,

We do not know that. To know distances we must have time and space the same all the way to a star. We do not know it is the same. Man has not been further than the moon. Even probes have not been a light day away yet!

for instance the red giant betelgeuse which is nearing its end is so big that its surface circumference would reach out to Jupiter. Amazing.

Say it like you mean it! Ha.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Is there evidence that the laws of nature were different in the past or are different in other points in the universe? No evidence has been presented on this often repeated claim.

 

[dad]

And if you get consistent results, those assumptions are verified.

How would you get results of what time is like in deep space (consistent or not) from a telescope?

Given the short time period (less than a few hundred light years), the curvature of space and/or time is small (and can be measured via lensing effects)

Show us how lensing gives distance to a star?

. So parallax and trigonometry are accurate to within a percent or so.

Only if the time and space in a base line from our solar system are equal to space and time out in far space. That is not known.

Furthermore, you can measure the speed of the events on some stars (decay of radioactive elements, for example) and that tests whether time works the same at that distance.

No you can't. You cannot go out there and measure anything. You sit here in the fishbowl and wait for light or waves to enter here. You measure that here.

The net result is that there *are* places where space and time curvature are relevant,

We do not know how far away what we see as bent light is. Nor do we know what may bend it other than things we know about here in the fishbowl.

but not those stars within parallax range (relevant for neutron stars and black holes). Nor are these major factors for even close galaxies. And that is quite sufficient to destroy the literal timeline of the Bible.

False, your distances are destroyed! (and time claimed)

 

[dad]

Is there evidence that the laws of nature were different in the past or are different in other points in the universe? No evidence has been presented on this often repeated claim.

Yes. History and the bible. Now is there scientific evidence that nature was the same on earth?