Marriage and sex

[MoonWater]

This thread is largely inspired by the idea prevalent in the abrahamic faiths that one should avoid sexual relations until one is married. What I wish to debate here is exactly what that means or entails. Is it just the signed papers that make one married in the eyes of the law? if so why? Why does a signed piece of paper make any difference in whether or not the couple sleeping together is committing sin or not? Is it possible to be "married" without having a legal document that says you are married? If so, how or under what circumstances would this be possible?

Bonus hypothetical: if you take two couples that are equally dedicated to eachother, equally loving, have been together equally as long, and are equally everything you would expect to find in an ideal married couple yet one couple does not have a marriage license, is that couple still "living in sin" if they have sex? Why or why not?

 

[Madhuri]

It's been the same in Hinduism throughout history. I agree with the idea, though I would not call it sin.
What you must realise is that before recent times there wasn't much contraceptives. A lot of women used to fall pregnant and have to raise the child alone and because of culture, she probably wouldn't attract a husband because of this. She is left a single mother without security. Of course, this happens a lot today as well.

I think that this has a lot to do with religions teaching against illicit sex. It's much safer to have sex within a marriage so that the children and woman are more likely to prosper in a secure situation. Of course there are also issues such as disease and rape. Men used to force themselves on women much mroe than they do now. It was practically a norm in many cutures.

Of course now a days there a different problem. We have abortion. For some people its practically an excuse to have unsafe sex outside of marriage because they have this to fall back on in an emergency. Abortions happen all the time. Thousands a year and mostly due to premarital 'mistakes'. Considering how religions feel about the unborn fetus, it becomes a wise decision to leave sex to marriage so as to avoid these different issues and problematic situations.

Now what usually happens in societies is that the reasons for a rule or discipline are lost through time and the context is forgotten. When most of the scriptures were compiled, they were done so in a particular context. A new context might render some of these teaching less relevent. After all, we don't see Christians killing their own children for being disrespectful or disobeying orders now do we. And the reason? They say the context has changed and killing your own child isn't relevent any more.

Well, maybe sex within marriage alone isn't quite as relevent anymore. I certianly don't have a problem with it but I know that in past times I would not have willingly had sex before I was married. Contexts change. Move with them.

 

[Herr Heinrich]

This thread is largely inspired by the idea prevalent in the abrahamic faiths that one should avoid sexual relations until one is married. What I wish to debate here is exactly what that means or entails. Is it just the signed papers that make one married in the eyes of the law? if so why? Why does a signed piece of paper make any difference in whether or not the couple sleeping together is committing sin or not? Is it possible to be "married" without having a legal document that says you are married? If so, how or under what circumstances would this be possible?

Bonus hypothetical: if you take two couples that are equally dedicated to eachother, equally loving, have been together equally as long, and are equally everything you would expect to find in an ideal married couple yet one couple does not have a marriage license, is that couple still "living in sin" if they have sex? Why or why not?

In Christianity being married usually means being married by a pastor/priest/etc. You know cause the omnimax god totally needed a ritual to see that two people love each other and want to spend their lives together. Really marriage is a ritual created by humans to make it special. That is what a ritual is. Taking something everyday and making it special.
To answer other questions; it is a matter of opinion what sin is. I do not think it is a sin to have sex with someone you love. All those rules and regulations are man-made. It was whatever they though was right.