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Many faces of Fascism

Discussion in 'Political Debates' started by PopeADope, Jun 16, 2019.

  1. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    Please dear Moderator, this isn't like my other political threads. I feel it an important and appropriate topic and must speak from the heart. I don't see this as proselytizing but rather sharing my views on a passionate topic and asking for a second opinion.

    Fascism is alive and well in our current world and arguably has more power now than in the past, with Russia, America, Japan, and other nations embracing it under a different name and different face.

    The parades, the nifty uniforms, despising political correctness, the self-discipline, the spirituality, patriotism, charismatic leadership, and the intense love, zeal, and fervor for one's nation (and faith of one's fathers), is not a bad thing intrinsically, right? I'm all about that and the propaganda too, but in no way do I think it is okay to physically aggress on people based upon their ethnicity or Religion, and in no way do I approve of wars of aggression. So, am I still a Fascist?

    Yes, still a Fascist, just love leftists, because when I meet a radical liberal, I say to myself " I'm a perv, a criminal, an addict, and have too many faults to consider myself better than a liberal" or better than someone of another ethnicity. I think Ethnic Nationalism is gross as well! Yet am fanatic about a state essentially becoming the government of God and controlled by the kingdom of Heaven, and that was the goal of Fascism as written in the "Doctrine of Fascism".

    Christ had to be humiliated and fail before he could succeed and conquer the Roman Empire, where Fascism flourished. The blood of the martyrs was also "the seed of Christendom". That is how Fascism succeeds and spreads. You win by first losing. There is no glorious resurrection without a brutal crucifixion. Fascism keeps Resurrecting and now has control of Mother Russia, it's previously greatest nemesis. It is in Japan, Russia, returning to Europe, and found in America under a different name. Right wing government arguably has more power in our world now than ever before.


    Mussolini worked with the Pope, obeyed the Pope, and was the voice of the Pope, always echoing the Pope on faith and morals. Fascism was originally the government of the Roman Catholic Church in Europe and predated Mussolini, but Mussolini wrote the Doctrine of this ancient government, defending it from the frequent attacks of secular Marxism spreading from the Soviet Union. Japan has always been Fascist and their Emperor was basically hoping to Pope Asia as well. Fascism is deeply spiritual/religious, and so I love that as well as it's defense of a nations values, culture, dynasty, and traditions, with intense hysteric patriotism and sacrifice from her people. Fascism has many forms that are not racist or antisemetic and Mussolini had Jews on his original fascist party. There were Fascists who helped rescue Jews from Hitler as well.

    Yet I despise the violence that became of Fascism and wonder why such patriotism must turn into violent wars of aggression. One of my theories is that fear of Communism fueled the violence from the far-right, for a scared animal is the most dangerous, and people were terrified of rapidly spreading communism, which killed more people than any other form of government.

    This is a second topic and question I'd like to ask. War was declared on Hitler for invading Poland. The Soviets invaded Poland at the same time and had an alliance with Hitler. We had just as much reason to declare war on the Soviets. What would we think if America was an ally of an Adolf Hitler? We'd be ashamed! Yet America gets to be allied with the Soviet Union who was worse and guilty of more crimes against humanity. Why the double standard? Our education system isn't fair.
     
  2. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    Fascism is dead. The right-wing populism in vogue now is not fascism. Most neo-Nazis don't even actually follow National Socialism (most of them are degenerates according to that ideology and would've been shipped off to a concentration camp themselves).
     
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  3. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    Fascists these days don't call themselves fascists except a tiny fanatic group that is usually racist, and I want nothing to do with such people. Communists also rarely call themselves communist anymore, but Lenin said "the end goal of socialism is communism".

    It is true that Fascism does not resemble Mussolini's Italy these days. Yet Fascism exists in the Roman Catholic Church and always has. Fascism can have more than one interpretation and Vladimir Putin and Shinzo Abe are declared to be Fascists, and there is merit to that claim. Fascism will also always appear different regarding the nation that is practicing it. It has many forms, interpretations, and traditions, like any religion. Fascist Japan was way different than Fascist Italy or Germany. Fascist Spain was it's own form of Catholic Falangism.

    We will simply have to disagree, but I appreciate views that challenge my own, and that was the purpose of this thread.
     
  4. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    You're basically making the concept meaningless by stretching it so thin. Putin and Abe are not fascists. If it doesn't look like fascism, then it's not fascism. It is an actual worldview and ideology, you know.
     
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  5. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    Shinzo Abe gets criticized for bows before enshrined Japanese war criminals, insists on glorifying his country, wishes to restore the emperor to his former position and glory, is bringing back Shintoism to public schools, is a right-wing nationalist who wants his people to be proud of their Nation, traditions, culture, and religion, and in many ways he is restorind state Shintoism or at least trying to.. that does resemble fascism very much.
     
    #5 PopeADope, Jun 16, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  6. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    Nationalism and traditionalism is not fascism. Fascism's a lot more than that.
     
  7. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    So Frank, am I a friggin fascist lol?
     
  8. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    I study the doctrine of fascism, but Mussolini is not actually the founder of fascism. It predates him.

    Nationalism and traditionalism are indeed a big part of fascism, yes the words are certainly not synonymous.
     
  9. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    I don't know. You don't seem to support imperialism and worship violence as Fascists do.
     
  10. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    Yes, Mussolini largely ripped off Gabriele D'Annunzio, who had more interesting ideas than Mussolini (for example, in his thinking, artists and poets were the Ubermensch of society, which is kind of cool).

    Right, but you wouldn't call all nationalists Fascists.
     
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  11. The Reverend Bob

    The Reverend Bob Well-Known Member

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  12. Labourwave

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    It's honestly really hilarious that you fault the Soviets for having a non-aggression pact with the Nazis when the political leaders you like openly were allied with the Nazis
     
  13. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    I primarily fault the Soviets for the blood they shed and for invading Poland when Hitler did it.

    I fault Mussolini for an alliance with Hitler as well.
     
  14. PopeADope

    PopeADope Habemus papam

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    I don't have much beef at all with the non-aggression pact, I just add that to the list
     
  15. Labourwave

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    What would you rather they do? Give control of the entire region to Hitler?

    oh wait nevermind you're a bigoted fascist.
     
  16. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    :toilet:
     
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  17. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    I don't know a lot about fascism. I do know that Britain acted very weakly during the Munich agreement under Neville Chamberlain.

    ...I'd rather be a fascist than whatever weakness it was that Britain subscribed to at that time.
     
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  18. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    #18 Landon Caeli, Jun 16, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  19. dianaiad

    dianaiad Well-Known Member

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    Well, shoot.

    Nobody knows what a fascist IS, actually, or how to define 'fascism.' It's a word, like 'cult' that is used mostly as a pejorative. Nobody that I have ever come across can actually define what a fascist government/regime/attitude actually is, what it's properties are, and what one must be in order to qualify AS 'fascist."

    It is a word that is used to mean: "your politics are wrong, I don't agree with you, and I don't like you."

    Rather like "cult," which means "your beliefs are weird and I don't like you."

    Then of course every negative thing that one can come up with can be ascribed to the accused 'fascist' or 'cultist,' and it's OK, because of COURSE the accused is guilty of eating babies or lynching black people or beating up old men or pushing grandma off a cliff BECAUSE he is a 'fascist' or a 'cultist.'

    It gets a little old.

    If someone could actually identify "fascism' in a way that would be recognized by everybody, that would help.
     
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  20. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    I admit. I honestly have no idea what a fascist is.

    ...I know somebody is going to make fun of me now, but at least I was honest.
     
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