Lying

[IndigoChild5559]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?

Is it a sin to use God’s name when you lie?

And what are the consequences for sinning in the name of God? Do God punish them for each lie people tell?

Sometimes lying is the moral thing to do. It is wrong to tell the truth if this means harm to an innocent person.

I don't swear in God's name.

Doing evil in God's name is a great evil. I am unsure if there is an afterlife, so I'm not certain there is any punishment. Certainly Judaism teaches that we all spend some time in Gehinnom getting purified of our wrongs.

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

Is it considered lying if you omit the truth? Well, I don't lie by omitting the truth or admitting lies either way.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Is it considered lying if you omit the truth? Well, I don't lie by omitting the truth or admitting lies either way.

The lying is in the deceit, not the words.

 

[Jainarayan]

I'd imagine it would be morally acceptable to lie were it done to save another human (or yourself) from being murdered

Or other danger. Yes, without question.

A famous parable from Buddhist literature, recounted in the Lotus Sutra, is that of the burning house. A fire breaks out in a many-roomed house. The father escapes, but his children are still inside, distracted by games and other pleasures. The father must lure the children out using what would attract each—one kind of gift for the youngest, another kind for another child, and yet another for the third. Once they escape the burning house each child receives an even better reward: liberation. In the same way, teachers will guide each student differently, in accordance with their unique needs and disposition, though for all the goal is the same: awakening, or liberation. What is skillful means (upaya)?

Now, that is an example from Buddhism but the idea is to know when, and how, and why to employ the technique, i.e. tell a lie.

 

[osgart]

I always defined lying as telling deceptive falsehoods with the intention of harm towards an innocent person. Simply saying something false to someone is not lying. There could be very good reasons to tell a falsehood to someone who doesn't deserve to hear the honest truth of a matter; survival and defense come to mind.

There's no good reason to lie.

 

[jbg]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?

Is it a sin to use God’s name when you lie?

And what are the consequences for sinning in the name of God? Do God punish them for each lie people tell?

My rabbi points out that the commandment is against false swearing. If someone asks how they look, you are not under any obligation to tell the person they look like they’ll run over by a truck.

 

[InChrist]

Perhaps lying for god, is not accurate, but lying for one’s religion, often to prevent scandals.

For instances, such as hiding or covering up scandals, to protect the religions or sects, as in the case of child abuse committed by clergy. The leadership of the churches have hidden these crime from authorities for decades.

Should these leaders be held responsible for these cover-ups? Is cover-up considered a lie? Are such lies considered to be sins?

Yes, those leaders covering up abusive situations should be held accountable. They are definitely liars and lying in such a way at the expense and harm of others under their spiritual care is certainly sin.

 

[InChrist]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?

Is it a sin to use God’s name when you lie?

And what are the consequences for sinning in the name of God? Do God punish them for each lie people tell?

In some situations lying may be the moral thing to do to save innocent lives. Corrie Ten Boom lied to the Nazis about hiding Jews to save their lives.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

Perhaps lying for god, is not accurate, but lying for one’s religion, often to prevent scandals. For instances, such as hiding or covering up scandals, to protect the religions or sects, as in the case of child abuse committed by clergy. The leadership of the churches have hidden these crime from authorities for decades.

I’d say that this is as much a serious spiritual sin as it is a great worldly one! It is enabling a perpetrator to continue to spread suffering onto others.

Should these leaders be held responsible for these cover-ups? Is cover-up considered a lie? Are such lies considered to be sins?

In many countries, refraining from notifying authorities and/or concealing information about serious crime, is breaking the law and such individuals can be prosecuted in court.

That said, spiritually speaking, it is not for Man to pass judgement on his brother. We can judge crimes but sins are dealt with by God.


Humbly
Hermit

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?

Is it a sin to use God’s name when you lie?

And what are the consequences for sinning in the name of God? Do God punish them for each lie people tell?

Yes, it can be morally acceptable to lie.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

"Pious fraud is a term applied to describe fraudulent practices used to advance a religious cause or belief. This type of fraud may, by religious apologists, be explained as a case of the ends justify the means, in that if people are saved from eternal damnation, then it's perfectly fine to tell a few fibs and perform some magic tricks."

"What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church … a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them." - Martin Luther

Luther said many wise things …but the above, I’d stay clear from. It’s far too broad for my liking.

Humbly
Hermit

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie

I cut out the rest of the post as it doesn't apply to me, being an atheist.

To answer this abbreviated question, I think the answer is obviously "YES".

The cliché example being when the Gestapo came to your house in 1942 asking you if you know where jews are hiding. Suppose you know there are some hiding it out in the barn accross the street. Telling the truth means certain death for them. Lying saves them.

How is it not morally acceptable to lie in that scenario?

If there is one example where it is, then there are others also.

 

[loverofhumanity]

I don't lie, it's just a thing i have, i loath liers, I'd prefer an honest thief to a liar. I need no god for this
Of course i may be economical with the truth sometimes, when needed.

Lying can cover up terrible things like murder and rape and all sorts of other criminal behaviour that’s why it’s so bad.

 

[1213]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?
...

I have understood lying is always wrong. But, lies can be forgiven.

 

[pearl]

Maybe whether or not one tells another the truth depends on the other's right to know.

 

[ChristineM]

Maybe whether or not one tells another the truth depends on the other's right to know.

If someone does not have a right to know i won't tell them. Keeping them ignorant is far better than lying

 

[Elihoenai]

Is it ever morally acceptable to lie, especially if you were lying for your god, lying for one of your prophets, messiahs or messengers, or for your religion?

Is it a sin to use God’s name when you lie?

And what are the consequences for sinning in the name of God? Do God punish them for each lie people tell?

Psalm 116:11

11 I said in my haste, All men are liars.

Romans 3:4

4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.


Every Man/Person on the Planet is a Liar. If any Christian tells you otherwise they are Lying on a thread about Lying.

To Stop Lying you Must Return to Elohim/God.

Elohim's/God's Ladder:
Flesh->Soul->Spirit

 

[ChristineM]

Every Man/Person on the Planet is a Liar. If any Christian tells you otherwise they are Lying on a thread about Lying.

I am not christian and i find that comment to be insulting. I find lying to be abhorrent, i would prefer an honest thief than a liar, i do not lie.

To Stop Lying you Must Return to Elohim/God.

And that too is insulting. The biggest liars i have come across are followers of the christian faith and their god

 

[IndigoChild5559]

And that too is insulting. The biggest liars i have come across are followers of the christian faith and their god

You find Christians to be bigger liars than anyone else? That's just sheer bigotry.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I'm not fond of lying. I am almost pathologically honest at times. But even I am not immune. At the very least, I have committed what are referred to as white lies that spare the feelings of others.

I think the biggest lies we tell are to ourselves. Again, not immune, but I make efforts to minimize the occurrence or minimize the impact when I fail with the former.