Lucifer & Satan: Same, different, or what?

[Desert Snake]

How do you explain 2 Peter 1:19 and Revelation 22:16 (as well as Revelation 2:28 ?)

Are you saying that Lucifer isn't equated, with satan, in the english bible?

 

[Desert Snake]

Dante's Inferno (14th C.) and Milton's Paradise Lost (17th C.) seem to be where the stories equating Lucifer with Satan became widespread, imo.

Ok,

 

[crossfire]

Are you saying that Lucifer isn't equated, with satan, in the english bible?

Yes. In the above quote bible verses. Lucifer is equated with Christ.

 

[74x12]

This thread is for beliefs and opinions regarding Satan and Lucifer.

Same, or different...?

Ideally, a detailed belief, without being too vague, and what are the differences, etc, if you believe they are different.

Satan goes by the name lucifer. That's not all though. Actually, he'll use possibly any name to deceive people.

 

[74x12]

Yes. In the above quote bible verses. Lucifer is equated with Christ.

What you're missing though is that all angels are called morning stars. Even though Jesus is "the bright and morning Star" that doesn't mean there aren't other morning stars.

That is what Job 38:7 is talking about. All the Cherubim are the "morning stars" and "the sons of God".

When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy? (Job 38:7)

 

[Desert Snake]

Satan goes by the name lucifer. That's not all though. Actually, he'll use possibly any name to deceive people.

This is an interesting concept.

 

[crossfire]

What you're missing though is that all angels are called morning stars. Even though Jesus is "the bright and morning Star" that doesn't mean there aren't other morning stars.

That is what Job 38:7 is talking about. All the Cherubim are the "morning stars" and "the sons of God".

When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy? (Job 38:7)

The Cherubim were the two winged creatures at either end of the Ark of the covenant on either side of the Mercy seat, as depicted in Exodus 25

 

[Desert Snake]

What you're missing though is that all angels are called morning stars. Even though Jesus is "the bright and morning Star" that doesn't mean there aren't other morning stars.

That is what Job 38:7 is talking about. All the Cherubim are the "morning stars" and "the sons of God".

When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy? (Job 38:7)

Yes, either it is a VERY general title or word usage, or, it infers to the other entities.

Can't really be both

 

[74x12]

The Cherubim were the two winged creatures at either end of the Ark of the covenant on either side of the Mercy seat, as depicted in Exodus 25

True, it's the name for the heavenly beings. Except there are other types also like Seraphim.

 

[Desert Snake]

We could note that in Isaiah 14:2
This is a literal description of a fallen angel.

Now, considering the usage, it could be surmised that it really means any radiant being.

 

[74x12]

We could note that in Isaiah 14:2
This is a literal description of a fallen angel.

Now, considering the usage, it could be surmised that it really means any radiant being.

The symbolism in Isaiah 14 is that the king of babylon is compared to a fallen angel. So it is applicable to satan.

 

[crossfire]

Ezekiel 28 also compares The King of Tyre with a Cherub (with obvious references to the ark of the covenant) which was banished to the earth. (Presumably, so it could die, just as mentioned in Isaiah 14.)

 

[crossfire]

True, it's the name for the heavenly beings. Except there are other types also like Seraphim.

Exodus 25:18-22

18 Make two cherubim of gold—make them of hammered work—at the two ends of the cover. 19 Make one cherub at one end and the other cherub at the other end; of one piece with the cover shall you make the cherubim at its two ends. 20 The cherubim shall have their wings spread out above, shielding the cover with their wings. They shall confront each other, the faces of the cherubim being turned toward the cover. 21 Place the cover on top of the Ark, after depositing inside the Ark the Pact that I will give you. 22 There I will meet with you, and I will impart to you—from above the cover, from between the two cherubim that are on top of the Ark of the Pact…​

Interesting commentary here:
https://thetorah.com/the-cherubim/

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

This thread is for beliefs and opinions regarding Satan and Lucifer.

Same, or different...?

Ideally, a detailed belief, without being too vague, and what are the differences, etc, if you believe they are different.

Are we playing a Shin Megami Tensei game? Because I normally choose the law or neutral side.

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

I voted the same. Lucifer was one of God's Angels before she rebelled against God, whence she became known as Satan.

Lucifer's a she? Really, because I'll bang her.

 

[Jumi]

Seems like a sloppy translation to me. Lucifer derives "light bringer" not "morning star".

In those times and cultures the morning star was thought to be the light bringer. Sort of like heralding a new day. That's why Jesus is the morning star and light bringer in the New Testament. The fallen king in Isaiah uses the same symbolism.

 

[james blunt]

Lucifer is my human form ...

 

[Jumi]

The symbolism in Isaiah 14 is that the king of babylon is compared to a fallen angel. So it is applicable to satan.

Where in the Hebrew Bible is satan referred to as fallen angel?

 

[74x12]

Where in the Hebrew Bible is satan referred to as fallen angel?

You have to read between the lines.

Jesus said He saw satan fall as lightening from heaven. (Luke 10:18)

 

[Enlil]

Lucifer's a she? Really, because I'll bang her.

Her name was Inanna initially. The name Lucifer came later.

She might have something to say about your intentions towards her.