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Featured Love and Belief

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Fool, Jul 2, 2022.

  1. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    Which is greater, which is a need, love or belief. You can't have both.
     
  2. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    The older I get, the more I find "belief" to be a human conceit that is of little real value in the course of living, and that only serves to support our ignorance and bias.
     
    #2 PureX, Jul 2, 2022
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  3. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    Love, and I tend to go with Gandhi's God is Love.
     
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  4. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Unknown Member
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    Belief is too general. Belief in what? "I believe Troy put the groceries away". It doesn't really prevent me from loving Troy(even if he did indeed forget).
     
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  5. paradox

    paradox (㇏(•̀ᵥᵥ•́)ノ)

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    belief because belief is necessary for inter-relation between people.
    if everyone would have 0 belief in everything then people would not be able coexist, to communicate to do what ever.

    for example I would not believe my doctor and I would likely die soon or face health issues.
     
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  6. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    Maslow never had belief in his hierarchy of needs
     
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  7. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    We can accept all kinds of things as being true without having to "believe in" their truthfulness. For example, I can accept as true the assertion that Joe Biden is mentally capable of handling the responsibilities of the presidency without believing that this is, in fact, true. My acceptance is a practical choice based on likelihood and probability. Whereas my belief would need to be based on some sort of direct experience. But even then, I know I could still be wrong.

    Which is why I think belief is basically just an empty conceit. The fact is that honesty and faith are really all we have to go on. "Belief' is just an unwarranted rejection of skepticism. Something I think we humans should avoid.
     
  8. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    Love is actual. A belief is only a potential.
     
  9. Alien826

    Alien826 Older than dirt

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    Depends what you love and depends what you believe.

    I believe I'll have another beer.
     
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  10. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Unknown Member
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    I love that! (That you'll have another beer; not a beer person myself.)
     
  11. TransmutingSoul

    TransmutingSoul Veteran Member
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    Then neither love or belief is possible, I see they are inseparable.

    "In the hearts of men no real love is found, and the condition is such that, unless their susceptibilities are quickened by some power so that unity, love and accord may develop within them, there can be no healing." (Abdu’l-Bahá, The Promulgation of Universal Peace, p. 171)

    Without a source we face this dilemma;

    "Love is a veil betwixt the lover and the beloved." (Bahá’u’lláh, The Four Valleys, p. 60)

    Thus to find a path to Love, one has to also find belief.

    "The essence of love is for man to turn his heart to the Beloved One, and sever himself from all else but Him, and desire naught save that which is the desire of his Lord." (Bahá’u’lláh, Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 155)

    Regards Tony
     
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  12. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Unknown Member
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    How does that work when one has beliefs that aren't lovng?
     
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  13. TransmutingSoul

    TransmutingSoul Veteran Member
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    So we can have beliefs that are not Loving and we can have loving that is not Belief. All this comes about as a construct from the minds of men.

    Love has a source, and that source is all the Attributes. All the attributes can only be understood by the example given, which is the Messenger from God. Belief allows us to explore the full potential of Love. Thus they are unseperatable

    Without the source, both Belief and Love become what we make of it.

    Love can become a hollow word, to some it may only mean sex, whereas Love is the sum of all the attributes.

    Belief likewise a hollow word, taking on the form we choose and not focused on the source of Love.

    Regards Tony
     
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  14. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    Why can't you have both?
    Of course you can.
     
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  15. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    Because some will use belief to commit sin. Love covers all sins.

    Proverbs 10:12
     
  16. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    That verse doesn't say anything about belief being wrong. You would have to throw out half the Bible to take that position.
    Why would you think belief means you can't love? That makes no sense.
    Everyone has beliefs.
     
  17. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    The pharisees believed and got it wrong. Jesus said that he had come and told them. So they had no excuse for their sin.
     
  18. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    And others believed and were saved by their belief. True beliefs cause love.
     
  19. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    God is love. God isn't caused by your belief
     
  20. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say he was. But human love can be caused by belief in God.
     
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