Lies and Phony Caricatures of Christianity

[usfan]

You said I had an "anti-Christian agenda.

if you promote anti-christian lies and false narratives, then that is a logical conclusion. Though i doubt i 'accused!' you of this. I dismissed the false accusations as 'smears from an anti-christian agenda', as a possibility. It still seems very plausible, as a theory of human behavior.

You made the charge that the claim

You made the charge that the claim that the bible contained errors is a false narrative,

You accused progressive scholars of spreading a false narrative aimed at sullying Christianity.

'YOU ACCUSE!!'
ROFL!
I dismiss the accusations, and offer plausible explanations for why some people seem hell bent on disparaging Christianity.

The accusations are from those promoting the lies and false narratives. I can only dismiss them.

But the reasons for this obvious anti-christian agenda could vary:

1. Deliberate deception and smears from a competing worldview.
2. Indoctrination. Bobbleheads nodding at the accusations, with no critical examination of the facts.
3. Hostility toward xtianity for other reasons.. molested by priests, or such.
4. The success of propaganda. Lies repeated loudly, and gullible people believe them.

Maybe there are other reasons for believing and promoting lies and smears toward Christianity.. i don't know..

 

[usfan]

We do believe that there are errors in the bible.

Really?

It is obvious WHAT you believe, about xtianity. My challenge is to EVIDENCE those beliefs with facts, not half baked theories, revisionism, and hostile propaganda.

Otherwise, all you have are smears and accusations, with no evidence.

Try it:
1. Make your charge.
2. Support it.
3. It can then be examined, and a rebuttal offered.

 

[sojourner]

if you promote anti-christian lies and false narratives, then that is a logical conclusion.

1) What do you consider to be "anti-Christian lies?"
2) You have yet to prove that these are false narratives. When you can do that, we'll talk.

The accusations are from those promoting the lies and false narratives. I can only dismiss them.

You need to prove that they're false narratives. You haven't done that as yet.

 

[sojourner]

Really?

It is obvious WHAT you believe, about xtianity. My challenge is to EVIDENCE those beliefs with facts, not half baked theories, revisionism, and hostile propaganda.

Otherwise, all you have are smears and accusations, with no evidence.

Try it:
1. Make your charge.
2. Support it.
3. It can then be examined, and a rebuttal offered.

I've done that.


Crickets from you.

 

[sojourner]

Really?

It is obvious WHAT you believe, about xtianity. My challenge is to EVIDENCE those beliefs with facts, not half baked theories, revisionism, and hostile propaganda.

Otherwise, all you have are smears and accusations, with no evidence.

Try it:
1. Make your charge.
2. Support it.
3. It can then be examined, and a rebuttal offered.

Can you prove your assertion? Can you prove that there are no errors in the bible? From where I'm sitting, with all the evidence I have, your assertion is a false narrative that undermines Christian integrity.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Care to present ONE alleged error? Quote the offending passage, then source the evidence that proves 'error!' Else, all you have is innuendo allusion, and loudly repeated propaganda.

I already have. But since you failed to respond rationally to it I must first ask you to clearly define what you mean by "error".

Are the clear myths of the Bible "errors"?

Are the failed prophecies of the Bible "errors"?

And please, no false claims. You are merely accusing others of your sins.

 

[Subduction Zone]

A reminder:

1. Make your charge.
2. Support it.
3. It can then be examined, and a rebuttal offered.

I can only dismiss assertions and unevidenced accusations. If you really want to debate any of these charges, do it.

That has been done several times. You have yet to rebut anything. You do not even appear to have examined anything.

 

[oldbadger]

Please post the verses in Matthew that you are referring to.

These are the verses, which long after they were spoken are simply reporting what happened. If they were reported now, 2000 years later, it would not be any kind of deception, simply a report.

Matthew:
{20:17} And Jesus going up to Jerusalem took the twelve
disciples apart in the way, and said unto them, {20:18}
Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, {20:19} And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify [him:] and the third day he shall rise again.

 

[sooda]

These are the verses, which long after they were spoken are simply reporting what happened. If they were reported now, 2000 years later, it would not be any kind of deception, simply a report.

Matthew:
{20:17} And Jesus going up to Jerusalem took the twelve
disciples apart in the way, and said unto them, {20:18}
Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, {20:19} And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify [him:] and the third day he shall rise again.

I am not playing "gotcha", dear friend.. I think you have to consider who Matthew was and when the Book of Matthew was written.

All roads were "up" to Jerusalem.. See altitude above sea level.

Do remember that MOST prophesy was written after the fact. Its called Vaticinium ex eventu.

 

[oldbadger]

LOL!

'Wriggling?' You think I'm hooked on your transparent ad hom streams?
ROFL!!

You just want a pissy 'Atheists vs Christians!' flame war, to evade the topic.

I'm still waiting for many answers from you, but the one about Christian charities paying for hospitals would be a good one. I asked you to name five Christian founded hospitals on Christian charity.

Still waiting...... then you can answer all the others.

You have not stepped up to the line once.

Do you want to 'debate' the topic, or deflect with provocation? Your call. I can't refute ad hom, only return more ad hom, and that just derails the thread.. ..perhaps that is your goal?

All human motivations & desires have some kind of self interest. That is supposed to damn Christianity?

You miss the point. The sacrifice of Christ was the ultimate SELFLESS ACT, giving His life for those who were His enemies. I explained this once. You can believe whatever you want, but your 'interpretation' is not compelling absolute truth.

We have not been discussing Jesus, but Christian extremism and its wicked ideas not supported by Jesus.

Anyway, what denomination, Church or Creed do you belong to?

There's a start.

 

[oldbadger]

I am not playing "gotcha", dear friend.. I think you have to consider who Matthew was and when the Book of Matthew was written.

All roads were "up" to Jerusalem.. See altitude above sea level.

Do remember that MOST prophesy was written after the fact. Its called Vaticinium ex eventu.

You asked about a specific passage. I answered.
There is nothing wrong with reporting or claiming a prophecy. The OT is full of 'em.

People from where I live go 'up' to London but it is at sea level and due West of here, not even North. Do you think that those folks are all liars?

Going to the Temple city could quite reasonably be referred to as 'Up to'

By the way, you don't think that I believe Matthew 20 17-19 do you? That verse was quoted by another member, I simply told that member that a prophecy is not proof that it happened.

Question: Is English your first language?

 

[sooda]

I'm still waiting for many answers from you, but the one about Christian charities paying for hospitals would be a good one. I asked you to name five Christian founded hospitals on Christian charity.

Still waiting...... then you can answer all the others.

You have not stepped up to the line once.





We have not been discussing Jesus, but Christian extremism and its wicked ideas not supported by Jesus.

Anyway, what denomination, Church or Creed do you belong to?

There's a start.

Lots of mainstream Protestant churches have gone the way of the Rapture Ready fundamentalists since the late 1980s.

Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey have had a profound affect on American Christianity.

 

[oldbadger]

Who is trying to shove anything down people's throats?


Oh, yeah.. that would be you, demanding that everyone accept your bigoted, revisionist, disparaging accusations about Christianity.

Your dogmatic clinging to lies and half truths, spin and revisionism, to force a demeaning caricature of the only ideology that brings hope to humanity is blatantly hostile. Some of us will not bite, or eat any of the garbage you try to force down our throats. If you and your bobbleheaded cronies want to eat that crap, fine. Bon appetit.

Another rant..........
But no Christian founded and fully funded hospitals yet. I asked for five.

Your claims are shallow, methinks.

 

[oldbadger]

<Yawn> Ignore.

 

[sooda]

You asked about a specific passage. I answered.
There is nothing wrong with reporting or claiming a prophecy. The OT is full of 'em.

People from where I live go 'up' to London but it is at sea level and due West of here, not even North. Do you think that those folks are all liars?

Going to the Temple city could quite reasonably be referred to as 'Up to'

By the way, you don't think that I believe Matthew 20 17-19 do you? That verse was quoted by another member, I simply told that member that a prophecy is not proof that it happened.

Question: Is English your first language?

Yes. English is my first language. Jerusalem is probably 2,000 feet above Jericho, or a little more.

I'm not speaking of London.

 

[sojourner]

Still waiting...... then you can answer all the others.

You have not stepped up to the line once.

Don't hold your breath... the poster hasn't answered my challenges either -- and probably won't.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Don't hold your breath... the poster hasn't answered my challenges either -- and probably won't.

Or mine. He will not tell us what he considers an "error". All he does is to deny.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes. English is my first language. Jerusalem is probably 2,000 feet above Jericho, or a little more.

I'm not speaking of London.

I do think that @oldbadger has a valid point. "Down to Jerusalem" or "Up to Jerusalem" do not have to indicate North or South or even a change in elevation. They tend to be local colloquialisms. I spent a lot of time in Minneapolis which has both a "Downtown" and an "Uptown". Elevation wise I do not think there is any difference. And though colloquially we would say "up north" in Minnesota Uptown was south of Downtown.

 

[sojourner]

I do think that @oldbadger has a valid point. "Down to Jerusalem" or "Up to Jerusalem" do not have to indicate North or South or even a change in elevation. They tend to be local colloquialisms. I spent a lot of time in Minneapolis which has both a "Downtown" and an "Uptown". Elevation wise I do not think there is any difference. And though colloquially we would say "up north" in Minnesota Uptown was south of Downtown.

Yeah, I think that’s a weak argument, no offense to Sooda.

 

[oldbadger]

Don't hold your breath... the poster hasn't answered my challenges either -- and probably won't.

Yep.
The thing is, I think that the way in which the OP has written various posts on this thread has damaged Christianity more than if a bunch of screaming die-hard atheists had organised it all.
It seems like a ciovert assault .........