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Liberal: staying positive and focused election thoughts

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
There's so much sewage flowing about the election including from those who are ready to give up before a single vote is counted and others who are lying about polls let alone what the Trump party is doing that I feel the need to work on staying optimistic and focused on electing Joe Biden and flipping the Senate.

One of my continuing sources of inspiration is the Lincoln Project's videos. They're not "one of us" but I don't care. We're on the same side for now and that's enough.

 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Another thing that I find helpful is ignoring the "Biden dropping in the polls" crap coming out of the usual sources and looking at facts such as this from 538:

Capture.PNG
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
I have to admit when The Resistance puts out ads like that, I worry. They focus on how Trump is a jerk instead of on policy alternatives that would actually make working people's lives better (because the truth is, the people at the Lincoln Project are mostly fine with Trump's policies).

I truly hope Biden's lead holds and that he starts talking to the American people about his specific policy agenda that will improve the lives of working class people who voted for Obama in 2012 and Trump in 2016, or people who were too disgusted or apathetic to vote at all. That's how we win. That's how we flip the Senate.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I'm not getting too assured that Biden will win. The best I can hope for if he loses, is that the Senate somehow still manages to flip to Democrat.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
I think part of the problem was just that the "Biden is 12+ points ahead" stuff could have potentially been based on overly quick, knee jerk conclusions and murky studies.
It's based on the polling over a period of time as my graphic shows. There's nothing murky about it if you have time to read extensive comments about how it works.

Pollster Ratings shows rating score and bias as discussed here We’ve Updated Our Pollster Ratings Ahead Of The 2020 General Election
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
I have to admit when The Resistance puts out ads like that, I worry. They focus on how Trump is a jerk instead of on policy alternatives that would actually make working people's lives better (because the truth is, the people at the Lincoln Project are mostly fine with Trump's policies).

I truly hope Biden's lead holds and that he starts talking to the American people about his specific policy agenda that will improve the lives of working class people who voted for Obama in 2012 and Trump in 2016, or people who were too disgusted or apathetic to vote at all. That's how we win. That's how we flip the Senate.
Most people don't vote on policy but on emotion. Love it or hate it that's the way it works. Biden is running as a kind, caring grandfather who you can tell your troubles to and who will try to make you feel better and help solve what ails you.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Biden's GOP endorsements show the cracks in Trump's coalition

Joe Biden is attracting more crossover endorsements from prominent members of the opposing party than any other presidential candidate from either side in decades. That doesn't guarantee the former vice president victory in November, but history suggests it could signal a lasting break in the Republican coalition that provides new opportunities to Democrats for years to come.

The public support for Biden significantly exceeds the number of Republicans who officially endorsed Hillary Clinton against Donald Trump in 2016. In recent decades, experts say, only Bill Clinton in his winning campaign of 1992 and Ronald Reagan in his 1980 landslide attracted anything approaching this level of support from leading members of the opposite party's coalition. But probably no presidential candidate has entirely matched Biden's level of crossover endorsements since Richard Nixon's
...
What makes the defections from Trump especially noteworthy is that the vast majority of Republican renegades are not only indicating they don't intend to vote for Trump but are also taking the long next step to avow that they will vote for Biden. That's unusual.

"It's extraordinary," says John J. Pitney, a political scientist at Claremont McKenna College and a former Republican congressional aide. "Even in 1964 you had some Republicans who didn't support Barry Goldwater, but not all that many went 'all the way for LBJ.' Maybe with the exception of 1972 with Democrats for Nixon, I can't remember this many prominent figures in a party crossing lines to support the other candidate."
...
A steady stream of GOP endorsements this year for Biden -- highlighted by the early emergence of The Lincoln Project and Republican Voters Against Trump, two groups trying to peel away GOP voters from the President -- has surged into a torrent over the past two weeks. Just since the start of the Democratic National Convention last month, Biden has received public endorsements from a huge roster of Republicans, including about two dozen former House and Senate members, nearly 75 former national security officials in Republican administrations, a group of former Republican Justice Department officials, and hundreds of aides to the three Republican presidential nominees immediately before Trump: Mitt Romney in 2012, McCain in 2008 and George W. Bush in 2004 and 2000.

Over this same period, a former chief of staff and a former assistant secretary at the Department of Homeland Security have both recorded testimonials for the Republican Voters Against Trump group declaring the President unfit to serve.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
I have to admit when The Resistance puts out ads like that, I worry. They focus on how Trump is a jerk instead of on policy alternatives that would actually make working people's lives better (because the truth is, the people at the Lincoln Project are mostly fine with Trump's policies).

I truly hope Biden's lead holds and that he starts talking to the American people about his specific policy agenda that will improve the lives of working class people who voted for Obama in 2012 and Trump in 2016, or people who were too disgusted or apathetic to vote at all. That's how we win. That's how we flip the Senate.

I think you just now mentioned the elephant in the room. Conventional wisdom holds that people vote on emotions, rather than issues, but I think that's a half-truth. While it is true that people vote their feelings -- there is no escaping that (emotions are what motivate us) -- for so many voters, the issues are emotional. Just look at today!

Millions of people out of work. Millions of people are without enough food to feed their families (it's true! Surveys show it.) Millions of people are past due on their rents and unsure where this month's rent payment is coming from. Millions of people are without health care during a pandemic. Millions of people are outraged at the injustices suffered by blacks and people of color. My gods, if those millions of people aren't charged up to 'vote the issues' this cycle, they have paper hearts and paper brains both.

For political reasons, neither Mr. Trump nor Mr. Biden is saying much about those issues just yet. But I wager the first one of them to raise hell about those issues will become our next elected president.

The other thing is, I just cannot image Joe Biden having anything in the way of Senate coattails if he is so foolish as to avoid talking about the major issues facing millions and millions of us. Even those relatively few people who will vote for him based on actually liking him, are unlikely to vote for a senator based on "I like Joe, so I'm voting for John for Senate". Most Biden voters are actually voting against Mr. Trump, not for Mr. Biden. He should not forget that. He needs -- absolutely needs -- to give those people a reason to vote for him.

We are in a really precarious election that is the most important one of our lifetimes to date. It's no time to fool around campaigning on "which one would you rather drink a beer with". Contrary to myth, Karl Rove's famous line didn't even work. Gore won the popular vote.

One positive note: I think Mr. Biden might still win even if he refuses to run on the issues. I don't think he'll flip the Senate, but I still favor him to win.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
In some of the polls, about double the number of eligible voters favor Mr. Biden than the number of likely voters. This gives Mr. Biden an immense and happy opportunity should he be able to turn the eligible voters into voters. I think he can do it, but it I suspect it will take a shift in strategy. He'll need to run more on the issues than he has to date.
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
Most people don't vote on policy but on emotion. Love it or hate it that's the way it works. Biden is running as a kind, caring grandfather who you can tell your troubles to and who will try to make you feel better and help solve what ails you.

My center-left partner said something similar to me the other night. "This isn't an issues election," he said.

I don't think that's entirely true. In 2016 Hillary ran a similar campaign framed on Trump being a bad person rather than on alternative policy ideas. Trump ran on very specific, concrete policies that he hammered incessantly: immigration ban, building the wall, overturning Obamacare. He also made specific overtures to people in the Rust Belt about "bringing back coal." Those are the people who won him the election. These made him the "populist," the guy who was going to shake things up and do things differently than business as usual. That's what people are hungry for.

The more Biden can talk about the concrete ways he would make people's lives better than Trump, the better he'll do, IMHO.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
Please bear in mind that going into election day 2016 Mr Trump's approval rating was 31% -- even lower than it is today. Millions of people who did not like him as a person nevertheless voted for him on the issues that mattered most to them. That's why Mr. Biden has to get off his duff and tell people what he will do for them -- and he has to do it before Mr Trump does it.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
Please bear in mind that going into election day 2016 Mr Trump's approval rating was 31% -- even lower than it is today. Millions of people who did not like him as a person nevertheless voted for him on the issues that mattered most to them. That's why Mr. Biden has to get off his duff and tell people what he will do for them -- and he has to do it before Mr Trump does it.

I agree, with the additional condition that I don't think Biden should debate Trump though - Trump is a seasoned reality TV star and he will pace the room during debate and act like he's stalking Biden around the room and keep bringing up insults and about Hunter Biden. I think Trump knows that if he can control the power dynamic, he can give the illusion to his questioning base who is the more fit leader. And I'm not sure Biden having the facts is enough to counteract that.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
Early voting will soon start in several states with more to follow. By the time the debates come around, it's quite possible that a huge portion of the vote will already have been cast.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Please bear in mind that going into election day 2016 Mr Trump's approval rating was 31% -- even lower than it is today. Millions of people who did not like him as a person nevertheless voted for him on the issues that mattered most to them. That's why Mr. Biden has to get off his duff and tell people what he will do for them -- and he has to do it before Mr Trump does it.
He has been doing that. What more do you want from him?

A reality check on Joe Biden’s Democratic convention promises - Roll Call

Capture.PNG
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
One of the things that is not being brought up here is that 4 years ago Trump was known for personal misdeeds but not governmental ones. We've had 4 years of corruption, screwing people, ripping kids away from parents and so forth. There are many who see that their hopes were dashed by him and their fears realized.

The polls are reflecting that he's lost support from the military and evangelicals because of his policies as POTUS. I noted the evangelical piece above. The military has also been noted in the media including here Trump’s popularity slips in latest Military Times poll — and more troops say they’ll vote for Biden

And let's not forget the Hillary won the popular vote. Only the built-in bias of the Electoral College changed the will of the people to the will of the states.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
He has been doing that. What more do you want from him?

Lots. When was the last time you heard Mr. Biden deliver a visionary speech dealing with an economic issue of great concern to the majority of Americans -- and not just suburban voters? For instance, why isn't he hammering home his economic plans day after day the way Mr. Sanders did? He makes one or two speeches on a limited number of reforms, then goes back to attacking Mr. Trump, as if that's enough. Well, if it's enough, then why are any of the battleground states still within striking distance for Mr. Trump?
 
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