1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Ken Hams Worst case scenario. Ark held 7000 animals inside.

Discussion in 'Science and Religion' started by Twilight Hue, Mar 6, 2021.

  1. Altfish

    Altfish Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2014
    Messages:
    12,484
    Ratings:
    +10,291
    Religion:
    Humanist
    It is the religious people who believe the Genesis account and don't accept evolution as fact.
     
  2. firedragon

    firedragon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Messages:
    11,776
    Ratings:
    +3,160
    I knew that you were mixing up everything like evolution, genesis, and even maybe young earthers. Thats why when you said "creationists" I withdrew.

    Cheers.
     
  3. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    35,163
    Ratings:
    +14,885
    Religion:
    Philosophical Buddhism

    Keep My chukim!

     
  4. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    Messages:
    7,241
    Ratings:
    +1,971
    Religion:
    Unitarian Universalism,Pagan,Zen
     
  5. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2011
    Messages:
    17,537
    Ratings:
    +8,031
    Religion:
    Atheist Libertarian
    The Ark measured 300 × 50 × 30 cubits (Genesis 6:15), which is about 140 × 23 × 13.5 metres or 459 × 75 × 44 feet, so its volume was 43,500 m³ (cubic metres) or 1.54 million cubic feet. To put this in perspective, this is the equivalent carrying capacity of 340 semitrailer trucks (i.e. articulated lorries), each of which can hold 37 1,200-pound slaughter steers, 90 500-pound feeder calves, 180 250-pound hogs, or 300 125-pound sheep. This would be a line six lanes wide and half a mile long.

    If the animals were kept in cages with an average size of 50 × 50 × 30 centimetres (20 × 20 × 12 inches), that is 75,000 cm³ (cubic centimetres) or 4800 cubic inches, the 16,000 animals would only occupy 1200 m³ (42,000 cubic feet) or 14.4 stock cars. Even if a million insect species had to be on board, it would not be a problem, because they require little space. If each pair was kept in cages of 10 cm (four inches) per side, or 1000 cm³, all the insect species would occupy a total volume of only 1000 m³, or another 12 cars. This would leave room for five trains of 99 cars each for food, Noah’s family and ‘range’ for the animals. However, insects are not included in the meaning of behemah orremes in Genesis 6:19-20, so Noah probably would not have taken them on board as passengers anyway.

    Tabulating the total volume is fair enough, since this shows that there would be plenty of room on the Ark for the animals with plenty left over for food, range etc. It would be possible to stack cages, with food on top or nearby (to minimize the amount of food carrying the humans had to do), to fill up more of the Ark space, while still allowing plenty of room for gaps for air circulation. We are discussing an emergency situation, not necessarily luxury accommodation. Although there is plenty of room for exercise, skeptics have overstated animals’ needs for exercise anyway.

    Even if we don’t allow stacking one cage on top of another to save floor space, there would be no problem. Woodmorappe shows from standard recommended floor space requirements for animals that all of them together would have needed less than half the available floor space of the Ark’s three decks. This arrangement allows for the maximum amount of food and water storage on top of the cages close to the animals.
    How did all the animals fit on Noah's Ark? - creation.com


    Christian EXPERTS say otherwise. :mad:
    Creation Science Profile, John Woodmorappe

     
  6. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,856
    Ratings:
    +16,527
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    Roughly, about 2/3 do, and these are societies that usually do have some issues with flooding.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,856
    Ratings:
    +16,527
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    Note that those on the top tend to put very strong emphasis on education and science.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,856
    Ratings:
    +16,527
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    More the Protestant fundamentalists, as there's no problem with this in Catholicism or with most mainline Protestants.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2017
    Messages:
    43,180
    Ratings:
    +25,781
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Well those, they aren't Real Christians (trademark):rolleyes:
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
  10. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,856
    Ratings:
    +16,527
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    And we've been told that so many times, including here at RF at times. :emojconfused:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    Messages:
    7,241
    Ratings:
    +1,971
    Religion:
    Unitarian Universalism,Pagan,Zen
     
  12. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    Messages:
    7,241
    Ratings:
    +1,971
    Religion:
    Unitarian Universalism,Pagan,Zen
    No way are they getting that many animals in without sinking it let alone feeding the animals and dealing with the poop.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Kfox

    Kfox Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2021
    Messages:
    93
    Ratings:
    +24
    Religion:
    Atheist
    I think the biggest problem with the Noah’s Ark story is any engineer will tell you that it is impossible (even with todays pressure treated wood) to build a 500 foot vessel made strictly of wood; without any steel reinforcements, and still float. The problem with the story is they gave the dimensions; I guess the guy who made it all up didn’t know this.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  14. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2006
    Messages:
    17,694
    Ratings:
    +5,178
    Religion:
    Pi π
    Although some groups can be more fundamental because the fundamentalist leaders teach those groups to be “fundamentalist” version of creation and be anti-Evolution or even anti-science...

    ...it is sometimes the individuals are more prone being that way.

    I have known a group of Protestant who were more moderate, and more accepting of Evolution being a biological reality, but in that same group, there’s a black sheep or two.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2006
    Messages:
    17,694
    Ratings:
    +5,178
    Religion:
    Pi π
    Especially when you considered that some animals are predators and carnivores.

    So what do they eat when they are surrounded by prey?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,856
    Ratings:
    +16,527
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    I hear ya.

    For personal example, my parents and I belonged to a fundamentalist Protestant church that taught how terrible the belief in "evilution" is, and I left the church because of this and for another reason [overt racism], but they stayed for the rest of their lives even though they themselves accepted the ToE.
     
  17. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    10,231
    Ratings:
    +8,051
    Religion:
    Atheist
    It doesn't have to make sense. It's god-magic. God can do anything.
    In fact, the fact that you deem it impossible to occur, is proof that it was a miracle, because God made it happen anyway, regardless of it being "impossible".

    What? You say that it didn't happen? Well, were you there? (read the italics in an australian accent with an annoying voice)


    Joking aside.... My first reaction when I heard about these guys (him, the hovinds, etc) was that they were scammers. That they didn't really believe any of this, but that they were just making a scam play in the "church business" to try and cheat people out of their money with donations and buying "merchandise".

    But then a realized that for that plan to work, other people (the customers, or rather: the victims) would have to believe it.............................

    So either way, people had to exist that actually believed this stuff.


    It was a sad day in my life when I realized that. It was also quite shocking when I found out just how many people believe obvious nonsense like this. And with unbelievable passion to.
    I still find it shocking, actually.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    Messages:
    7,241
    Ratings:
    +1,971
    Religion:
    Unitarian Universalism,Pagan,Zen
    It's a cop-out to say God did it, it doesn't have to make sense. it's magic. It's like Jesus being raised from the dead is scientifically impossible and they say the same thing. But any religion can use that excuse to explain away miracles they can't explain, God did it and it doesn't have to make sense.
     
    • Like Like x 1
Loading...