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Ken Ham is ripping of Kentucky again:

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
If you read my comment in context with the post it was in reply to the meaning is clear.
The meaning appeared to be an attempt to deflect from Ham's abysmal and dishonest behaviour. I was giving you a chance to clarify, but I'll take it from your continued tapdancing that you are just justifying "lying for Jesus".
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Considering he is likely profiting off this and using it as a way to spread misinformation about history and science, it would be justifiable to tax an amount that is fair and equitable and put that money towards education. Solid science education.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Considering he is likely profiting off this and using it as a way to spread misinformation about history and science, it would be justifiable to tax an amount that is fair and equitable and put that money towards education. Solid science education.
Fair & equitable taxation should be the norm for all properties.
Property taxes from individual properties aren't directed towards
anything in particular. States spend the revenue according to
their budgets.
Do we know how (if at all) Ham personally profits from the park?
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
The meaning appeared to be an attempt to deflect from Ham's abysmal and dishonest behaviour. I was giving you a chance to clarify, but I'll take it from your continued tapdancing that you are just justifying "lying for Jesus".
Since you've made no cogent argument for Ham's dishonesty,
could one apply your rationale to say that you're "lying about Ham"?
I know it's fun to believe the worse about people one hates,
but criminy, guy....don't demonize without evidence & analysis.
Faith based attacks are wrong.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Fair & equitable taxation should be the norm for all properties.
Property taxes from individual properties aren't directed towards
anything in particular. States spend the revenue according to
their budgets.
Do we know how (if at all) Ham personally profits from the park?


Do you mean do we know if there is a net profit? I don't think that is known yet. One would think that his books should be open for that, but he would not be the first to abuse his tax-exempt status.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Since you've made no cogent argument for Ham's dishonesty,
could one apply your rationale to say that you're "lying about Ham"?
I know it's fun to believe the worse about people one hates,
but criminy, guy....don't demonize without evidence & analysis.
Faith based attacks are wrong.
Spreading known falsehoods is not an example of dishonesty? That is a new one on me.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Do you mean do we know if there is a net profit?
That post was about the issue of Ham personally profiting,
despite the park being a non-profit.
I don't think that is known yet. One would think that his books should be open for that, but he would not be the first to abuse his tax-exempt status.
Based upon the situation of disputing the level of property taxation
the park faces, it's safe to say that it isn't exempt from property taxes,
perhaps because it's a theme park.
(Were it exempt, there'd be no suit over the assessment, he.)
Some info about property tax exemption...
Do Nonprofit Organizations Pay Property Taxes?
Excerpted....
Property Taxes


Organizations that qualify for federal tax-exempt status are, by law, exempt from paying property taxes in all 50 states. The value of the exemption depends on the size and nature of the real estate that the nonprofit owns. A community food bank operating out of a small suburban warehouse may save a few thousand dollars a year, while a large urban hospital may save much more. Property taxes vary by region, so a property tax exemption in states such as California or New York is more valuable than an exemption in Louisiana, which has one of the nation's lowest property tax rates.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Spreading known falsehoods is not an example of dishonesty? That is a new one on me.
When it comes to religion, "known falsehoods" is a problematic term.
Nearly all religions believe & spread them, as does Ham.
Sure, some are worse than others, but all such people are bonkers
in the eye of this heathen. You need a better accusation.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
That post was about the issue of Ham personally profiting,
despite the park being a non-profit.

Based upon the situation of disputing the level of property taxation
the park faces, it's safe to say that it isn't exempt from property taxes,
perhaps because it's a theme park.
(Were it exempt, there'd be no suit over the assessment, he.)
Some info about property tax exemption...
Do Nonprofit Organizations Pay Property Taxes?
Excerpted....
Property Taxes


Organizations that qualify for federal tax-exempt status are, by law, exempt from paying property taxes in all 50 states. The value of the exemption depends on the size and nature of the real estate that the nonprofit owns. A community food bank operating out of a small suburban warehouse may save a few thousand dollars a year, while a large urban hospital may save much more. Property taxes vary by region, so a property tax exemption in states such as California or New York is more valuable than an exemption in Louisiana, which has one of the nation's lowest property tax rates.
Correct, the property is not exempt. It is the profits that he gains that would be exempt. Of course supposedly he is a non-profit organization. The exemption of the property was never stated or even implied.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
When it comes to religion, "known falsehoods" is a problematic term.
Nearly all religions believe & spread them, as does Ham.
Sure, some are worse than others, but all such people are bonkers
in the eye of this heathen. You need a better accusation.
Believing false stories is not a valid excuse. One cannot pretend to be scientific, which he actively does, and have an excuse for that behavior. Once one claims that one's beliefs are scientific one must follow the scientific method if for one to be exempt from criticism. AiG requires their workers to swear that they will not follow the scientific method.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Correct, the property is not exempt. It is the profits that he gains that would be exempt. Of course supposedly he is a non-profit organization. The exemption of the property was never stated or even implied.
I believe that the poster (I responded to) was thinking that Ham
would personally profit (perhaps from salary or graft), despite
the park being a non-profit organization.
What would be the point of suing for an increased property tax
assessment if there was no property tax to collect?
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Just as an aside, two threads which are consistently showing up in my alerts: This one about Ken Ham, and the other one about why pork is considered an impure meat.

Ken Ham is giving a bad name to pork.
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Fair & equitable taxation should be the norm for all properties.

Yes. Just wanted to clarify it.

Property taxes from individual properties aren't directed towards
anything in particular. States spend the revenue according to
their budgets.

In this case, there appears to be something earmarked for education: from the article:

"This undervalued property has allowed Ark Encounter to underpay taxes owed to the Grant County Board of Education, according to the lawsuit, which was filed in the Grant Circuit Court on July 1."

I think it would be a good idea for the community to use taxes generated from a museum promoting false science to help fun good science education.

Do we know how (if at all) Ham personally profits from the park?

It appears complicated and seems to change with new taxations-- at least for his Young Earth organization. Not sure about Ham personally.

https://rightingamerica.net/from-for-profit-to-non-profit-to-for-profit-in-less-than-a-month/
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Believing false stories is not a valid excuse.
You're preaching to the choir here.
I don't believe any of that religious mumbo jumbo.
But you must face the fact that religions push beliefs
which aren't true, might be false, & might not even be that.
You seem to be making a case that Ham deserves property
tax treatment based upon your views of his religion.
I disagree with that.
One cannot pretend to be scientific, which he actively does, and have an excuse for that behavior. Once one claims that one's beliefs are scientific one must follow the scientific method if for one to be exempt from criticism. AiG requires their workers to swear that they will not follow the scientific method.
What bearing does that have on property valuation?
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Yes. Just wanted to clarify it.



In this case, there appears to be something earmarked for education: from the article:

"This undervalued property has allowed Ark Encounter to underpay taxes owed to the Grant County Board of Education, according to the lawsuit, which was filed in the Grant Circuit Court on July 1."

I think it would be a good idea for the community to use taxes generated from a museum promoting false science to help fun good science education.



It appears complicated and seems to change with new taxations-- at least for his Young Earth organization. Not sure about Ham personally.

https://rightingamerica.net/from-for-profit-to-non-profit-to-for-profit-in-less-than-a-month/
Individual property taxes just aren't earmarked for particular spending.
But they are used for education....& perhaps making that an issue is
useful to the plaintiff....tugging on heart strings. "Think of the children!"
 

sooda

Veteran Member
Fair & equitable taxation should be the norm for all properties.
Property taxes from individual properties aren't directed towards
anything in particular. States spend the revenue according to
their budgets.
Do we know how (if at all) Ham personally profits from the park?

Ken Ham Sells Ark Encounter Land To Himself For $10 To ...
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/ken-ham-sells-ark-encounter-land-to-himself-for-10_b...
Jul 19, 2017 · This allows Ham to claim his land is a non-profit and not subject to the new safety tax passed by city officials which would have collected 50 cents of every entry ticket sold. This move also worries local politicians and residents because it sets up the park to claim exemption from all other taxes as well that includes the funding of public schools.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Ken Ham Sells Ark Encounter Land To Himself For $10 To ...
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/ken-ham-sells-ark-encounter-land-to-himself-for-10_b...
Jul 19, 2017 · This allows Ham to claim his land is a non-profit and not subject to the new safety tax passed by city officials which would have collected 50 cents of every entry ticket sold. This move also worries local politicians and residents because it sets up the park to claim exemption from all other taxes as well that includes the funding of public schools.
Sounds complicated.
(Dang, Huff Po sure does seem biased against Ham & the park.)
Everyone has a right to conduct their affairs in order to minimize
taxes, even if the result is less money for doe eyed innocent
school children. I do, & will continue to minimize my liability.

As the article says, he already won one court battle.
If he "duped the state", as claimed, then the state can either
change the law, or go to court to enforce existing law.
But it sounds like they just aren't happy with how much
money they're getting from the ark park....as though
they're entitled to more just because they want more
from someone they dislike.

I sympathize with people disgusted by these religious beliefs.
He & the park are loopy. But I think hatred for them is
overwhelming rational discourse about tax policy.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
Sounds complicated.
(Dang, Huff Po sure does seem biased against Ham & the park.)
Everyone has a right to conduct their affairs in order to minimize
taxes, even if the result is less money for doe eyed innocent
school children.
And as the article says, he already won one court battle.
If he "duped the state", as claimed, then the state can either
change the law, or go to court to enforce existing law.
It sounds like they just aren't happy with how much money
they're getting from the ark park.

I sympathize with people disgusted by these religious beliefs.
He & the park are loopy. But I think hatred for them is
overwhelming rational discourse about tax policy.

The same tax evasion strategies are reported pretty far and wide. Ham is a charlatan and he screwing the people of Kentucky. The Australians have his number.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
The same tax evasion strategies are reported pretty far and wide. Ham is a charlatan and he screwing the people of Kentucky. The Australians have his number.
If it is indeed illegal tax evasion, then government may prosecute him in court.
As for being a charlatan, I can't fault him much more than all churches which
pay no property taxes whatsoever. And many of those seek to make the
country more theocratic, to oppose abortion rights, to put prayer (only their
prayers) back in public schools, to fight gay marriage, etc, etc.

The whole system needs an overhaul....let all properties pay property taxes.
And let assessments be objective & fair.
 
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