Judgment

[Jainarayan]

At what point is one justified to pass judgment on another for their religion, worldview, or actions?

Never. As a Hindu I don’t believe even God does that.

What is the basis or foundation of such judgment?

Hubris. People think they are “guiding” the person away from evil, and doing God’s bidding. Nothing could be further from the truth.

At what point is one justified in "standing up" to another? Is it justified even when the actions of another have no impact on the person passing judgment?

There is never a justification for calling out someone’s flaws. It’s not “standing up” or guiding.

“Has no one condemned you?”
“No, Lord.”
“Then neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more.”

The difference is he had the authority to condemn, or judge, or forgive. And he didn’t condemn or judge. So where people get off thinking they can do what he didn’t do, is beyond me.

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment?

I don’t think there’s any positive outcome of judgment, only negatives.

 

[Vinayaka]

This thread was inspired by a comment was made by a member here that some people just need to be stood up to, but I, personally, have spend a great deal of time contemplating judgment and its practical and moral value. I'm interested in others' perspective on this topic.

For many, especially those of the Abrahamic faiths, judgment is a key tenet in their faith or worldview, with God ultimately passing judgment on all.

At what point is one justified to pass judgment on another for their religion, worldview, or actions?

What is the basis or foundation of such judgment?

At what point is one justified in "standing up" to another? Is it justified even when the actions of another have no impact on the person passing judgment?

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment?

There is nothing at all resembling this 'judgment' idea from Abrahamic faiths in my faith. My God isn't a judge. I do believe there is a necessary time and place to stand up to people ... in many facets of life. We all need to stand up to bullies, for example.

 

[stvdv]

God's Judgment is a concept born of man's inability to control how others live and enact laws to keep those people in line. It is the same idea as the writer killing off his enemy in his written works because he cannot do it in real life.

Thanks, that' s an interesting opinion.

 

[stvdv]

Christians are called to discernment and as far as doctrine to 'speak the truth in love'

Saying there is mercy offered in the gospel is fine and commanded by the Bible.
Condemning people with unloving motive is not.
Saying you're better than they is not.

I like these of you. Although some people do have different thoughts about "speak the truth in love" then I have

I also believe that condemning people with loving motive is not fine

 

[stvdv]

To me, a judgment is just someone's opinion, and everyone's entitled to one.

I agree.

Though, in the context of the OP this judgment tend to be stated as a fact quite often

 

[FooYang]

For many, especially those of the Abrahamic faiths, judgment is a key tenet in their faith or worldview, with God ultimately passing judgment on all.

Not really because it's ultimately the individual who decides whether they stay in Samsara or not, "God" just defines the rules for the test.
In the most technical sense, we judge ourselves for causing ourselves to not achieve union with "God" upon death through both our attachments to this world and our ignorance.

 

[stvdv]

How does calling another out have any practical purpose for you other than to satiate your own ego?

I used to be a pleaser who never said no. Then came a time to tell them to stop. Now comes the time to avoid them (if I don't like their actions).

So for me to "satiate the ego" was a way to get to the next level (become more aware).

 

[stvdv]

For many, especially those of the Abrahamic faiths, judgment is a key tenet in their faith or worldview, with God ultimately passing judgment on all.

Luckily my Dharmic faith advises me not to judge people

 

[stvdv]

At what point is one justified to pass judgment on another for their religion, worldview, or actions?[/QUOTE]
I guess staff members are justified to pass judgment when RF rules are violated

What is the basis or foundation of such judgment?

Agreement when signing up for RF

 

[stvdv]

At what point is one justified in "standing up" to another? Is it justified even when the actions of another have no impact on the person passing judgment?

When I "see injustice", then I can "stand up".

When there is no "I" identification" (when in Samadhi) there is no "I see injustice" nor "I standing up"

 

[stvdv]

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment?

I am fine with people judging my actions; they inspire me to introspect and improve

 

[stvdv]

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment

When judging feelings and/or (non)faith (unenlightened) people tend to experience it generally as negative.

 

[idav]

This thread was inspired by a comment was made by a member here that some people just need to be stood up to, but I, personally, have spend a great deal of time contemplating judgment and its practical and moral value. I'm interested in others' perspective on this topic.

For many, especially those of the Abrahamic faiths, judgment is a key tenet in their faith or worldview, with God ultimately passing judgment on all.

At what point is one justified to pass judgment on another for their religion, worldview, or actions?

What is the basis or foundation of such judgment?

At what point is one justified in "standing up" to another? Is it justified even when the actions of another have no impact on the person passing judgment?

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment?

Passing judgement is much more justifiable when we actually have facts to be work with. It seems less reasonable to paint people with a broad brush. Sometimes judgement is just opinion or guessing what a person is like based on how a person appears but it's possible to have basis for calling a duck a duck.

 

[wizanda]

Though, in the context of the OP this judgment tend to be stated as a fact quite often

If a maths teacher is trained in a university, and then given the answers to the exam; they come and mark the students work, are they judging the student or their work?

The problem is people have all been taught, "you're entitled to your own opinions of what the exam papers mean", and no one has told anyone, "actually if you fail the paper you're all going to be expelled".

I'm trying really hard to be a really nice teacher explaining in the method others ask, studying their made up interpretations, where explain this regularly, and everyone hates me for being fair.

To the point I feel like quitting my job (suicidal); yet if I quit the whole school gets expelled, and this really is too much to handle...

So I plead with you all to actually try to study, stop being so determined you know more than the papers, and at least try to help humanity pass the exam.

In my opinion.

 

[stvdv]

If a maths teacher is trained in a university, and then given the answers to the exam; they come and mark the students work, are they judging the student or their work?

The problem is people have all been taught, "you're entitled to your own opinions of what the exam papers mean", and no one has told anyone, "actually if you fail the paper you're all going to be expelled".

I'm trying really hard to be a really nice teacher explaining in the method others ask, studying their made up interpretations, where explain this regularly, and everyone hates me for being fair.

To the point I feel like quitting my job (suicidal); yet if I quit the whole school gets expelled, and this really is too much to handle...

So I plead with you all to actually try to study, stop being so determined you know more than the papers, and at least try to help humanity pass the exam.

In my opinion.

I could not agree more.

Hence I said "in the context of the OP"
So I excluded math exams etc
Meaning I talk about feelings and faith as in OP

 

[blü 2]

At what point is one justified to pass judgment on another for their religion, worldview, or actions?

People make judgments about other people all day and every day as part of ordinary survival instincts. Outside of RF the only argument I have with believers is with fundamentalism.

What is the basis or foundation of such judgment?

When I make moral judgments, they're very usually about the presence or absence of ordinary decency.

At what point is one justified in "standing up" to
another?

When harm ─ according to your own worldview ─ might follow if you don't.

Is it justified even when the actions of another have no impact on the person passing judgment?

There was a time when I was an elected rep to a legislature, so I'd have to answer yes.

In your opinion, what are the implications, positive or negative, of judgment?

As I said, it's a survival tool. I wouldn't be without it.

 

[SalixIncendium]

I should have thought that was obvious. Once you have decided so and so is an *******, certain actions follow. You avoid them, you confront them, you encourage others to oppose them or watch out for them, and so forth, depending on the situation.

As for the criteria, they are various, of course. The ****** may be merely stubbornly stupid or ignorant, or they may may be malicious, or dishonest, or violent, or manipulative or.....etc etc.

I'm not sure where you are going with this line of enquiry, to be honest. Perhaps I am missing your point.

You may be.

My point lies in the foundation of one judging another as an *******.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Ah ha, but had his ego been kept in check to begin with I wouldn't have to check it for him. I didn't confront him, he took it upon himself to be show that ego.

What you’re failing to understand is that in you judgment of the other person in you example, it is your ego that is not “in check.”

 

[SalixIncendium]

Not really because it's ultimately the individual who decides whether they stay in Samsara or not, "God" just defines the rules for the test.
In the most technical sense, we judge ourselves for causing ourselves to not achieve union with "God" upon death through both our attachments to this world and our ignorance.

I agree for the most part, with the exception of “we.”

But I don’t believe you were intentionally speaking for me.

 

[SalixIncendium]

So for me to "satiate the ego" was a way to get to the next level (become more aware).

Perhaps you and I are defining “satiate” differently.

While managing ego can bring one closer to moksha, I don’t see how satisfying it can.