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Jewish Noahidism

Discussion in 'Judaism DIR' started by Tumah, Aug 10, 2016.

  1. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    Noahidism
    This thread is meant to be a primer on Jewish Noahidism. Although many people may claim to be Noahides, the term itself (as discussed later) is a Jewish term originating in Jewish literature and refers to a specific concept. It’s that concept that I'm going to be discussing here. Its quite long and I don't expect most people to go through it, however it may be a good resource for interested people and questions are welcome.

    This is in no way a fully comprehensive discourse on the topic, as there is more to be studied about almost every point made here. And many more points to discuss that are not discussed here. For the most part, sources and logic behind statements made here have been excluded. In the vast majority of times, the source is a Talmudic passage. One of the books on this subject that I culled much of this information from has over 800 pages, and even that is not exhaustive. Rather, my intention here is to present a general overview of the Laws and ideas of Jewish Noahidism, so that there is more clarity about it and what it entails. There is much more to learn and it’s precisely this - what is called the Noahides' Torah - that will be discussed here.

    I'll be primarily taking information from Maimonides' Mishneh Torah with regards to Laws, as he is the first one to really codify them in a systematic way. It should be noted that Maimonides' opinions are not the only ones on the subject and there are other Halachic (related to Jewish Law) arbitrators who may disagree on any given point. I will also be taking many points from a number of other sources as well. Not everything is sourced here, as not all the sources were easily available online (there may be some laziness involved here as well).

    Some Background
    The actual Hebrew word for Noahide is "ben Noach (בן נח - lit. son of Noah)". The truth is that this phrase historically refers to any non-Jew or non-Jewess as being a descendant of Noah. The technical ramifications of the term refer to the Laws that all people descendant from Noah are obligated in. This term doesn't make any indication as to whether the person follows these laws or not. This term also includes Abraham and all of his descendants until the generation that received the Torah at Mt. Sinai. At the point the Israelites received the Torah they became bound by many more Laws, essentially removing them from the practical category of “Noahide.” The term “Noahide” also excluded non-Jewish slaves owned by Jews (as these slaves are required to go through a semi-conversion or be sold back to a non-Jew). In this respect, according to some opinions, a Ger Toshav (see below) is also excluded from the "Noahide" category.

    There are a number of opinions regarding the history of the Noahide Laws.
    - According to the Zohar, Adam was actually taught all the Laws of the Torah and he taught it to Seth who passed it down until Enoch, who passed it down until Shem. However, after the Flood, G-d decided that the following generations wouldn't follow all the laws of the Torah, and instead limited them to just upholding the Noahide Laws.
    - According to the Talmud, there are various opinions as to which Laws Adam (and later Noah), were commanded. According to one opinion, Adam was only given the commandment against idol-worship.
    - According to another opinion, he was commanded against both idol-worship and cursing G-d. A third opinion adds adjudication, etc.
    - According to Maimonides, Adam was given six of the commandments, and the last commandment was given to Noah.
    - Other opinions hold that Adam was commanded in all seven and then G-d reiterated two of them to Noah.

    This is of course, aside for the temporary commandments they were commanded to perform.

    Although the Talmud seems to derive the seven Noahide Laws from Gen. 2:16, the commentators (this and this) explain that verse Gen. 2:16 is actually just a convenient verse that acts as a mnemonic to sum up all the Laws the Rabbis knew to already exist.

    Another question the commentators ask is, on what basis anyone is required to follow the Noahide Laws. The most common answer is that Adam, Noah, and Shem were acknowledged as prophets, and therefore, on the basis of their prophecy, they can obligate others. Another opinion is that Adam and Noah's acceptance of the Laws was binding on their children. Lastly, a third opinion is that since our purpose for being created is to perform G-d's Will, once we are notified as to what that Will is, we are automatically required to fulfill it.

    Resident Alien
    The technical term for a non-Jew who does accept on himself to follow the Noahide Laws is "Ger Toshav (גר תושב - lit. Resident Alien)". For a non-Jew to gain this title, he must accept on himself the Noahide Laws in the presence of a three-man Jewish court. After achieving “Ger Toshav” status, the Ger Toshav may live in Jewish cities in Israel and Jews are required to help financially support the Ger Toshav. A Ger Toshav may also run to a City of Refuge in certain cases of accidental murder. (This is something not available to other non-Jews.)

    There is another benefit to accepting the Noahide Laws on oneself in this manner, as a Ger Toshav. The Talmud teaches that G-d saw that the children of Noah were not fulfilling the Noahide Laws, so He nullified the Noahide Laws. According to many opinions, this means he lowered the reward of their fulfillment to that of someone who is "not commanded, and does" (see below "Keeping Other Laws). In this case, because the children of Noah did not see themselves as obligated to fulfilled the Noahide Laws, their reward was correspondingly lowered to the same level as someone who is not obligated in a commandment. However, by becoming a Ger Toshav (accepting the Noahide laws upon oneself in front of a court), one can return to the status of receiving the original level of reward (per here).
     
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  2. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    Resident Alien Today
    Today, this concept of “Ger Toshav” is no longer in effect, as Gerei Toshav (pl.) are only accepted when Jews practice the Jubilee counting, which itself is only practiced when most of the world's population of Jews are living in Israel (in the correct tribal portion they belong to, according to some opinions). This means, it hasn't been practiced since the exiling of the Ten Tribes during the First Temple.

    Therefore, in the present, a non-Jew who accepts on himself the Noahide Laws technically becomes one of the "Pious of the Nations of the world". This term refers to someone who unofficially accepts on himself to follow the Noahide Laws – not in the presence of a three man court.

    However, there is a difference between the non-Jew whose motive for following the Noahide laws is for the sake of fulfilling G-d’s commandment and the non-Jew whose motive is for logical or moral reasons. If the motive behind accepting the Laws is done out of recognition of G-d's commandment, then the person becomes a "Pious of the Nations of the World". If it is done out of logic (ie. without recognition of G-d, but because they are good ideas for society and people to uphold), then this person is called "Wise of the Nations of the world." The significant difference between the two types of Law-abiding non-Jews is that the former receives reward in the World to Come, while that latter does not.

    “Noahides,” in today’s terminology, refers to those who are technically in the category of "Pious of the Nations of the World". The earliest known example of "Noahide" being used for someone who accepts on themselves the Noahide Laws is found in the works of the Ritv"a (d. ~1320 CE)

    Some Lesser Known Facts
    One idea that is not well known, is that the famous Seven Noahide Laws do not represent the entirety of the Noahide Laws. In fact, the Talmud says that these seven only represent passive Laws (Laws where one is required to not do something), not the active ones (see later regarding the Law for adjudication) and there are a number of active ones, as we shall see.

    Another fact that is not very known, is that the 7 Noahide Laws are not exactly Laws as much as categories of Laws, containing many sub-Laws. For instance, the prohibition of immoral relations is just a general term that includes all the specific prohibited relations for non-Jews. As opposed to this, in Jewish Law, we'd find each prohibition listed separated (as it does in Lev. 18).

    6+1=30
    The following are the famous Seven Noahide Laws. I am including within them the 30 sub-Laws of Rabbi Menachem Azaria de Fano as they are the more commonly cited. There is also another list from the much earlier Samuel ben Hofni Gaon (see later for his list).

    The Seven Laws

    (1) The Prohibition of Idol-worship

    This prohibition includes worshiping anything that is not G-d, in the manner that the idol was meant to be worshiped. According to some opinions creating an idol or even worshiping it in an incorrect manner is also prohibited.

    The Halachic arbitrators are split on whether one may partner an idol with G-d. The most common example is the Christian doctrine of the Trinity. Although all agree that a non-Jew may swear or take an oath in the name of the idol, most maintain that actually worshiping the idol is forbidden, while some maintain its permitted for non-Jews (so long as G-d is also worshiped).

    This Law contains 9 sub-prohibitions that are derived from Deut.18:10-11:
    • (2) passing one's child through fire (as in worship to Molech).
    • (3) meditating on a medium (like a crystal ball) to divine the future.
    • (4) diving auspicious times
    • (5) diving the future through omens
    • (6) using impure methods to cause supernatural phenomenon
    • (7) uses spells to control animals
    • (8) uses a type of ritual to raise a dead soul
    • (9) uses the bone of a certain type of bird in a ritual to learn the future
    • (10) starving oneself and sleeping in a graveyard to encounter a dead soul in one's dream
    It is also prohibited for a false prophet to claim prophecy in the name of G-d.

    (2) The Prohibition of Blasphemey
    This Law includes cursing any of the Names or nicknames of G-d.

    According to some, cursing a judge also falls into this category.

    This Law has two sub-Laws:
    • (12) to honor the Torah
    • (13) to study the Noahide Laws
    The obligation to honor the Torah seems to stem from the idea that a non-Jew is meant to accept that the Torah as divinely revealed, testifies to the previous divine revelation of their Laws (see here and here). And according to this opinion, Moses acted as a messenger to the entire world, bringing the Jewish Laws for the Jews and the Noahide Laws for the non-Jews as they were previously voided (as mentioned above in "Resident Alien"). In this capacity Moses brought a religion for non-Jews as well, and from this stems the prohibition to create a new religion (see also later, the Prohibition of Adjudication).

    There is an opinion in the Talmud that this Law and the Law for adjudication should be replaced with the Laws prohibiting castration and crossbreeding.

    (3) The Prohibition of Spilling Blood
    This Law includes killing someone who is on his way to greener pastures or causing someone to be killed through other means. It also includes abortion outside of a case where the mother's life is in danger and hiring a hit-man. There is disagreement whether suicide is also considered murder (in which case it would be prohibited here as well) or not.

    The arbitrators also argue about a case of an ultimatum where one must kill someone or die. On the one hand, non-Jews are no required to give their lives in order to fulfill these commandments. On the other hand, perhaps the dictum, "who said your blood is redder than his?" is applicable and so he would not be allowed to kill the other.

    This Law contains only one sub-Law
    • (15) the prohibition against hitting a Jew
    There is a lot of discussion surrounding the parameters of this sub-Law. According to at least one opinion, hitting should fall under the prohibition of the Law of Stealing, because it causes a loss in the body no different than causing a loss to one's possessions. In which case, hitting even a non-Jew would also be prohibited for stealing. The reason it was separated then, would be because in Jewish Law, there is no fine for stealing under $0.016. Which means that while it would be prohibited for a non-Jew to cause light damages to another non-Jews (as non-Jewish Law has no such minimum value), it would be not be sanctioned when done to a Jew. So the prohibition against hitting a Jew was moved to this category, in order to include it.
     
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  3. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    (4) The Prohibition of Immoral Relations
    This refers to six people a non-Jew is prohibited to have relations with: (1) mother (2) father's wife (3) married woman (4) sister from the same mother (5) male (6) an animal.

    Sodomy is not prohibited with another's wife (provided she is not Jewish as for Jews it is prohibited). According to some, this is true for all prohibited relations.

    A marriage becomes official at the point of consummation (marital relation). Divorce is official when one partner moves out. According to some opinions, intent to consummate a marriage may not even be necessary, in some cases. According to many opinions, sodomy does not consummate a marriage. Others disagree. There is also argument about whether relations with intent to consummate a marriage works with prohibited relatives.

    This Law contains six sub-Laws:
    • (17) to be fruitful
    • (18) to multiply
    • (19) the prohibition of homosexual relations even in a marital setting.
    • (20) the prohibition of cross-breeding two different animal species
    • (21) the prohibition against castration (human or animal)
    • (22) the prohibition of cross-grafting two tree species
    There's an argument over whether the commandment to "be fruitful and multiply" applies to non-Jews. According to the opinion that it does, there is also a prohibition against wasting seed, while according to the opinion that it doesn't, there is not. Some argue that the two are unrelated.

    There is also argument whether non-Jews are prohibited to castrate.

    (5) The Prohibition of Stealing
    There are a number of types of stealing that are prohibited here. (1) withholding workers' payment, (2) relations with a captured woman who is married, (3) having relations with a maid that one married to one's servant, (4) kidnapping, (5) and fraud.

    According to some opinions, stealing with intent to return the stolen object is not prohibited.

    Even though the Talmud teaches that someone who derives enjoyment from the world without making a blessing has transgressed a type of stealing, non-Jews are not required to make blessings.

    This Law has one sub-Law
    • (24) the prohibition not to study any Torah besides that which is related to the Noahide Laws.
    According to some opinions, this Law to not study Torah and/or the Law to not keep the Sabbath each fall under the prohibition of stealing.

    (6) The Prohibition of [Eating] a Limb from a Live Animal
    According to some opinions, limbs of a live bird are prohibited, but not punishable.

    This Law has three sub-Laws
    • (26) the prohibition against eating blood from a live animal
    • (27) the prohibition against eating an animal that died in the field (ie. that was not killed by a human)
    • (28) the prohibition against cannibalism
    According to some opinions, blood from a live animal is permitted. According to those opinions, milk from a live animal is permitted because of this.

    According to the tosafists opinion (who is also the majority), an animal that died in the field is permissible to non-Jews. In fact according to them, Adam was permitted to eat meat so long as the animal was already dead.

    According to the minority opinion mentioned above, only animals that were killed by humans are permissible to non-Jews. However, the majority of opinions disagree and hold that any dead animal is permitted to non-Jews.

    Live bugs do not fall under this prohibition and are not prohibited. Live fish are permitted as well.

    (7) The Prohibition of Adjudication
    As mentioned earlier, the Talmud states that the seven Laws are passive Laws. According to that, this Law actually has two parts to it: (passively) to not distort justice and (actively) to judge.

    The major requirement of this Law is for every district to set up a court where people are judged for there crimes. According to some opinions, that's why Simon and Garfunkel Levi killed the entire Shechem when it was only Hamor that kidnapped her: they didn't sit in judgement on him.

    Accordingly, the judges are also required to teach the people of their region and warn them about the Laws. This opinion also holds that Jews are required to set up courts in Israel to adjudicate for Resident Aliens, if they don't do so themselves.

    Much ink has been spilled in disagreement about whether non-Jewish judges need to judge monetary matters according to Jewish Law, or if they can create their own monetary laws. This is unrelated to the Halachic concept of "the law of the land is the law".

    While they are required to arbitrate on monetary matters, they are not required to set fines.

    There is an argument between Maimonides and Nachmanides whether the requirement is that the court adjudicate on the other six commandments, or whether the requirement is that the court judge on all judiciary matters, respectively.

    This Law has one sub-Law
    • (30) the prohibition to keep the Sabbath
    The prohibition of keeping the Sabbath includes creating a day of rest on any of the days of the week and not just Saturday.
    According to Maimonides, the problem is that it looks like one is creating a new religion. And in fact creating any sort of new religious rituals or celebrations that were not already commanded would fall into this category. Other commentaries present other explanations.

    According to some, the prohibition against keeping the Sabbath is only for non-Jews who engage in idol-worship and a Ger Toshav is actually required to keep Sabbath as its a form of testimony that G-d created the world, which is a required belief.

    According to some, there is a prohibition against cursing the judge that is a sub-category here. According to others, it belongs under the category of Cursing G-d's Name (where it currently resides).
     
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  4. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    Additional Laws and Stuff

    The 30 Laws According to Samuel ben Hofni Gaon

    Samuel ben Hofni Gaon's Laws are here. Not that "requirement" in this instance means "under certain circumstances".
    Hidden for brevity (!).
    1. the prohibition of idol worship
    2. the prohibition of blasphemy
    3. the requirement to believe in the unity of G-d
    4. the requirement to pray
    5. the prohibition against taking false oaths
    6. the prohibition of suicide
    7. the prohibition of murder
    8. the prohibition of adultery with a married woman
    9. the requirement to marry through bride price and marriage gifts
    10. the prohibition of relations with one's sister
    11. the prohibition of relations with another male
    12. the prohibition of bestiality
    13. the prohibition of castration
    14. the prohibition against eating an animal that died on its own
    15. the prohibition of eating the limb of a live animal
    16. the prohibition of drinking the blood of a live animal
    17. the prohibition of cross-breeding animals
    18. the requirement of adjudication*
    19. the requirement to bring sacrifices (of the types a non-Jew may bring)
    20. the prohibition of stealing
    21. the requirement to honor one's father and mother
    22. passing one's child through fire (as in worship to Molech).
    23. meditating on a medium (like a crystal ball) to divine the future.
    24. diving auspicious times
    25. diving the future through omens
    26. using impure methods to cause supernatural phenomenon
    27. uses spells to control animals
    28. uses a type of ritual to raise a dead soul
    29. uses the bone of a certain type of bird in a ritual to learn the future
    30. starving oneself and sleeping in a graveyard to encounter a dead soul in one's dream

    *This one is illegible in the manuscript. However, its the law of adjudication is the only one missing in the manuscript of the 7 Laws

    Circumcision

    Most non-Jews are not required to circumcise themselves. There is an argument between Halachic arbitrators about whether a non-Jew who is not commanded to circumcise himself, may do so, due to a possible prohibition of causing a wound to oneself.

    However, Abraham was commanded to circumcise all the members of his household, and this included the six children of Keturah. There is a difference of opinion on whether this commandment extended to their children as well or not. According to the opinion that it does, now that that the children of Keturah have become completely enmeshed within the children of Ishmael, all Arabs are bound by this Law and required to circumcise their sons on the 8th day. According to the other opinion, this requirement was only on Abraham's children from Keturah and not later generations.

    Punishment
    With the exceptions of having relations with a Jewish betrothed woman (which is on penalty of stoning as for a Jew) and with a married Jewish woman (which is on penalty of choking as for a Jew), all other punishable transgressions are on penalty of decapitation. Not all transgressions are punishable. Not all penalties are allowed to be carried out.

    Although the age of majority for Jews is 13 years and one day with two grown pubic hairs, some are of the opinion that for non-Jews it is whenever they are deemed intellectually mature. There are those that argue.

    Reward
    There are (of course) various opinions on the nature of the reward for non-Jews' fulfilling the Noahide Laws. According to most opinions, Gerei Toshav receive reward in the World to Come.

    According to some, they are not resurrected during the Resurrection (which takes place before and is unrelated to one's reward in the World to Come). According to others, they are.

    Studying Torah
    As mentioned above, while it is prohibited for non-Jews to study Torah, it is a positive commandment for non-Jews to study the parts of the Torah that relate to them, ie. the Noahide Laws. The Talmud teaches that not only is it a positive commandment, one who does so is as great as the Jewish High Priest, meaning to say, as important as the service the High Priest (the holiest man) does when he enters the Holy of Holies (the holiest place) on the Day of Atonement (the holiest day).

    Charity
    According to some opinions, non-Jews are commanded to give charity. According to others, they are not, but they may accept the commandment on themselves to do so. However, if an idolatrous non-Jew gives charity to a Jew, it must be passed on to other non-Jews.

    Keeping other Laws
    With the exception of Sabbath (as above), the Passover sacrifice, phylacteries, mezuzah, and writing a Torah scroll, a non-Jew is allowed to keep any commandment of the Torah that is not already within his/her Laws and still receive reward for it as "not commanded and does".

    The other level is "commanded and does". This level receives greater reward, as someone who is commanded to do something, often has a greater urge not to do it then someone who decides to do it on their own will. The reward is higher reflecting the greater difficulty. Its this level that a Ger Toshav enjoys with regards to Noahide Laws.

    Sacrifices
    A non-Jew may also bring sacrifices to the Temple as burnt offerings, specifically.
    In fact, unlike Jews, a non-Jew may even build his own personal alter and offer any animal as a sacrifice at any time so long as its not missing a limb or was used for anything that is prohibited.

    Martyring Oneself
    It is permitted for a non-Jew to transgress any of the Noahide Laws rather than give up his life.

    Afterword
    More than what I have presented before you can be studied here. There are many, many more details available to be discussed, dissected and determined. Despite what you may have heard, as you can see from this short introduction, Judaism takes non-Jews extremely seriously, not any less so than it does Jews. Although it was never required for non-Jews to take on themselves the full body of Jewish Law, from what you can see here, there are still many serious obligations for non-Jews to fulfill in their capacity as non-Jews.

    Its easy to notice all the argument between Halachic arbitrators and commentaries. This is a common feature in Jewish Law, based on the principle that "these and these are the words of the Living G-d". Had there been demand for it, we would have had more decisive codified Laws to provide (as we have in the various codified texts of Jewish law), but its only recently that the Noahide movement has started moving.

    For Further Reading (thanks to @ Rosends for these resources and others)
    https://www.amazon.com/Path-Righteo...-3&keywords=The+Seven+Laws+of+Noah#nav-subnav
    https://web.archive.org/web/20050404102721/http://www.moshiach.com/action/morality/seven_laws.php
    http://www.noahide.com/minimum.htm
    http://www.wikinoah.org/index.php/Optional_observances_for_non-Jews
    http://www.shulchanaruch.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/The-Noahide-Laws-Lesson-One.pdf
     
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  5. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    I tend to view the Noachide Laws in a very broad context, so let me give an example: rape.

    OK, rape is not mentioned, so does that make it OK? Using the N.L. just on a literal level, I guess the answer would be yes.

    However, there's another way of looking at them, namely what appears to be their intent? Basically, they deal with believing and honoring God, along with compassion and justice/fairness towards all. If viewed in this manner, is rape OK? Clearly not.
     
  6. rosends

    rosends Well-Known Member

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  7. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    You're obviously correct. I used this listing:
    1. Do not deny God.
    2. Do not blaspheme God.
    3. Do not murder.
    4. Do not engage in illicit sexual relations.
    5. Do not steal.
    6. Do not eat of a live animal.
    7. Establish courts/legal system to ensure obedience to the law.
    Obviously rape would fall under #4, so thanks for the correction.
     
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  8. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    To me that's the Christian way of determining law. Look at the spirit of the law and ignore the actual requirements.
     
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  9. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    But the problem with the "requirements" by themselves is that they are way too few, whereas all sorts of atrocities could be committed without violating any of the seven.

    Secondly, where did I say or imply that the "the actual requirements" should be ignored?
     
  10. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    Considering the four pages of post on the Laws, I'm not entirely sure that is true.

    Not specifically in that way, but that we might be able to create additional laws on the basis of some nebulous spirit.
     
  11. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    I was referring to the actual seven Noachide Laws derived from Torah, not the numerous commentaries dealing with them.
     
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  12. Ehav4Ever

    Ehav4Ever Well-Known Member

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    Actually, it would fall under 5 and 7 also.
     
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  13. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    I have what I think are some respectful questions, which I think will not be difficult for the Dir to answer but which might be difficult for me to find out though web sites.

    A person may be pious one moment and not the next if their mind goes back and forth between believing and not believing: true or false?

    Someone (maybe Tumah) commented to me that Judaism emphasizes Torah study, so is the study of this Noachide material something which all Jews are supposed to study? Is it believed by Jews that this is something a pious non Jew would benefit from continually studying as if they were a Jew studying Torah? If so I may have a few other questions about it like how long this has been thought to be the case (how many centuries this has been thought about). Is this, in other words, of interest to Jews only? Does these Noachide laws intend advise on all aspects of life...like a system for living that fills every moment of the day?

    What is cursing a judge, and how does one remove a corrupt judge without cursing them?

    Is each provision for the world to come or the world we live in now? Are all of these for the world we live in now?

    If there is a 'World to come', will pious non Jews exist, will they have calendars, and will there be non-pious people?

    If a pious non Jew starts a task and never finishes it, then is that a means of not practicing religion? What about the opposite? (Related to the prohibition against Sabbaths).

    Why does a 'Ger Toshave' need support, and is this speaking about times when they are having trouble? Does it mean they don't have to work ever again or what?

    My last question is about whether you can be mistaken about this being for non Jews in a literal sense. I have read one translated page from one of the Talmud texts. In it there is argument between two or more people taking positions, and throw themselves into the part. What I mean is they don't use disclaimers such as "This is not my real opinion," yet they are taking extreme positions that they couldn't possibly actually hold. I'm sorry I don't remember enough detail to explain. Is it possible some of these arguments somewhere in the Talmud about pious non Jews are not actually intended to be for non Jews and are for edification of Jews studying the principles of Torah?
     
    #13 Brickjectivity, Oct 21, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2020
  14. Ehav4Ever

    Ehav4Ever Well-Known Member

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    True and false, depending on the person. A better way to look at it, rather than pious or not, would be the following.
    1. Each human being once they have established what the truth is would need to put into practice a lifestyle that is dedicated to understanding the reality we have been created in so that their entire lifestyle is revovles around interacting with the truth.
    2. There is no concept in the Torah of "beleif" as it is defined in the western sense. The first step of all humans is to know that there is a Source of creation. Once that has been accomplished, a Noachide would then understand that the Source gave the Torah to the Israeli/Jewish people at Mount Sinai.
    3. Once these first two areas have been established the work that person would face may be in directing their strengths and weaknesses in a way where they able to a) direct themselves towards the will of Hashem (7 mitzvoth) and b) derive the benefit from the reality that Hashem created.
    4. A very important part of mitzvoth is performing them in a community setting. There is a concept in Torath Mosheh that a person should do everything they can to a) marry those who families are wise in the ways of Hashem, b) live near and learn from those who are wise in the ways of Hashem, and c) teach others the ways of Hashem.
    Torah study for the sake of a) learning with the concept of putting into practice what is learned b) learning for the sake of being able to teach c) learning for the sake of drawing close to Hashem by learning the various aspects of what Hashem has given. Because, Torah has a lot of literature that is involved in the past and present study of Torah - which would include how the physical world works - then there are a lot of areas that a Jew could focus on or be familiar with. There are some Jews who have had more experience with the areas of study of the Noahide laws than others. Think of the Torah as a university and there are different disciplines and areas of focus at the university.

    The area of Torah study for a non-Jew would be the 7 mitzvoth. This is the Torah of the non-Jewish nations. There are things that overlap between Jews and non-Jews. Especially those mitzvoth that deal with the correct knowledge of Hashem, not doing Avodah Zara, etc. It is considered that in history there used to areas where Noachides dedicated themselves to the study of the 7 mitzvoth before the Torah was given at Mount Sinai. In fact, prior to the Torah being given at Mount Sinai, all Jewish patriarchs were Noachides with a few additonal mitzvoth they accepted from Hashem, that were not required from the rest of the world.

    It is considered to be the basis/foundation of life. Thus, yes if you have a particular foundation stabelizes everything you build above it. There is a concept that when the Torah states, let us make man, it is because Hashem creates all humans 50% and it is up to us to build the other 50%. Given, that life is filled with learning as a part of developing a properly structured life it would fill every moment, if a person decides to shape their reality that way.

    There are a whole set of concepts that in English can be considered cursing. They often deal with either false information about someone that can damage their character or even positive information that can also damage their character. Yet, removing corruption is no a part of either or these. Corruption is considered something that is not allowed a) by the judge of his own character and b) not allowed by the society he resides in. Thus, socieites are required to remove corrupt judges because of their effects on society. Further, one is allowed to spread information about corruption for the sake of a) trying to cause the corrupt person to realise their mistakes and b) if they refuse to come clean to remove them from service. I.e. removing corruption is a mitzvah as a part of establishing justice.

    They are for both. Think of this world like the boot camp that gives the training for the world to come.

    Yes, a Noachide who keeps the 7 mitzvoth as they were brought down by Moses from Hashem have a place in the world to come. The calender for the Noachide is no different than the calender of a Jew. The Noachide simply has not mitzvah to a) travel to Jerusalem during Passover and Shavuoth while in the days of the future Davidic king and Israel keeping Torah non-Jews are considered to come to Jerusalem during Sukkot. In terms of people who don't keep the mitzvoth, for the sake of not wanting to accept that Hashem gave them, would have no place in the world to come. There is also a consideration that some people receive in this world all they could have had in the world to come. Like their actions saying, "I don't want all that world to come stuff in the world to come. I want it all now." Such a person may have all the benefits they deserve in this world while having nothing in the world to come.

    The Torah does not subscribe to the concept of "religion." It deals with what is the truth of a matter. I.e. we have the ability from Hashem to accept or reject the truth and what we are responsible for in life. The concept is starting and not finishing a task is not something that would really be applicable since at the end of the day Hashem knows each person's strengths, weaknesses, and reasoning. Thus, on one side a Noachide has no requirement or responsibility to keep Shabbat. They thus do not receive a reward for doing such.

    Because a Geir Toshav is a Noachide who has been approved by a Mosaic Court to live in the land of Israel. Because Israel is foreign to them [Geir Toshav] we Jews are required to support them for as long as they live here. They can work but they would not have an family inheritance because they are not from here.

    The challenge you face with the Talmud is that you would have to have read, starting at the Mishnah and then through the Gemara. Doing so, w/o a knowledge of Hebrew and Aramaic, puts you at a loss. Also, there is a type of language and code/logic used in the Talmud that you would have to know/understand to know what is being talked and about why. You would further need to understand what the different types of Talmudic text is. There are some that are legal, there are some where they are trying to determine the source of a particular mitzvah and not the mitzvah itself, and there are some things that are just ideas/concepts being discussed with no legal bearing.

    I hope that helps.
     
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  15. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    I'm not sure this would be a question of piety, as I understand that to be more of a general disposition than a situation specific one. But the more general question of whether or not a person may move between positive and negative actions/thoughts, then yes, I think that's the way the spirit naturally moves and this distinguishes us from the angels who cannot become more or less than they are.

    Yes, it is Torah.
    Exactly so.
    The Orthodox will probably argue it's been the case at least since Moses if not earlier.
    I don't understand the question in this context.
    No, the Noahide laws aren't a religious way of life.
    "I curse you in the name of G-d"
    "You are hereby removed from office"
    The world to come.
    See above.
    That's a question on the nature of the world to come.
    No,
    pquote[If a pious non Jew starts a task and never finishes it, then is that a means of not practicing religion? What about the opposite? (Related to the prohibition against Sabbaths).[/quote]
    I don't understand the question.
    I tend to think that in those times when a person moved to a different nation, unless they were coming with a lot of personal wealth, it could be hard to make money. Because these people were willing to accept our G-d - even though they chose not to join the nation, we had a national obligation to help sustain them in their endeavor should they need it.

    No, this is not possible. Leaving aside the page of translated Talmud you read which I could not possibly comment about in any meaningful way with the information you provided, to the best of my knowledge there is no Talmudic opinion that the Noahide Laws are not for non-Jews.[/quote]
     
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  16. Jake1001

    Jake1001 Computer Simulator

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    This post is too long for me to read, but I’ll be glad to add some “Park Ave” Jewish views. Noahide stuff is Genesis period religion, probably recorded around 460BC by the scribe Ezra. Before that the folks wrote on tree bark and inside caves. So it is of limited value, with only historical contextual significance.

    But if we want to delve further back in history we should look at when Solomon built the 1st Temple. This was around 950BC. That was the “dark ages”.
     
    #16 Jake1001, Nov 1, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2020
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