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Jewish Messiah

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Sleeppy, Nov 13, 2013.

  1. CMike

    CMike Well-Known Member

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    Yes. He fulfilled none. Jesus fulfilled none.

    His story is different than Jesus.

    However it's the same idea.

    Both falsely claimed to be the messiah.
     
  2. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    That is what I'm talking about. Is The Messiah something created by the Christians? They say he was a miracle working God/man, born of a virgin, resurrected from the dead etc. etc. All the great "proofs" in their Bible that says he was from God, like the Holy Spirit descending on him like a dove, a voice from heaven saying "this is my beloved son," the hundreds of "prophecies" he fulfilled, yet, in reality, he didn't fulfill any of the real Messianic prophecies? Now that's a miracle; how it has fooled so many people.
     
    #42 CG Didymus, Nov 23, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2013
  3. CMike

    CMike Well-Known Member

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    Lol very true.
     
  4. Sees

    Sees Dragonslayer

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    Great thread, this is a topic not considered often enough in Christian circles.

    When I was a young, enthusiastic Christian who had begun doing more thorough research, it quickly seemed as though the authors/editors of the New Testament either did not understand Hebrew or were intentionally mistranslating and twisting words.

    The lack of a virgin birth prophecy in the Tanakh was a sickening realization.
     
  5. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    Attributing any of Isaiah to Jesus is pretty bizarre theology when one takes a step back and looks at the woods and not just the trees. The basic theme of Isaiah is:
    We were punished by not following the Law close enough.
    A remnant was restored.
    We were told we must then follow the Law much more closely.

    Exactly how does Jesus and Christianity fit into that picture?
     
  6. AmbiguousGuy

    AmbiguousGuy Well-Known Member

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    Just curious... does it bother you at all that regular secular people view you as magic believers?

    Not trying to start a fight. Just wondering how you feel about it.
     
  7. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Of course not. You're simply trying to demean ...
     
  8. Sees

    Sees Dragonslayer

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    Without some element of magic, spirit/s, the supernatural, etc. we wouldn't be talking about religion but simply philosophy.
     
  9. AmbiguousGuy

    AmbiguousGuy Well-Known Member

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    I'd try to engage you on this, but I understand that you'll refuse to do so.

    So I've just reported your insult.
     
  10. Shermana

    Shermana Heretic

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    And Bar Kokhba fulfilled none.

    My point is that there's none for a Messiah to fulfill in the first place.

    The concept of "Fulfilling Messianic prophecy" as an individual is a completely fabricated concept that is not anywhere close to being necessarily true. It's a possible interpretation at best.

    I am saying that it's perfectly legitimate to view the "messianic prophecies" simply as a series of events unfolding over years into a "Happily ever after" Climax after the "Suffering Servant" (who I will argue is NOT just a metaphor for Israel unless actual context is meaningless) is made the Guilt offering.
     
  11. CMike

    CMike Well-Known Member

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    No it's not that's not what the prophesies say.

    The messianic prophesies include an era where

    There is world peace

    All the jews will come to Israel

    All the jews will stay in Israel

    One unified king of the jews

    All the nations will worship one G-D

    And the temple in jerusalem will be rebuilt and stand forever

    The messiah will be the jewish leader when these events occur

    Oncea again, it's not about the messiah (the person) it's about the messianic era.
     
  12. Akivah

    Akivah Well-Known Member

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    Yes, the definition and description you provided is 100% Christian.

    The correct defintion within Judaism is completely different. Actually Christianity has come up with their own definitions of many words, such as sin, salvation, atonement, and god.
     
  13. Meeka_S

    Meeka_S Welcome to Meeka Seth.

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    I think I need more clarifications on it, please advice if you have something more.
     
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