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Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Fool, Sep 11, 2017.

  1. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    If Christians give Jesus the glory, then is Jesus responsible for a christian's actions?
     
  2. gottalovemoses

    gottalovemoses Im mad as Hell!

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    I don't see your logic sir.
    God(Jesus) is not responsible for our behaviour, we are.
    The more we get to know Him though, the more He will influence our behaviour.
    Still it is wrong to pass the buck to God for our actions. Its like a child blaming a parent. "He made me do it."
     
  3. Tmac

    Tmac Active Member

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    There is a Chinese proverb, "If you save a life, you responsible for that life.". I don't think that was Jesus's idea, to give glory to him. I think he was about teaching us about who we really are, sons and daughters of ...
     
  4. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    and yet there are those who don't want to be responsible for their actions; its usually their negative actions. when it's a positive action, they tend to be very proud of themselves.
     
  5. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    It's an interesting idea, when concerning salvation. In some way, Jesus is responsible for a disciples actions, because the disciple acts within the context that Jesus provided.

    However, having freewill, so forth, a persons actions are their own, and only the discipleship and other christian actions are given to Jesus.
     
    #5 syncretic, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  6. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    You have answered your own question. The needless pride, is because they are not giving the glory to Jesus, and they are relying on salvation through works.

    This of course is an idea that crept into the churches, yet is directly against scripture and tradition.

    Only Jesus saves, not your works.
     
    #6 syncretic, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  7. Sleeppy

    Sleeppy Fatalist. Christian. Pacifist.

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    God is the source of righteousness/good, and therefore ALL glory belongs to Him. We are of this source, but because we are limited, we produce mostly shortcomings of righteousness.
     
  8. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    christ saves. christ isn't exclusive to a personality.


    Jeremiah 51:11
    Make bright the arrows; gather the shields: the Lord hath raised up the spirit of the kings of the Medes: for his device is against Babylon, to destroy it; because it is the vengeance of the Lord, the vengeance of his temple.


    Romans 8:11
    But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
     
    #8 Fool, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  9. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    Jesus the Christ.

    Your idea of separating Jesus from "Christ", is causing problems for your theories.

    Christ means God, and Jesus is called the Christ.
    Jesus isn't "us", He is different, and there we do not assume the nature of G-d, by default.
     
    #9 syncretic, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  10. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    i'm not separating jesus from christ. christ is all and in all. you are separating christ from himself and everything besides jesus.

    the name of jesus is exodus 3:14, or I AM that i am, or christ is all and in all as stated in colossian 3:11.

    1 Corinthians 6:15
    15 Know you not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.


    not members of jesus, or a/an harlot/idolator.
     
  11. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    You're contradicting yourself.

    If 'everything' is deity, then Jesus, would be deity as well. Then you may as well say that 'we' are one with Jesus.

    The bible differentiates ideas, etc.
    The early physical church was called the 'Church of God', and they differentiated themselves from Gentiles, and 'Jews'.

    The "we" used in the bible is contextual as to who is being addressed, it doesn't mean 'everyone', much less 'everything'.

    Your premises are very problematic.
     
  12. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    I will quote it for you.

    John 14:20
    At that day you shall know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.

    Jesus isn't in me and I'm not in Jesus. what was in Jesus and what in me are one and the same thing, Christ.


    John 21:15

    feed my christs - arnion or Christ (28x) and Lamb(1x)
     
    #12 Fool, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  13. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    And 'you' doesn't mean everyone. You're ignoring context.
     
  14. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    i know you doesn't mean everyone.

    everything is created by the Spirit of God

    genesis 1 and john 1 tells you this.

    there isn't anything that isn't made apart from God because God is omnipresent in the creation and the created. it is created within God and not separate/apart from God.

    it's your perspective that you and God are separate. the bible doesn't teach that. that is your state of mind. that isn't the bible's. like it says in isaiah 66 you have chosen your own delusion.
     
  15. eldios

    eldios Active Member

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    No. Our Creator is responsible for everything IT created.
     
  16. syncretic

    syncretic Veteran Member

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    We're going to have to agree to disagree, then.

    I don't know what you're religious background is, however I don't feel the need to interpret people, /or everything, as deity.
     
  17. Fool

    Fool Well-Known Member
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    by all means you have the power to always turn away from the face of god and the kingdom from within.

    Revelation 10:1
    And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:

    Revelation 22:4
    4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

    2 Corinthians 3:18
    But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.



    my system identifies basically with quakerism.

    jesus said you are the light of the world; which is Christ.
     
    #17 Fool, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  18. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe saying a few words won't cause that to be true but when Jesus does act through a Christian He should get the credit and the glory.
     
  19. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe the whole concept of Christianity is that Jesus (God) is responsible for our actions because that is what He wants and we have given it to Him.
     
  20. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    Joh 5:41 I receive not glory from men.
    Joh 8:54 Jesus answered, If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing: it is my Father that glorifieth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God;
     
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