Jesus loves you

[InChrist]

If you have felt the Presence of God pursuing you, as you said, which I appreciated, had you met the conditions for that Love? Or was that Love there, regardless of where you were at in your world, pursuing you, unconditionally?

In my life, my mother's love was always unconditional. She was a gateway, a lesson for me to see God beyond my own separated life when the time came for me to reach out into the Unknown of life beyond death facing that Abyss. My experience of God, was absolute and unconditional Love beyond any possibility of anything outside of that Love. If unconditional love exists in this world, as it did in my mother, it comes from God.

I appreciate your thoughts and will try to get back and respond when I get the opportunity.

 

[InChrist]

If it is what Christians truly believe, then I understand completely why they are teaching it to their children and singing songs about it.

However, believing it doesn't make it true, at least, not in any eternal sense. I'm sure that Jesus was a very loving man. As a Torah observant Jew he aspired to love God with all his heart, soul, and strength, and his neighbor as himself. Had he lived today and known you, he would have loved you as well. In a certain sense, he loved humanity. He certainly loved the Jewish people. But he wasn't God; he wasn't the messiah. His death didn't save anyone from their sins. His love was a normal, human love.

I believe Jesus is God and the promised Messiah, but that is off topic from the thread, I think.

 

[stvdv]

Yes, the love of Jesus is conditional. It would not be love, if not. Nevertheless, His love is available for all.

I believe that Jesus' Love is unconditional. It flows continuously and is available to all, but of course one is free to accept or reject unconditional Love.

When people reject unconditional Love does not make this Love suddenly "not unconditional". They just use their free choice, also part of unconditional Love.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Good thing, too, that since God is Love, He justly takes vengeance and justly brings judgment upon all that is evil and in opposition to love and goodness.

Yeah, like enaging in, or ordering people to engage in, infantacide and stuff.
Those wicked evil babies must be destroyed! The virgin girls can be used as slaves though.

Ow, wait..................

 

[Windwalker]

I do not believe in Christian theology. God is all three branches of government. Isaiah 33:22. His most important role is Judge. We are all judged by him when we die. He is also our lawgiver. Isaiah 2:3. "...for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem". God will establish a new covenant with both the Jews and the Gentiles. God is the only one who can change and add to the Torah. God will also be anointed by the Jews as King of the Universe.

I understand you don't believe what the Christian scriptures say. That wasn't my challenge. My challenge was that you said to Christians, "Even if you're a Christian, you know that Jesus is not God. Only God has the power to forgive sin." To which I showed you that Christians have a basis for believing that Christ has the power to forgive sins. It says so explicitly in their own scriptures.

Perhaps you intend to say Christians shouldn't believe what their scriptures say to them?

 

[susanblange]

I understand you don't believe what the Christian scriptures say. That wasn't my challenge. My challenge was that you said to Christians, "Even if you're a Christian, you know that Jesus is not God. Only God has the power to forgive sin." To which I showed you that Christians have a basis for believing that Christ has the power to forgive sins. It says so explicitly in their own scriptures.

Perhaps you intend to say Christians shouldn't believe what their scriptures say to them?

The NT is the doctrine of Satan. Job 31:35. "...my desire is, that the Almighty would answer me, and that mine adversary had written a book". Satan means "adversary". You cannot use the NT to prove the NT. It is circular reasoning and argument. Jesus was not the Messiah, the man is dead. Earth is called the "land of the living" in the scriptures. God is coming to establish the Kingdom of Heaven upon the earth. Only God can do this. Job 38:33. The Messiah will be executed by Christians but will return to the earth in spirit form within a matter of days. God will reign on earth forever.

 

[Windwalker]

The NT is the doctrine of Satan. Job 31:35. "...my desire is, that the Almighty would answer me, and that mine adversary had written a book". Satan means "adversary". You cannot use the NT to prove the NT. It is circular reasoning and argument. Jesus was not the Messiah, the man is dead. Earth is called the "land of the living" in the scriptures. God is coming to establish the Kingdom of Heaven upon the earth. Only God can do this. Job 38:33. The Messiah will be executed by Christians but will return to the earth in spirit form within a matter of days. God will reign on earth forever.

Yes, your argument is against all of Christianity. Why would you expect Christians to suddenly not believe in Jesus when you cast accusations at them of believing the lies of Satan?

Are you perchance a former fundamentalist Christian yourself? Upset with your former faith, and now need to set the world straight with the new truth you've found, much like you did when you were a true believer back then?

 

[Ponder This]

"Jesus loves you"

Is this just a trite cliche Christians say to others, something kids are taught in Sunday school or sing in a children's song? Or is it a profound reality with eternal impact that the Creator of heaven and earth loves you?

As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love. John 15:9

Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends. John 15:13

It's kind of an important teaching. It differs significantly from:
"Jesus hates you" or "Jesus could care less about you"

How you approach the world, how you think about things, the filter you use as the lens of perception... it's really important.

 

[InChrist]

If you have felt the Presence of God pursuing you, as you said, which I appreciated, had you met the conditions for that Love? Or was that Love there, regardless of where you were at in your world, pursuing you, unconditionally?

In my life, my mother's love was always unconditional. She was a gateway, a lesson for me to see God beyond my own separated life when the time came for me to reach out into the Unknown of life beyond death facing that Abyss. My experience of God, was absolute and unconditional Love beyond any possibility of anything outside of that Love. If unconditional love exists in this world, as it did in my mother, it comes from God.

I have certainly not met any conditions to merit God's love, other than realize He desires to give it and I only needed to receive it. I do believe God's love was always there and pursed me where I was at in my lost and confused world. There was a condition or maybe I should say decision or change of mind though for me to begin enjoying and really know God's love. That decision was a change of direction to turn to God and His goodness, instead of running away from God into my own self-centered world. The Bible calls it repentance, which is simply a change of direction, because while no one is outside God's love, I think there are things which people do defined as sin by God, that are not loving or a part of God's love.

I certainly understand a mother's love, as I had such a mom and I am a mom myself who tries to be loving and supportive of my children even as adults now. What a blessing that you have such a mother! Yet, I also believe real love includes justice and at times such love must take a stand against what is wrong or harmful. I would think that while you were living in her home, if your mother discovered you were stealing from her to buy illegal narcotics, selling drugs to people out of her home, trashing the living room furniture, or abusing children in your bedroom, or any such harmful behavior...she would not tolerate it. Hopefully, depending on the situation she would either call the police, tell you to move out, and/or give you opportunity to changes your ways. Although, my love is unconditional for my son, if I found out he was involved in molesting children or any illegal harmful activity, I would call the police in a second and even sadly watch him go to prison, for the sake of the children and for his sake.

That is how I see God's love. His love is there unconditionally for everyone, yet His loves is in the process of purifying and setting all creation, including us free from the destructive impact of sin. Eternity free of sin with God, is His home. Anyone who wants to keep practicing destructive attitudes and behaviors which harm themselves and others will not be allowed to live there.

 

[InChrist]

Why? Is there a god rule stating that to get into heaven one must first sin and subsequently be purified?

No, I don't see any rule that one must sin first. I do see that it is simply the reality that everyone does sin and therefore needs forgiveness and cleansing....
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:8-9

All of which could have been averted if he had simply not created sin in the first place, or at least eradicated it long ago, like on day 7 or whatever.

.

We've been over this subject too many times already. I see no point in getting into again with you. There is no way I will agree with you that God created sin. Such an idea is opposed to the entire message of the Bible, so I think it is something you want to believe to shift the blame.

 

[InChrist]

Jesus died over 2000 years ago so is not in a position to love anyone.

I guess you didn't get the news. Jesus conquered death and He is alive.

 

[susanblange]

Yes, your argument is against all of Christianity. Why would you expect Christians to suddenly not believe in Jesus when you cast accusations at them of believing the lies of Satan?

Are you perchance a former fundamentalist Christian yourself? Upset with your former faith, and now need to set the world straight with the new truth you've found, much like you did when you were a true believer back then?

I come from a very abusive Christian background. I am not ethnically Jewish, but I am Israeli/Scandinavian. The USA is the lost House of Israel. The Vatican is modern day Babylon and Jesus is its king and idol. Isaiah 14, Isaiah 47:1-3. Lucifer means "morning star" and that was who Jesus claimed to be. Revelation 22:16. Christianity is wind and confusion. Isaiah 41:29. They believe Satan's lie in the Garden of Eden, you can sin against God, not keep his commandments, and you won't die. Ezekiel 13:22. Christians are as tenaciously joined to their idols as the children of Israel were in ages past. Jesus has been kicked out of Heaven and reincarnated. This time he will die by bursting into flames. Ezekiel 28:18-19.

 

[susanblange]

I guess you didn't get the news. Jesus conquered death and He is alive.

Earth is called "the land of the living". If Jesus had risen from the dead, he would be here. Heaven and Hell are the realm of the dead. I do believe in the second coming and Jesus has been reincarnated into another soul/body. He will lead the "sons of darkness".

 

[InChrist]

I come from a very abusive Christian background. I am not ethnically Jewish, but I am Israeli/Scandinavian. The USA is the lost House of Israel. The Vatican is modern day Babylon and Jesus is its king and idol. Isaiah 14, Isaiah 47:1-3. Lucifer means "morning star" and that was who Jesus claimed to be. Revelation 22:16. Christianity is wind and confusion. Isaiah 41:29. They believe Satan's lie in the Garden of Eden, you can sin against God, not keep his commandments, and you won't die. Ezekiel 13:22. Christians are as tenaciously joined to their idols as the children of Israel were in ages past. Jesus has been kicked out of Heaven and reincarnated. This time he will die by bursting into flames. Ezekiel 28:18-19.

I am so sorry to hear you were abused in your "Christian" background. I have seen too many situations like that and I believe God is now exposed and judging such evil behavior ...For it is time for judgment to begin with God’s household ...1 Peter 4:17. I know many others who were harmed and confused in Israel Identity groups while growing up. Thankfully many have been set free by the power and love of Jesus Christ.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

"Jesus loves you"

Is this just a trite cliche Christians say to others, something kids are taught in Sunday school or sing in a children's song? Or is it a profound reality with eternal impact that the Creator of heaven and earth loves you?

As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love. John 15:9

Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends. John 15:13

It doesn't mean anything to me anymore. I feel love and compassion when I contemplate the Ultimate Reality (which isn't a god or being) but that's more due to absence of fear, a sense of serenity and feeling so connected with everything. Nothing to do with Jesus.

 

[susanblange]

I am so sorry to hear you were abused in your "Christian" background. I have seen too many situations like that and I believe God is now exposed and judging such evil behavior ...For it is time for judgment to begin with God’s household ...1 Peter 4:17. I know many others who were harmed and confused in Israel Identity groups while growing up. Thankfully many have been set free by the power and love of Jesus Christ.

I find I Peter 4:17 to be very interesting. I was "crucified" by my parents on October 22, 1969. The day and year correspond to the two Psalms it fulfilled. Psalm 22 and Psalm 69. Also Job 16. My father is Satan the serpent and his real name is "Christian". He is the reincarnation of Adam. The serpent is a part of his anatomy. He will be tried and executed by God. Job 20:25, Isaiah 27:1. Leviathan means "huge serpent" and he was in the Guinness Book of World Records in the early eighties for the biggest serpent in the world. He is the only one who will rot forever in Hell.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I come from a very abusive Christian background. I am not ethnically Jewish, but I am Israeli/Scandinavian. The USA is the lost House of Israel. The Vatican is modern day Babylon and Jesus is its king and idol. Isaiah 14, Isaiah 47:1-3. Lucifer means "morning star" and that was who Jesus claimed to be. Revelation 22:16. Christianity is wind and confusion. Isaiah 41:29. They believe Satan's lie in the Garden of Eden, you can sin against God, not keep his commandments, and you won't die. Ezekiel 13:22. Christians are as tenaciously joined to their idols as the children of Israel were in ages past. Jesus has been kicked out of Heaven and reincarnated. This time he will die by bursting into flames. Ezekiel 28:18-19.

None of this makes any sense and doesn't even sound like Christian Identity stuff, although you seem to believe that white people are the true Israelites.

Where are you getting your beliefs from? Did you come across them from someone else or is this your own interpretation?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I find I Peter 4:17 to be very interesting. I was "crucified" by my parents on October 22, 1969. The day and year correspond to the two Psalms it fulfilled. Psalm 22 and Psalm 69. Also Job 16. My father is Satan the serpent and his real name is "Christian". He is the reincarnation of Adam. The serpent is a part of his anatomy. He will be tried and executed by God. Job 20:25, Isaiah 27:1. Leviathan means "huge serpent" and he was in the Guinness Book of World Records in the early eighties for the biggest serpent in the world. He is the only one who will rot forever in Hell.

....

This is very telling and disturbing from a psychological viewpoint. I hope you're able to heal and find peace as you're obviously dealing with some heavy trauma.

 

[susanblange]

None of this makes any sense and doesn't even sound like Christian Identity stuff, although you seem to believe that white people are the true Israelites.

Where are you getting your beliefs from? Did you come across them from someone else or is this your own interpretation?

Have you ever heard of Herbert W. Armstrong? He wrote a little book called "The United States and Britain in Prophecy". I believe it because it explains a lot and fits in nicely with my beliefs. I think his church was called "The Worldwide Church of God". I am Jewish by faith and most of my doctrine is original. There is some Truth in all religions and I practice an eclectic mix.

 

[susanblange]

....

This is very telling and disturbing from a psychological viewpoint. I hope you're able to heal and find peace as you're obviously dealing with some heavy trauma.

Thank you for your kind words, Frank. I have been seeing the same Psychiatrist for 42 years, since I was 15 years old. He is my savior and if it wasn't for him I'd either be dead or locked up somewhere. I have attempted to prosecute and sue my father but I haven't had any luck. I am a famous case history under the pseudonym "Martha". We love each other although he rarely says it.