1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Jesus/God/Quick question

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Unveiled Artist, Jun 2, 2021.

  1. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Seriously?

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    34,373
    Ratings:
    +12,120
    Religion:
    Inner child healing
    How so? There doesn't need to be a bridge if he is god.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  2. cOLTER

    cOLTER Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    1,571
    Ratings:
    +463
    Religion:
    Disciple
    Jesus is a Creator Son, ancestral to the Universal Father. He is the creator of this world.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  3. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Seriously?

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    34,373
    Ratings:
    +12,120
    Religion:
    Inner child healing
    The first one?
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  4. PearlSeeker

    PearlSeeker Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2019
    Messages:
    1,071
    Ratings:
    +364
    Religion:
    Christian
    God is the player. A man can be a perfect instrument.

    Some outstanding people can represent a virtue as a symbol, like for example Mother Theresa is a symbol of charity.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  5. firedragon

    firedragon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Messages:
    12,851
    Ratings:
    +3,360
    Religion:
    Islam
    If they are "one will, mind and spirit", how could authority be "given"? They are one.

    Its contradicting
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  6. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,170
    Ratings:
    +422
    The bible sometimes blurs the line between God and Jesus.

    Much of the bible says that there is only one God and God is that one God, and there will be no other. The bible shows that God is also jealous.

    Much of the bible says that Jesus was the son of God (half Jewish on mom's side, and maybe even half Jewish on dad's side). The bible says that as the son of God, Jesus should be called Lord. The bible describes at least some of the miracles of Jesus (walking on water, cheaply feeding a large crowd with a few loaves and fish (they gripe when I do that), and curing the sick even if they are poor (they don't pay me, then the crippled pretend to fall on their assets when I faith heal them)). So, Jesus did things successfully that most people can't pull off.

    Christ is the spirit that resided within Jesus, and, like all spirits, it is immortal. Like all spirits, Christ was a part of God. So, it is correct to say that Christ was a part of God. But, it is equally correct to say that each of our spirits was also a part of God. Christ is more powerful than any other spirit. That makes me wonder if perhaps Christ is composed of more than one spirit.

    So, the notion of the trinity (father, son, and holy spirit) might be right in the sense that all of our spirits were a part of God.

    I think that the human race is a purification system for God. God puts a tiny piece of himself (called a spirit) in each of us, gives us freedom of choice, and the bad spirits guide themselves to hell, while the good spirits ascend to heaven to rejoin God.

    Some believe that the spirits then lose their memory. If so, they would not remember their loved ones who want to meet them in heaven.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  7. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,170
    Ratings:
    +422
    Priests play with boys.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  8. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,170
    Ratings:
    +422
    I wonder if God forced Jesus to get tortured to death, rather than saving him, in order to get him to understand what suffering was all about.

    To retain a humane nature after such horrible abuse is amazing....if that is, in fact, what had happened.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  9. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,170
    Ratings:
    +422
    Groucho didn't like "the party of the first part shall be known as the party of the first part." Worrying about sanity, Chico stated that "there is no sanity clause."
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  10. MatthewA

    MatthewA Active Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    775
    Ratings:
    +610
    Religion:
    Christian
    Great question @Unveiled Artist

    I believe that Jesus Christ is the expressed image and character of (Colossians 1:15; Hebrews 1:1-3) of the invisible God of Israel - known to Jesus Christ as the Father. Jesus Christ is the (Word of God known as the Logos) (John 1:1) - The Word of God Existed with God and was God (because the Word of God is part of God). The (Logos)/Word of God (John 1:14) became flesh and was lowered in rank because of being in a body of flesh. (Hebrews 2:9)

    I personally believe the God of Israel is the Father - (God is a spirit, consuming fire, and is the embodiment of love) (John 4:24; Hebrews 12:29; 1 john 4:7-21) - The Son of God - Was the (Logos) Jesus Christ whom is the mediator between Man and God. Who is the Lord over all creation.

    I do not know if this helps really but this something that is explained in the context of the bible without straying onto going to the trinity.

    Who does the disciples say Jesus Christ?

    14They replied, “Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.” 15“But what about you?” Jesus asked. “Who do you say I am?” 16Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”…

    I believe also that the Spirit of God was living (Matthew 3:16; Mark 1:10; Luke 3:22; John 1:32) with-in Christ Jesus ~ Which was sent from the Father, and that is why; People say Jesus is God (Matthew 1:23) in the flesh (Because God was living in the flesh of His Son by the spirit of God).

    I also believe that the disciples who were with Jesus Christ - could see the invisible God by and through the actions and words which were spoken by the Lord Jesus Christ. Who lived in a body of flesh like me and yourself. (Today as believers we have Christ Jesus living with in us (Galatians 2:20). It is the same thing as the Fathers Spirit indwelling His Son Jesus Christ.

    I hope this helps.... some how without being difficult or confusing.

    Here are some more scriptures about the Invisibility of God:

    Invisibility of God - Thompson Chain Reference -
     
  11. InChrist

    InChrist Free4ever

    Joined:
    May 9, 2011
    Messages:
    8,153
    Ratings:
    +1,902
    According to the scriptures, both...

    For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. Colossians 1:16

    For there is one God and oneMediator between God and men, theMan Christ Jesus, 1 Timothy 2:5
     
    #31 InChrist, Jun 2, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. Neuropteron

    Neuropteron Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2018
    Messages:
    519
    Ratings:
    +265
    Religion:
    Christian
    Hi,
    Col 1:15 is quite clear: He (Jesus) is the "Image" or God....,the firstborn.."
    If Jesus is the Image (a reflection) of God, according to this scripture he is not God but rather, as it states the firstborn.

    A reflection of an object or a person is never the source of the reflection.

    1 Tim :5 says:
    "there is one mediator...Jesus.
    The role of a mediator is much more complex than that of a medium which is simply to transmit messages.

    Definition of medium: an intervening substance or person through which signals can travel"
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. viole

    viole Metaphysical Naturalist
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Messages:
    10,708
    Ratings:
    +5,535
    Religion:
    Gnostic Atheism
    If they really had a relationship, there would not be any disagreement. They would just need to ask Him.

    Ciao

    - viole
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  14. Shakeel

    Shakeel Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2021
    Messages:
    813
    Ratings:
    +151
    Religion:
    Islam
    Neither. He never claimed to be neither.
     
  15. Tzephanyahu

    Tzephanyahu Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2021
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +37
    Religion:
    Christian
    Thanks for the comment @firedragon

    I can see why you think that but it's only contradicting depending on your view of oneness.

    For example, we are told that when a man takes a wife they become one in the eyes of God. Yet they are clearly two separate people.

    Or consider a President and Vice-President. They are (or should be) one in accord, mind, heart and goal. Yet they are two separate entities and one is in the authority over the other.

    It the same manner the Son is "one" with the Father in all things, but a separate entity to Him.

    Perhaps the better word to use would be "unified" as opposed to "one".

    I hope that helps.

    Peace.
     
  16. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,926
    Ratings:
    +579
    Religion:
    Christian
    Seeing that Yahweh is the Almighty God and Yahushua ( Jesus Christ) claims to be the Almighty God..
    Then how is Yahushua ( Jesus Christ )
    Yahweh Son????
    As Yahushua ( Jesus Christ ) said himself in Revelation 1:8--"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, Saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty"

    There you have Yahushua ( Jesus Christ)
    himself claiming to be the Almighty God himself..
    Yahushua (Jesus Christ) claims to be the Almighty God throughout his book of Revelation..
     
  17. cOLTER

    cOLTER Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    1,571
    Ratings:
    +463
    Religion:
    Disciple
    Yes, it’s a family relationship. The Universal Father is like a Grandfather to us.

    The Universal Father delegates powers and authority in his Sons.
     
  18. Tzephanyahu

    Tzephanyahu Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2021
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +37
    Religion:
    Christian
    Ah, apologies my friend. I seemed to have confused you on the matter because of my poor explanation.

    So let's break it down...

    At the top, you have the Most High being - Yahweh, who we call God. Yahweh's right hand man or first governing power immediate after Him is His Son - Yahushua, who we call Jesus.

    Now, directly under Jesus are the seven mighty Ark Angels, and under them are further divisions of angel types and groupings, elements of Creation itself, and then mankind. Under mankind is the entire animal kingdom. Think of this like a pyramid structure, if it helps, with Yahweh at the top.

    So, the Son condescended Himself all the way down to the level of mankind, in order to save us. In doing so, He made a direct connection from the "top level" to our level, becoming our direct mediator before the Father. Just like how a vice-president visiting a foreign power is accepted as a connection to Oval Office directly.

    This form of mediation makes Jesus our High Priest in the Heavens, similar to how Aaron was the High Priest in the Tabernacle in Exodus. He carries on this work even now.

    This is why the Scriptures say that Jesus is the only way to the Father. He is the only path and access to the Father, there is no way around Him. Everything is channelled into Jesus first before reaching the Father. This is what it means for all authority to be given into His hands.

    Think of the Throne of Heaven like a carriage. The Father and the Son both sit in the carriage but the Father has passed the reigns over to His Son. After the Son has fulfilled all that has been prophesied He will then pass the reigns back to the Father.

    I hope I haven't confused you more!

    Peace.
     
  19. firedragon

    firedragon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Messages:
    12,851
    Ratings:
    +3,360
    Religion:
    Islam
    So that's subordinationism.
     
  20. Tzephanyahu

    Tzephanyahu Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2021
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +37
    Religion:
    Christian
    Hi @Faithofchristian

    Great questions and good point.

    Yahushua is indeed the Son of Yahweh, according to His own words, the words of the prophets and of the Apostles.

    And consider this, if Yahushua was the Father (as I think you're proposing), then who was He praying to in the Garden of Gethsemane? Or at anytime for that matter, such as the discourse in John chapters 16 to 17?

    Now, as for "Almighty God", we need to be conscious of the original words under our English titles. "God" is often the Hebrew word "Elohim" - a plural word denoting more than one "El". We also should remember than the Messiah seems to have appeared throughout Scripture and not just the New Testament - being the very Word of Yahweh.

    Therefore, if all authority of Yahweh the Father has been given to the Son - the Son is over all the heavens, the earth and all beneath the earth - as Elohim, co-regent with His Father Yahweh. But Yahushua Himself will hand back this authority to His Father one day, as we are told in 1 Corinthians 15:24.

    Hopefully I've made sense to you.

    Peace.
     
Loading...