Jesus Feels Forsaken - Divinity and Humanity

[Being]

I'm curious to know other people's perspectives on what is happening to the character of Jesus in the following passage. I'm familiar with various theological views. So, if you could also offer a psychological or a sociological view, that would be helpful. And even if you don't believe that Jesus Christ was a real historical person (as some people don't), would you still be able to offer a comment based on viewing Jesus as a literary character, even if you believe the literature is mythological in nature. What is the message for the reader, for human society, for humanity?

From Matthew chapter 27:45-47 NASB.

45 Now from the sixth hour darkness fell upon all the land until the ninth hour. 46 About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "ELI, ELI, LAMA SABACHTHANI?" that is, "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME?" 47 And some of those who were standing there, when they heard it, began saying, "This man is calling for Elijah." (Cf. Mark 15:33-35)

What are the implications in the death of "God" as a Human Being. What is the intended moral to the story. From a psychological POV, what is the commentary it's making on Humanity and the Human experience, and the Human psyche. What might the darkness represent?

What is the underlying message about Humanity and Divinity? About Human self-discovery? And about reckoning with one's Reality? What might the message be to the reader?

And in the broader narrative -- taking all four canonical gospels as a whole -- who or what is the "(Heavenly) Father" to whom Jesus yields his spirit in the end? (See Luke 23:44-46. Note that Luke mentions the darkness, but not Jesus' cry of feeling forsaken.) How does Jesus differentiate and/or reconcile the "God" by whom he feels forsaken, and the "Father" in whom Jesus trusts in the end?

What experience has Jesus processed between those two moments? What do his two statements, one of feeling betrayed and then one of trusting, reveal about Jesus' experience and his psyche? How do you view the conclusion of Jesus' death, and what are the implications in your conclusion, concerning Jesus' psychological state?

Thank you.

 

[BilliardsBall]

I'm curious to know other people's perspectives on what is happening to the character of Jesus in the following passage. I'm familiar with various theological views. So, if you could also offer a psychological or a sociological view, that would be helpful. And even if you don't believe that Jesus Christ was a real historical person (as some people don't), would you still be able to offer a comment based on viewing Jesus as a literary character, even if you believe the literature is mythological in nature. What is the message for the reader, for human society, for humanity?

From Matthew chapter 27:45-47 NASB.

45 Now from the sixth hour darkness fell upon all the land until the ninth hour. 46 About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "ELI, ELI, LAMA SABACHTHANI?" that is, "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME?" 47 And some of those who were standing there, when they heard it, began saying, "This man is calling for Elijah." (Cf. Mark 15:33-35)

What are the implications in the death of "God" as a Human Being. What is the intended moral to the story. From a psychological POV, what is the commentary it's making on Humanity and the Human experience, and the Human psyche. What might the darkness represent?

What is the underlying message about Humanity and Divinity? About Human self-discovery? And about reckoning with one's Reality? What might the message be to the reader?

And in the broader narrative -- taking all four canonical gospels as a whole -- who or what is the "(Heavenly) Father" to whom Jesus yields his spirit in the end? (See Luke 23:44-46. Note that Luke mentions the darkness, but not Jesus' cry of feeling forsaken.) How does Jesus differentiate and/or reconcile the "God" by whom he feels forsaken, and the "Father" in whom Jesus trusts in the end?

What experience has Jesus processed between those two moments? What do his two statements, one of feeling betrayed and then one of trusting, reveal about Jesus' experience and his psyche? How do you view the conclusion of Jesus' death, and what are the implications in your conclusion, concerning Jesus' psychological state?

Thank you.

Jesus was fulfilling prophecy? What did the Father forsake Him? For our sake.

Death is separation, and the very godhead was willing to be rent in separation for our sake, a tearing--like at the same moment when the holy veil tore in two in the Temple.

Anyone who trusts in what Jesus Christ did on His cross and His resurrection will receive eternal life!

 

[atpollard]

I'm curious to know other people's perspectives on what is happening to the character of Jesus in the following passage. I'm familiar with various theological views. So, if you could also offer a psychological or a sociological view, that would be helpful. And even if you don't believe that Jesus Christ was a real historical person (as some people don't), would you still be able to offer a comment based on viewing Jesus as a literary character, even if you believe the literature is mythological in nature. What is the message for the reader, for human society, for humanity?

From Matthew chapter 27:45-47 NASB.
45 Now from the sixth hour darkness fell upon all the land until the ninth hour. 46 About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "ELI, ELI, LAMA SABACHTHANI?" that is, "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME?" 47 And some of those who were standing there, when they heard it, began saying, "This man is calling for Elijah." (Cf. Mark 15:33-35)

What is happening: Jesus is suffering.
Sociologically, he is facing this alone. Everyone who has ever lived can probably relate to there having been moments in life when you had to go through SOMETHING. The nature of that something and 'going through' meant that whether anyone was standing next to you or not was utterly irrelevant. Some things are suffered alone (even in a crowd). Although in his case, he was largely alone socially as well. Made a cultural anathema ... for our good and God's glory.

Psychologically, he is probably experiencing the emotional pain of damnation. Separation from God. If "he who knew no sin, became sin", then this was Jesus experiencing the despair of the fundamental human condition. The darkness that drives men to drugs and drink for a brief respite, or suicide in hope of a more permanent solution. This was the the sinless man's moment to experience the worst that life had to offer.

What are the implications in the death of "God" as a Human Being. What is the intended moral to the story. From a psychological POV, what is the commentary it's making on Humanity and the Human experience, and the Human psyche. What might the darkness represent?

What is the underlying message about Humanity and Divinity? About Human self-discovery? And about reckoning with one's Reality? What might the message be to the reader?

Most of the meat is theological, which you claim to be familiar with. So focusing on the psycho-social fluff ... The "implications in the death of 'God' as a Human Being" is that we can approach God. Not theological justification (which is also true), but as a being who is able to understand and relate. We can go to God and say, "I hurt. Deep down where nobody can see. My soul aches." and God can honestly reply "I know exactly what you mean. I've been there and felt that." So we can fall into his arms (metaphorically) and trust him enough to allow him to love and comfort us. It is not so much about the human psyche, as a revelation about the divine psyche. An assurance that the 'Other' is not 'too other' to relate to.

And in the broader narrative -- taking all four canonical gospels as a whole -- who or what is the "(Heavenly) Father" to whom Jesus yields his spirit in the end? (See Luke 23:44-46. Note that Luke mentions the darkness, but not Jesus' cry of feeling forsaken.) How does Jesus differentiate and/or reconcile the "God" by whom he feels forsaken, and the "Father" in whom Jesus trusts in the end?

What experience has Jesus processed between those two moments? What do his two statements, one of feeling betrayed and then one of trusting, reveal about Jesus' experience and his psyche? How do you view the conclusion of Jesus' death, and what are the implications in your conclusion, concerning Jesus' psychological state?

Thank you.

Who or what is the "(Heavenly) Father": Exactly what he claims to be ... God (the 'Father' of the revealed Triune Being). The physical nature of God is a metaphysical question rather than psychological one, so I assume this answer is enough.
I suspect that Jesus was quoting scripture and already knew that there was a difference between feeling forsaken for a season (finite period of time) and being eternally forsaken are not the same thing. The crisis (needing reconciliation) is a literary illusion of your manufacture. God asks us to endure hard things that ultimately support God's purpose. That is both a theological truth in scripture (like the story of Joseph) and an experiential truth borne out in human existence.

Feeling betrayed, trusting God in spite of those feelings, and having your faith vindicated are part of life. I have been there and done that. I knoe lots of other people who have been there and done that. I find it comforting to know that Jesus can relate.
Cheers and good luck searching for, whatever it is you are searching for.

 

[Katja]

I've never understood, from childhood, why Jesus felt forsaken.

He knew this would happen. Before anyone else did. He knew what and, presumably, why, and even that he would be resurrected. So why did he feel like God abandoned him simply because what he knew would come to pass, came to pass?

Yes, we know that he prayed in Gethsemane for it not to happen-- I paraphrase-- "let this cup pass from me, yet not what I will, but what you will." A very human response, which is maybe the reason for this cry as well. Yet it did happen, and again, he knew that it would. Throughout all of what happened to him from his arrest, no words of God forsaking him... until the end. Did he believe that God would come at the last minute and stop it all, and that didn't happen? Or was it just a culmination of everything that happened, that he finally cried out? Was it that sense of disbelief you get about bad things that are happening to you even as they're happening, and it just hit him at that moment? Was he led to believe that it wouldn't be as awful as it was?

And why would he say something like that, out loud? Surely it must have made people question his divinity-- "see, even he admits God is not with him."

 

[Good-Ole-Rebel]

I've never understood, from childhood, why Jesus felt forsaken.

He knew this would happen. Before anyone else did. He knew what and, presumably, why, and even that he would be resurrected. So why did he feel like God abandoned him simply because what he knew would come to pass, came to pass?

Yes, we know that he prayed in Gethsemane for it not to happen-- I paraphrase-- "let this cup pass from me, yet not what I will, but what you will." A very human response, which is maybe the reason for this cry as well. Yet it did happen, and again, he knew that it would. Throughout all of what happened to him from his arrest, no words of God forsaking him... until the end. Did he believe that God would come at the last minute and stop it all, and that didn't happen? Or was it just a culmination of everything that happened, that he finally cried out? Was it that sense of disbelief you get about bad things that are happening to you even as they're happening, and it just hit him at that moment? Was he led to believe that it wouldn't be as awful as it was?

And why would he say something like that, out loud? Surely it must have made people question his divinity-- "see, even he admits God is not with him."

He said it out loud because He was in grievous pain and the weight of the sin of the whole world was upon Him. What He was experiencing is unknowable to us. It was unknowable to Him until He experienced it, as Father,Son, and Holy Spirit were always a unity of One.

The Father did forsake Him as the sins were upon Him. That separation, unknown in eternity, must have been horrible to Him Who was so eternally close to the Father. Yes, He as God the Son knew it would be horrible, but He now was experiencing it.

When it was over, that relationship was restored just before He gave up the Ghost. (Luke 23:46) But there was now eternally a difference. God the Son would always have a body as a Man. He now knows the Father as both God and Father. And we now know God as both God and Father. (John 20:17)

I would like to add, though it is seldom considered, the grief of God the Father. It had to have been tremendous. Especially since all was His plan. How difficult to walk away at the cries of His Son.

Good-Ole-Rebel