Jesus as the son of God

[lovelylife22]

Can you clarify the Orthodox position that the Holy Spirit preceeds from the father but not the son. Does Christ still intercede for us humans? If so, How does Christ intercede for us, if not from the Holy Spirit? This is a question that I struggle with. when I read that the Holy Spirit does not precede from the father and son and I immediately believed that Jesus Christ was not the son of God anymore.I want the truth and I want to believe he is the Son of God. I know that Satan LIED to me. Please pray that God will help me through this.

 

[we-live-now]

Can you clarify the Orthodox position that the Holy Spirit preceeds from the father but not the son. Does Christ still intercede for us humans? If so, How does Christ intercede for us, if not from the Holy Spirit? This is a question that I struggle with. when I read that the Holy Spirit does not precede from the father and son and I immediately believed that Jesus Christ was not the son of God anymore.I want the truth and I want to believe he is the Son of God. I know that Satan LIED to me. Please pray that God will help me through this.

Hi.

I am not sure of the essence of your question, but have you studied John 14-16 lately?

He tells us in John 14 about a specific spirit called the "Spirit of truth" that is "with us" but will be in us forever. Ponder these verses. They are amazing.

Do you see where the spirit of truth is right now and forever?

I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; 17 that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you John 14:16-17

Now look at the words in John 15. They are a little different.

“When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me, 27 and you will testify also, because you have been with Me from the beginning John 15:26-27

Friend. Look at where Jesus says "The Spirit of truth" is located in John 15:26. Now, look at where he says this very same Spirit of truth is in John 14:17. Also, pay attention to who he says will send the Helper. In John 14:16 it is the father. In John 15:26 it is "I". Could this be the father himself speaking in and through Jesus in John 15:26? This also occurs in John 16:7.

But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you John 16:7

We must never forget that Jesus and the father are one. John 10:30.

Then, look at the bombshell he drops at the end of John 15:27. Where does he say his disciples have been since the very beginning? This is all his disciples as his words are eternal, are they not?

Now look at this set of verses:

If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. 23 He who hates Me hates My Father also. 24 If I had not done among them the works which no one else did, they would not have sin; but now they have both seen and hated Me and My Father as well John 15:22-24

Which Spirit of God is tasked with "convicting the world of sin, righteousness and judgment"?

See John 16:8.

And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment John 16:8.

Could "he", "the Helper" have been the very one talking in John 15:22? The point I am trying to make is there is NO separation in the Spirit of God in the person of Jesus. I will share with you in a little bit about what scripture says exactly WHO is "in Christ".

But first, want to see something else amazing?

Compare the actual names of the spirits in these three verses:

After being baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove and lighting on Him Matt 3:16

and the Holy Spirit descended upon Him in bodily form like a dove, and a voice came out of heaven, “You are My beloved Son, in You I am well-pleased.” Luke 3:22

Immediately coming up out of the water, He saw the heavens opening, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon Him Mark 1:10

Do you see the differences? Jesus is one AMAZINGLY BIG and awesome spiritual man.

Just how big is he and exactly who is "in him"?

Ponder this...

So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit 1 Cor 15:45

Who is the "LAST Adam"? It's Jesus is it not?

He is the last Adam and he fully replaced the entire body of the first Adam. So, who was "in" the first Adam? So, who is "in" the "last Adam"?

Friend, you have nothing to fear. God has you totally covered!

God bless,

 

[Shiranui117]

Can you clarify the Orthodox position that the Holy Spirit preceeds from the father but not the son.

Certainly! Did you know that the original text of the Nicene Creed says that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, and did not say that He proceeds from the Father and the Son?

When we discuss the Holy Spirit proceeding from the Father, the actual Greek verb refers to coming from the place from which you originate. So when we Orthodox say that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, we say that the Holy Spirit has His origin solely in the Father. This is because the Father is the source (Greek: arche) of the Trinity. The Son is begotten of the Father, and the Holy Spirit proceeds from Him. If the Holy Spirit were to proceed from both the Father and the Son as the Latins say, then that would make the Holy Spirit lesser than the other two Persons of the Trinity. Rather, the Father is unique in His role as being the Source of the other two Persons, and the Son is unique in being begotten of the Father, and the Holy Spirit is unique in proceeding from the Father. So the Orthodox view emphasizes the balance between the three Persons of the Trinity.

That being said, while the Holy Spirit does not proceed from (i.e. originate in) the Son, Jesus can and does send the Holy Spirit; remember in John 20:22-23 when Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit on the Apostles, and promised that He Himself would send the Holy Spirit in John 14:16-26? So therefore, the Holy Spirit is sent by Jesus, and Jesus is in turn sent by the Holy Spirit. Do you remember the Annunciation in Luke 1:30-35, when Gabriel told Mary that the Holy Spirit would come upon her, and she would conceive Jesus in her womb? Also, at every Orthodox Divine Liturgy, we pray that the Holy Spirit change the bread and wine into the true Body and Blood of Christ.

Does Christ still intercede for us humans?

Absolutely! He prays for us to His Father, just as He did in John 17. And He also bestows grace from the Father upon us.

If so, How does Christ intercede for us, if not from the Holy Spirit?

When Jesus gives us grace, He often does so through the Holy Spirit. In baptism, for example, we baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. We baptize with the authority that Jesus gave us. When we receive the Eucharist, which is the true Body and Blood of our Lord and God and Savior Jesus Christ, Jesus gives us Himself to sanctify and purify us. Jesus' entire life was an intercession for us--uniting our humanity to His Divinity, dying to destroy death's power over us, rising from the dead to give us new life, entering Paradise so that it might be reopened for us, and overcoming all temptation and sin to free our human nature from slavery to sin.

Overall, when it comes to grace, one could say all three Persons of the Trinity are involved; grace flows from the Father, through the Son, and is given to us in the Holy Spirit.

This is a question that I struggle with. when I read that the Holy Spirit does not precede from the father and son and I immediately believed that Jesus Christ was not the son of God anymore.I want the truth and I want to believe he is the Son of God. I know that Satan LIED to me. Please pray that God will help me through this.

Let not your heart be troubled! Just because the Holy Spirit doesn't originate in the Son doesn't mean that Jesus isn't the Son of God. Jesus is the Son of God because He is begotten of the Father, not because the Holy Spirit originates in Him.

Remember, Jesus is still the Creator of all creation (John 1:3). Jesus was in the beginning with the Father (John 1:2). Jesus is Himself God, just as the Father is God (John 1:1). He is the Way, the Truth and the Life (John 14:6). We see confessions of Jesus being the Son of God all over the New Testament--from two Roman centurions, from St. Peter, from St. Paul, from the Ethiopian eunuch, and countless other people throughout history.