Jesus 100% man?

[BobbyisStrange]

We're really talking about two different Jesuses here: The historic Jesus and the mythic Jesus. I use the mythic Jesus a lot in the formulation of metaphor. But I also fully understand the historic Jesus. Historically speaking, Jesus was probably born from human parents.

So he wasn't divine?

 

[Oryonder]

Correction- what I said is what most of the Christians I have met personally believe. I know all about Constantine- my mom is convinced he edited scripture to fit his agenda (Don't know if there is any evidence of that, I never heard anyone else say that, my mom got a degree in Anthropology).
And you're right, Jesus wasn't the same as the Father while He was walking around- if He was He would not have called Him Father.

You can find the role of Constantine at the council of Nicea as recorded by Eusebius on the net.

Eusebius was the one that Constantine had create the first Bibles. Eusebius disagreed with the inclusion of homoousios and Constantine exiled him for this.

You can find where Constantine says to Eusebius .. "if you would only accept homoousios"

After exile Eusebius finally agree's to sign the document.

I completely agree with your comments in relation to how Jesus viewed things. Jesus always refer's to the father as someone other than himself.

Even Bible dictionaries state that Jesus never directly claimed to be The Father.

It makes no sense that Jesus would call out to himself while on the cross .. "Father why have you forsaken me"

It makes no sense that the Roman Justice system would find no fault in Jesus unless he denied being God. 100% they would have asked him to clarify his position while under interrogation. It was a capital offense to make such a claim in Roman times as you would be usurping Ceasar.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

So he wasn't divine?

He would still be divine because according to my religion the Fullness of the Pleroma dwelled fully within him. He would be divine because within him was knowledge of the Godhead. He contained within himself the information or data of Divinity. In other words his 0's and 1's (the binary data) made him God and his x's and y's (DNA) made him human.

 

[BobbyisStrange]

He would still be divine because according to my religion the Fullness of the Pleroma dwelled fully within him. He would be divine because within him was knowledge of the Godhead. He contained within himself the information or data of Divinity. In other words his 0's and 1's (the binary data) made him God and his x's and y's (DNA) made him human.

So you no longer hold the position that it was a miracle birth and that parthenogenesis had no play in it...you now accept he had a biological father? Also how can he be human and divine and the two not dilute (your words) each other while in human form? The fact he was doing miracles in human form through divine powers does just that, dilute the two figures.

You have confused me a little, forgive me, a few pages back you say it's a mystery and or it's a miracle and now you act as if you have the answer...I'm sorry but it can't be both...it can't be mysterious but here's the answer.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

So you no longer hold the position that it was a miracle birth and that parthenogenesis had no play in it...you now accept he had a biological father? Also how can he be human and divine and the two not dilute (your words) each other while in human form? The fact he was doing miracles in human form through divine powers does just that, dilute the two figures.

You have confused me a little, forgive me, a few pages back you say it's a mystery and or it's a miracle and now you act as if you have the answer...I'm sorry but it can't be both...it can't be mysterious but here's the answer.

Who know what happened, we weren't there were we?! But whether or not it was a natural birth or a miraculous virgin birth; Jesus had within himself the Fulness of the Godhead, his 0's and 1's were God's 0's and 1's and his x's and y's were fully human.

 

[BobbyisStrange]

When I make comments like that, I am mostly speaking generally- not to one person but to a general audience. I should have said I was speaking generally and not personally. I can be pretty vague at times- much to a lot of people's chagrin.

No harm done...I'm not here to make enemies or start fights...I'm hear because of the opposite actually, I'd like to establish some friendships and learn a thing or two...I'm here out of love of the topic...just because I don't believe doesn't mean I hate religion...in fact it is just the opposite.

 

[BobbyisStrange]

Who know what happened, we weren't there were we?! But whether or not it was a natural birth or a miraculous virgin birth; Jesus had within himself the Fulness of the Godhead, his 0's and 1's were God's 0's and 1's and his x's and y's were fully human.

What I'm saying is, without a biological father he couldn't have had X and y without a human father...if he didn't have a human father, he wasn't fully human.

 

[Me Myself]

I'll give you that…it is exactly how I read it…though that isn’t how its taught...The fact that Jesus could walk on water would show he was more than a man...we could go on and on, there are many examples that contradict Cynthia's premise.

Look at it in this way:

a 4 certainly contains a 1.

The 1 in the four is 100% a 1, and the 4 doesn´t stop being a four just because it is made of 1´s .

Infinite contains finite. Finite is included in infinite. Thus, man and God not need be contradictions at all.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Look at it in this way:

a 4 certainly contains a 1.

The 1 in the four is 100% a 1, and the 4 doesn´t stop being a four just because it is made of 1´s .

Infinite contains finite. Finite is included in infinite. Thus, man and God not need be contradictions at all.

Fruballs for you. That's a great way to put it.

 

[BobbyisStrange]

Look at it in this way:

a 4 certainly contains a 1.

The 1 in the four is 100% a 1, and the 4 doesn´t stop being a four just because it is made of 1´s .

Infinite contains finite. Finite is included in infinite. Thus, man and God not need be contradictions at all.

I'm not so sure that logic is sound...because independently the 1's are only 1's not 4's...it's almost like saying I'm made up of nothing but particles and if you break me down to particle form I'm no different than the particles found in a desk...therefore we're no different than a desk...I find this argument absurd...I could be wrong though.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I'm not so sure that logic is sound...because independently the 1's are only 1's not 4's...it's almost like saying I'm made up of nothing but particles and if you break me down to particle form I'm no different than the particles found in a desk...therefore we're no different than a desk...I find this argument absurd...I could be wrong though.

You almost made it to Gnosticism. Is there any real difference between the particles of that desk and your particles?

 

[Me Myself]

I´ll wait for you to organize your thoughts a bit, you still sound unsure if you understood and I think you almost got it

 

[Me Myself]

What you need to answer to understand your own view in this is:

What makes a man a man?

and

What makes God God?

How are these different?

 

[CynthiaCypher]

What you need to answer to understand your own view in this is:

What makes a man a man?

and

What makes God God?

How are these different?

Two different types of information maybe?

 

[idav]

I know a lot of Christians accept that Jesus was 100% man and 100% God...But doesn’t the very fact that in the story, Jesus being born of a virgin (not to mention his many miracles), negate the idea that he was 100% man? I mean, why don’t Christians just call him a demigod since he fits all the criteria? I know other religious sects consider him to be just that...it is obvious that the Bible's portrayal of Jesus, though made flesh and blood, is much more than a man. So by 100% man are we just saying made of flesh and blood?

If jesus was conceived by some alien entity then he wouldn't be 100% man but some sort of ultra hybrid. As for the God thing, nothing is 100% god except god. Even if Jesus has god DNA it doesn't really make him part god because Jesus simply isn't the source, jesus is a spawn.

 

[Rocky S]

He has two natures. None of those natures is diluted or lessened by the other but exist in a hypostatic union, I hope this clears it up.

Thats good, that is the theological term for it. I was going to say the same thing, but you beat me to it.

 

[Bob Dixon]

you almost made it to gnosticism. Is there any real difference between the particles of that desk and your particles?

goddam i love monism

 

[Me Myself]

goddam i love monism

 

[Rocky S]

Answer me this...In order to be man or human we have to have both a mother and a father..correct? Jesus didnt have this...he was born through immaculate conception...this alone would mean he cant be 100% man...unless we just mean flesh and blood.

Hi BobbyisStrange immaculate conception is not the proper term, that is what Catholics refer to Marry as being born sinless. actually Mary was conceived by the Holy spirit,which the term is The virgin birth, Christ gets his humanity from Marie. Now fundamentally Christians doctrine teaches Jesus existed before he became flesh as the2nd person of the Trinity. Christian doctrine is this: Jesus is not a creative being not an angel, but eternally existed in eternity past like the Father and the Holy spirit. The 2nd person of the Trinity we came to know as Jesus is not a created being like some teach. Like one user said the hypo-static union of Christ is just that. And that is were he gets his divinity from.

 

[outhouse]

And that is were he gets his divinity from.

false

his divinity was defined by Constantines influence, nothing more.

If a few more bishops had been present that thought the opposite, Constantine would have ruled not the same substance as he father.


all Constantine wanted was a unified church, and thats why he ordered bishops to vote for unification or banishment.