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Featured Islamic Jihad

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Nakosis, Apr 12, 2019.

  1. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Christians in the eleventh century were not paranoid fanatics. Muslims really were gunning for them. While Muslims can be peaceful, Islam was born in war and grew the same way. From the time of Mohammed, the means of Muslim expansion was always the sword. Muslim thought divides the world into two spheres, the Abode of Islam and the Abode of War.... In the eleventh century, the Seljuk Turks conquered Asia Minor (modern Turkey), which had been Christian since the time of St. Paul. The old Roman Empire, known to modern historians as the Byzantine Empire, was reduced to little more than Greece. In desperation, the emperor in Constantinople sent word to the Christians of western [sic] Europe asking them to aid their brothers and sisters in the East.

    [The Crusades] were not the brainchild of an ambitious pope or rapacious knights but a response to more than four centuries of conquests in which Muslims had already captured two-thirds of the old Christian world. At some point, Christianity as a faith and a culture had to defend itself or be subsumed by Islam. The Crusades were that defense.
    The Crusades: When Christendom Pushed Back


    So, if not for the Islamic jihad, Islamic imperialism would there have been a Crusade?

    There was atrocities committed by both sides. War is war and it is far from humane. I'm not in defense of Christianity or saying the Christians were on the right side of this war, more to point out our history is one of religious war. It doesn't matter what the scripture say. What matters is that religion has provided man with the motivation to expand their control of others, in the "name of God".

    I'm also not saying this is the Christianity or Islam of today, however I am saying it is a good thing it is not.
     
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  2. Godobeyer

    Godobeyer the word "Islam" means "submission" to God
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    Jihad in Islam means defend.
    end of question :)

    In media, that's other issue, it's means evangelization by force.
     
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  3. ManSinha

    ManSinha Active Member

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    I doubt you have the meaning right - it means "struggle" - for the most part it is internal against the temptations of society but it also has a connotation to defend the faith against external aggressors. I do not believe "defend" comes into it at all
     
  4. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Ok, if not jihad, what better word for the Holy Wars waged by early Islam? Some call it the Islamic crusades.
     
  5. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    I was "Christian" for three decades and in retrospect they were never peaceful. The record is rife with examples of those who used Christianity as an excuse to invade and conquer. Sure there was the Islamic conquest, but then is the invasion of North and South America and what they did any less of an vicious aggression? As far as I know, only Canada has apologized for what they did to the Dine there. When I was young, and told to not reveal my background, we were told that the Native peoples of North America did not please God, so he sent the Europeans to invade, and all those deaths of the Native people were justified as the "Will of God".

    There are many sad stories among them the stories of the Navajo, and the Nez Perce, and the Warm Springs. Here in Oregon, the Native American was given a generous reservation until Gold was discovered, and then the White Eyes came and took most of that land.

    Even today in parts of Central and South America the Native People are second class citizens to the Spaniards, as I learned in Honduras when I was there.

    So, I am not very open to depicting Islam as the scourge of the world ... it is a lie.
     
  6. Notanumber

    Notanumber A Free Man

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    I am glad that I do not have a religion that I feel I need to defend.
     
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  7. sun rise

    sun rise "Let there be peace and love among all"
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    It's human nature to think that my beliefs, my religion, is correct and if you don't agree with me, there's something wrong with you. Take this two steps further and we have war.
     
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  8. Augustus

    Augustus the Unreasonable

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    If it hadn't been for Islamic imperialism, there wouldn't have been anywhere for the crusade to go to.

    One of the causes was the Byzantine Emperor Alexios requesting help. They had actually been recruiting European knights for decades before this to help fight Muslim invaders.

    Interestingly, the Seljuks seem to have been either Christian or Jewish until they quickly conquered significant amounts of Muslim territory not too long before this.
     
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  9. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    The Seven Swords of Jihad
    It is crucial for analysts and strategic planners to fully understand this mutation and evolution of the concept of jihad over time. It is incorrect to see jihad solely as a religious concept referring to the striving of the individual to be pure, because jihad of the sword is referenced in the hadith in multiple instances. It is clear that the meaning of violent jihad has been shaped during the centuries to fit the needs of those espousing holy war and calling their co-religionists to the battlefield. Usama bin Ladin’s great historical significance is that he managed to turn jihad from referring to guerrilla resistance against military oppression of the 1980s to mean the killing of mass numbers of civilians on the soil of non-Muslim lands. Understanding this contextual evolution is critical in the effort to find strategies to weaken al-Qa`ida’s ideology.
    https://ctc.usma.edu/understanding-historys-seven-stages-of-jihad/

    Jihad of the Sword

    In a tract "On Jihad", founder Hasan al-Banna warned readers against "the widespread belief among many Muslims" that struggles of the heart were more demanding than struggles with a sword, and called on Egyptians to prepare for jihad against the British,[89] (making him the first influential scholar since the 1857 India uprising to call for jihad of the sword)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jihad

    Jihad of the heart, Jihad of the tongue, Jihad of the pen, Jihad of the sword.
     
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  10. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    The simple definition is this, but it is interpreted differently based on context in text and history. The understanding of Jihad is not consistent in history.

    . . . which in reality is often how it is interpreted in the real world by Muslims.
     
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  11. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Religious violence, crusades, jihad, holy wars, territorial expansion, none of it deserves respect. Not what the Christians did, not what the Muslims did. A person wants to pursue either spiritually, fine. Just don't pretend the past didn't happen. A religion, any religion that becomes a catalyst for violence, well judge it by it's fruits I suppose.
     
  12. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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    Yes as crusades were not merely against the "infidel" but heretics as well. The Cathar Wars for example. The fallout of the Great Schism could easily have seen a Crusader war due to the conflict between the Western and Eastern Churches. Also keep in mind rhe 4th Crusade was used by Venice to attack a trade rival, Constantinople. The 4th was the nail in the coffin between the Western and Eastern Churches yet never got to it's claimed Holy Land targets.Few called foul over it.

    Crusades were not merely religious tools but political as well. Also there were the Eastern Europe Crusades against Pagans long before Islam become a major factor such as the Tatars or Mongols.
     
  13. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Life is a confusing mix for me, but I try to adhere to the words of Jesus the Christ. In four short "books" he lays out a narrow path to please God, or Allah SWT as you please. It is why I have decided to be an Abrahamic Religionist. And, I think that to the Creator there is only the intention (Islamic) to please him in all my ways. For me, no system means anything worth remembering if we can not clean the cultural dogma out of our lives.

    Islamic history is confusing for me because I believe that shortly after the death of Muhammad PBUH, true Islam died and it became a collection of the warlords. I think that Christianity did similar as I mentioned before. What I said was a recent revelation that came from my research into the Natives of North and South America, and their fates at the hands of the Europeans and particularly the Spanish in Central and South America.

    Peace

    Haseya :)
     
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  14. ManSinha

    ManSinha Active Member

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    I am nowhere as well versed in this as perhaps @The_Fisher_King or @Niblo but per my understanding there are many hadiths - not all of which are held to the same level of accuracy and influence. There is the collection of Sahih Hadith - sahih also meaning a Urdu or Hindi word for right or correct - which are regarded as very influential and then there are others that are regarded as later additions made to suit the author and the times prevailing and perhaps less influential and worthy of being adhered to
     
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  15. icehorse

    icehorse Well-Known Member
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    IMO both Christianity and Islam have a lot of blood on their hands. I'd say we should phase them both out, more trouble than they're worth.
     
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  16. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    Most religious conflicts and wars throughout world history stems from Abrahamic religion almost exclusively.

    There's no question Abrahamics overall revolve around submission and subjection to doctrine. Things that fit well whenever describing cults for which the violence is not out of the question.

    There's no doubt Islamic sects leads the charge in violent behavior followed close by Christians with Judaism trailing last as it stands today.
     
  17. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Don't forget the Pagans, and also the Mongolians, the Persians, the Africans, the Chinese, the Japanese, North and South American Native tribes wait it's almost like all humans have blood on their hands if your honest about it. But hey let's cherry pick based on bias cause that makes us better than everyone else!
     
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  18. icehorse

    icehorse Well-Known Member
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    And I would say that if you're a secular humanist, you have the good fortune to be born after a lot of people did a lot of bad stuff and some of them learned better.

    But hey, you can be a relativist, because then you don't have to do anything.
     
  19. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Haha

    "All you are guilty of stuff people did 1,000s of years ago!"

    "But not me cause my group didn't exist then."

    :rolleyes:
     
  20. icehorse

    icehorse Well-Known Member
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    I don't care so much about what folks did years ago - I care mostly about what people do these days. And Christians and Muslims do a lot of things in the name of their religions, that we'd be better off if they stopped doing.
     
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