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Is witchcraft real?

InvestigateTruth

Well-Known Member
As per your religious beliefs, do you believe witchcraft is real? Like, magic, is it real? Christians, I’m curious. Do you believe people can access mystic power? Think back to Moses, when he turned his staff to a snake. The Pharaoh’s court mages did the same with their staffs. My pastor of my youth told me that the mages had snakes hidden up their sleeves lol but the Bible says that the mages turned their staffs into snakes. Sorcery, right?
I already practice divination, I’m interested in the occult.
Pagans, I think you guys believe in it, right? Or am I thinking of another group?
Atheists, I suppose you think that any magical experiences are imagined, right?
I believe mostly is unreal. But for example some psychics can foretell your future. In human there could be some supernatural powers. Even the Bible says, false prophets can foretell.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
I suppose I am one of these folks, understanding magic and divination from psychological perspectives. But I also see it from a creative, artistic perspective as well. For instance, flipping a coin may be helpful with a tricky decision, but there's a flair and poetry to using Tarot instead. Plus, it tends to add a level of insight into the situation that I find useful.

Another example: I have a protection ritual I do to my house before I leave for protecting my animals, my property, and for a safe return for me. A key part of the ritual involves focusing on the aspects of these things that are important to me, for instance, why I love my cats. This ritual has the effect of slowing my thinking down before my long commute to work and calms me down as I focus my thinking on positive things.

Could I do this without performing a magical ritual? Sure. But I could also drive to work without music or have blank wallpaper on my phone rather than fantasy artwork.

These are fair counter-examples which I find no issue with. Thank you for the perspective.
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
These are fair counter-examples which I find no issue with. Thank you for the perspective.

Of course! :)

For me, it's kind of like reading fiction when I could be reading textbooks instead: I may gain more valuable information from the textbooks, but I can insights and enjoyment from fiction that also has its place.
 

mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
These are fair counter-examples which I find no issue with. Thank you for the perspective.

In general terms coping is never just facts, it involves values and those can work differently in individuals. Or if you like, you or I can't do life only on facts.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
Of course! :)

For me, it's kind of like reading fiction when I could be reading textbooks instead: I may gain more valuable information from the textbooks, but I can insights and enjoyment from fiction that also has its place.

I can see how one can find meaning and fulfillment in such practices.

I have known a few people encouraged by their therapists to express themselves through their art or to take a break from their stressful lives to enjoy a story or movie they're interested in. Upon reflection, what you are describing here does not sound extraordinarily dissimilar and might even be beneficial to your mental health.

I apologize for my ignorance on the topic. I will keep this in mind going forward.
 

VoidCat

Pronouns: he/him/they/them
I have known a few people encouraged by their therapists to express themselves through their art or to take a break from their stressful lives to enjoy a story or movie they're interested in. Upon reflection, what you are describing here does not sound extraordinarily dissimilar and might even be beneficial to your mental health
Interestingly spellwork is not always different from affirmations. My therapist suggests I do an affirmation daily. Seeing as the way a spell is worded is the same way as an affirmation I just do it as a form of spellwork.
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
I can see how one can find meaning and fulfillment in such practices.

I have known a few people encouraged by their therapists to express themselves through their art or to take a break from their stressful lives to enjoy a story or movie they're interested in. Upon reflection, what you are describing here does not sound extraordinarily dissimilar and might even be beneficial to your mental health.

I apologize for my ignorance on the topic. I will keep this in mind going forward.

No need to apologize! This is one of the things I love about RF: learning through discussion and debate. I am only a little disappointed we didn't debate. ;-)

I tend towards skepticism myself. Part of my own spiritual process is rationally justifying my beliefs through logic or known science. But I am also a very creative person and a romantic at heart.
 

mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
Interestingly spellwork is not different from affirmations. My therapist suggests I do an affirmation daily. Seeing as the way a spell is worded is the same way as an affirmation I just do it as a form of spellwork.

As I learned affirmations, they for me, involve that I fake them in beginning until they work. "Fake it until you make it"
 

VoidCat

Pronouns: he/him/they/them
As I learned affirmations, they for me, involve that I fake them in beginning until they work. "Fake it until you make it"
I don't know about that in my case. I just been saying them like my therapist told me to. I add tho a visualization and some energy work to make it into a spell as well
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
In general terms coping is never just facts, it involves values and those can work differently in individuals. Or if you like., you or I can't do life only on facts.

Perhaps not.

I can still strive to reduce my emotional expression and rely on as few preferences and opinions as possible, though, but that in itself is a value that exists outside of reason.

It's like the recurring problem in ethics; even if we can prove an ethical system is objective, how do we prove that people should be ethical? What if they just don't want to be? There's no logical reason that they should value ethics, however we define it.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
As per your religious beliefs, do you believe witchcraft is real? Like, magic, is it real? Christians, I’m curious. Do you believe people can access mystic power? Think back to Moses, when he turned his staff to a snake. The Pharaoh’s court mages did the same with their staffs. My pastor of my youth told me that the mages had snakes hidden up their sleeves lol but the Bible says that the mages turned their staffs into snakes. Sorcery, right?
I already practice divination, I’m interested in the occult.
Pagans, I think you guys believe in it, right? Or am I thinking of another group?
Atheists, I suppose you think that any magical experiences are imagined, right?
Well, as an atheist -- since you ask -- yes, I think magical experiences are imagined.

To be honest, I think that anyone who had real magical powers would own the earth and everything and everyone in it. Who would stop him?
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
As per your religious beliefs, do you believe witchcraft is real? Like, magic, is it real? Christians, I’m curious. Do you believe people can access mystic power? Think back to Moses, when he turned his staff to a snake. The Pharaoh’s court mages did the same with their staffs. My pastor of my youth told me that the mages had snakes hidden up their sleeves lol but the Bible says that the mages turned their staffs into snakes. Sorcery, right?
I already practice divination, I’m interested in the occult.
Pagans, I think you guys believe in it, right? Or am I thinking of another group?
Atheists, I suppose you think that any magical experiences are imagined, right?

IMV, yes, witchcraft and divination is real. LOL I'm not sure where your youth pastor got his instruction from but, there were no "up your sleeves" magic going on. It was real and yet demonic. :)

Remembering what happened to Paul where he said:

Acts 16:16 As we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl who had a spirit of divination and brought her owners much gain by fortune-telling. 17 She followed Paul and us, crying out, “These men are servants of the Most High God, who proclaim to you the way of salvation.”18 And this she kept doing for many days. Paul, having become greatly annoyed, turned and said to the spirit, “I command you in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her.” And it came out that very hour.

So, it was very real and they made much money through the divination as a demon spirit helped.

But, according to our faith, it is devilish and not of God so Paul cast it out.

Eventually, as Christians would hold too, you play with fire and you will get burnt. Of course, others would hold a different view.
 
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mikkel_the_dane

My own religion
Perhaps not.

I can still strive to reduce my emotional expression and rely on as few preferences and opinions as possible, though, but that in itself is a value that exists outside of reason.

It's like the recurring problem in ethics; even if we can prove an ethical system is objective, how do we prove that people should be ethical? What if they just don't want to be? There's no logical reason that they should value ethics, however we define it.

I have studied that for many years now and to me being objective is in part a subjective choice in some sense. I.e. I can choose to analyze objectively, but that is still a choice and I have never being able to do evaluation as an objective fact.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
I have studied that for many years now and to me being objective is in part a subjective choice in some sense. I.e. I can choose to analyze objectively, but that is still a choice and I have never being able to do evaluation as an objective fact.

On another forum, I was having a conversation about Sri Ramakrishna, and in that conversation I could almost see how logic is "just another path to God" within the context of his philosophy.

In a sense, my devotion to logic is a spiritual one. I am learning to know God through his Logos as revealed by Nature in Creation.

Of course, I wouldn't use the words "God" or "Creation," but Sri Ramakrishna also says that such words aren't necessarily the important part. I thought it was interesting. It's certainly given me food for thought about how I regard interfaith dialogue and other religions in general.
 

74x12

Well-Known Member
So, what happened to me when I practiced it? I haven't in many years, but I'm curious.
Demons will fight you (mentally) if you ever want to try to repent. By "repent" I mean turn to God.

Helps to rebuke them in Jesus name and then pray. Your prayers will be better.

People still repent of witchcraft all the time; but of course not getting involved in witchcraft makes it easier to repent.
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Well, as an atheist -- since you ask -- yes, I think magical experiences are imagined.

To be honest, I think that anyone who had real magical powers would own the earth and everything and everyone in it. Who would stop him?

How do you know I...er, I mean, someone hasn't already done that clandestinely? ;-)
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Demons will fight you (mentally) if you ever want to try to repent. By "repent" I mean turn to God.

Helps to rebuke them in Jesus name and then pray. Your prayers will be better.

People still repent of witchcraft all the time; but of course not getting involved in witchcraft makes it easier to repent.

I often use Christian symbolism in my magic. Do you suppose I have very confused demons?
 

VoidCat

Pronouns: he/him/they/them
I often use Christian symbolism in my magic. Do you suppose I have very confused demons?
Same.

Poor Lucifer who I worship must've been very confused to see me leave offerings to Jesus and apologize to Jesus's dad
 
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