1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Is there evidence that Humans and bananas share a common ancestor?

Discussion in 'Evolution Vs. Creationism' started by leroy, Feb 24, 2021.

  1. leroy

    leroy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2018
    Messages:
    3,752
    Ratings:
    +314
    Religion:
    christian
    Is there evidence that Humans and bananas share a common ancestor?

    Even though I was a YEC during my late teens and early 20s, I now accept evolution (common ancestry) as an almost certain fact.

    The evidence that we share a common ancestor with Chimps and other primates is strong enough to convince me

    ¿But where is the evidence for universal common ancestor?

    We obviously don’t share orthologs ERVs with bannanas, nor we share orthologs genetic markers, nor we can use any of the “phylogenetic arguments”that work with humans and chimps because bananas are so distantly related that the evidence is not expected to be there

    So where is the evidence?

    Well I personally simply use a philosophical argument to support that claim, namely “Okams Razor” given that we share a common ancestor with chimps it seems parsimonious that we share a common ancestor with other organisms too…………….but I am wondering if apart from this philosophical argument (which is good enough for me) there is some other scientific evidnece that shows that we share a common ancestor with bannanas
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2017
    Messages:
    39,776
    Ratings:
    +23,444
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Yes.

    Mic drop.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  3. Altfish

    Altfish Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2014
    Messages:
    12,184
    Ratings:
    +9,856
    Religion:
    Humanist
    Yes, read Evolution 101
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. SigurdReginson

    SigurdReginson Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    1,462
    Ratings:
    +1,915
    Religion:
    None
    #4 SigurdReginson, Feb 24, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2021
    • Like Like x 2
  5. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2014
    Messages:
    56,954
    Ratings:
    +26,067
    Religion:
    Love
    • Like Like x 2
  6. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    31,495
    Ratings:
    +26,280
    Religion:
    None
    Yes, its called DNA

    And better still we are 35% daffodil, i like daffodils
     
    • Like Like x 6
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  7. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    59,642
    Ratings:
    +17,449
    Religion:
    None (atheist)
    Yes.

    One basic piece of evidence for a common origin for all life on Earth is the chirality of DNA.

    Chemically, DNA's helix can go in either direction. If multiple existing lineages weren't related at all, we would expect to see a mix of chirality. The fact that all life has DNA with the same chirality indicates a common source.
     
    #7 9-10ths_Penguin, Feb 24, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2021
    • Informative Informative x 3
  8. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    31,028
    Ratings:
    +11,820
    Religion:
    liber-scripta grim Christian
    Human cells and banana cells do. I think saying humans and bananas have a common ancestor is technically accurate but confusing. The cells of a human and the cells of a banana appear to have a common ancestor, yes; but the same momma didn't give birth to a banana and a human.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    33,761
    Ratings:
    +14,103
    Religion:
    Philosophical Buddhism
    Thanks to cladistics and the genome, it's now official.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    33,761
    Ratings:
    +14,103
    Religion:
    Philosophical Buddhism
    However a human who is bananas is a different story. *grin*
     
    • Funny Funny x 5
  11. Left Coast

    Left Coast Happy Spring!
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2019
    Messages:
    6,034
    Ratings:
    +8,970
    Religion:
    Secular Buddhist
  12. leroy

    leroy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2018
    Messages:
    3,752
    Ratings:
    +314
    Religion:
    christian
    Yes that is convincing enough....and I see how same design = same designer argument would fail
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    31,028
    Ratings:
    +11,820
    Religion:
    liber-scripta grim Christian
    What really is frightening is that one could splice human DNA to make a very unhappy creature, more unhappy than humans already are. Its becoming easier and easier for anyone to do it. You literally could combine banana and human. They are different enough that the result would not live long, but they are similar enough that it might live too long. I'm not so sure I like that DNA is real.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  14. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    184,156
    Ratings:
    +62,432
    Religion:
    Atheist
    There's residual banana DNA in the human genome.
    Some infants are occasionally born with banana skin,
    from which they emerge.
    [​IMG]
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    33,761
    Ratings:
    +14,103
    Religion:
    Philosophical Buddhism
    Kind of reminds me of The Fly with Jeff Goldblum.
     
  16. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    31,028
    Ratings:
    +11,820
    Religion:
    liber-scripta grim Christian
    I didn't see that but saw Jurassic Park. That film was also about DNA and trying to resurrect dinosaur species from amber fossils. To complete missing stretches of DNA they had their (I assume graduate student) employees patch the DNA with amphibean DNA. This carelessness resulted in a bananza of dangerous, uncontrollable and plot-worthy dinosaurs.
     
  17. Wild Fox

    Wild Fox Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,749
    Ratings:
    +2,324
    Religion:
    nature

    You know the answer is yes if you have been following any of the treads about evolution so why ask. You have participated, You have been already give the evidence.

    Orthologs are genes in different species evolved from a common ancestral gene. Paralogs are gene copies created by a duplication event within the same genome.

    While orthologous genes kept the same function, paralogous genes often develop different functions due to missing selective pressure on one copy of the duplicated gene.

    And yes we do share orthologs with plants. Now if you are specifically talking about retroviral introductions to a genome the that can happen at any time and has nothing to do with primal relatedness. Some humans have the EBV virus genes in them and other don't. Is one humans and the other not?????

    Mitochondrial dna - there is a core set of genes shared by all eukaryotes (plants and animal). Case solved.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
  18. Shaul

    Shaul Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2016
    Messages:
    3,930
    Ratings:
    +1,685
    Religion:
    Judaism
    I’m sure many will find the idea “appealing”.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    9,573
    Ratings:
    +7,430
    Religion:
    Atheist
    DNA

    Tree of life SVG - Phylogenetic tree - Wikipedia
     
  20. Etritonakin

    Etritonakin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2010
    Messages:
    3,257
    Ratings:
    +372
    Technically, all physical life became possible as the elements were formed.
    It is their ability to interact in specific ways which lends itself to their eventually becoming arranged as DNA, self-replication thereof, encoding, etc.

    All life is not likely even descended from one single strand of DNA, but DNA would first develop into quite similar things at first -which became more diverse as they became more complex.

    Even as far as creation of life is concerned, God causing the elements to exist would have been an early stage -part of creating "the heavens". Creating the Earth would be creating a localized, element-rich, active environment conducive to DNA formation, etc.
    They allow for life to then develop/self-assemble and adapt as it will based on circumstance -but that development can also be tweaked at any point by further creative activity.

    If you take the Y from YEC -and realize the events in Genesis describe something that happened after the Earth HAD BECOME waste and ruin to an unspecified degree (check the definitions), there is no conflict with the scientifically-determined age of the Earth, the fossil record, etc.
     
    #20 Etritonakin, Feb 27, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2021
Loading...