The church is founded on whose personal revelation?
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Is "salvation" possible under the Law?
- Thread starter CG Didymus
- Start date
I think when the Bible refers to church it means the gathering of the sheep of The Lord.
Gathering how? It isn't physical. (That is the absolute truth, I am sure
)
It is written that Jesus says to go to him (Matthew 11:28) and that two or more gathered in his name will cause his appearing there. (Matthew 18:20) So the gathering has to be about a meeting of minds. I believe in the resurrection of The Lord which means he is alive and a live human has a mind (or should have one).
To gather to Jesus means to be taught by him. It is too bad people have changed being taught by him with being taught by whoever wrote the Bible.
Gathering how? It isn't physical. (That is the absolute truth, I am sure
)It is written that Jesus says to go to him (Matthew 11:28) and that two or more gathered in his name will cause his appearing there. (Matthew 18:20) So the gathering has to be about a meeting of minds. I believe in the resurrection of The Lord which means he is alive and a live human has a mind (or should have one).
To gather to Jesus means to be taught by him. It is too bad people have changed being taught by him with being taught by whoever wrote the Bible.
roger1440
I do stuff
According to Mathews's Gospel the church IS a personal revelation of God.
13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say the Son of Man is?”
14 They replied, “Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 “But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven. 18 And I tell you that you are Peter,[a] and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. (Matthew 16:13-18)
Good. That the church is a personal revelation of God then might you agree that Hebrews 10:25 is not about a physical gathering of people in a church, or building, or grassy place, or maybe a boat?
roger1440
I do stuff
This verse encourages fellowship. It is a reminder that it is very easy to go astray. The Jewish prophets said this for hundreds of years.
Is it possible it was written to discourage refusing fellowship with certain ones? Is there a difference?
If it means what you say it means then why is it written in the negative?
If it was meant to mean that we are to be encouraged to meet together I think it would say that.
Be gathering together to encourage one another.
But it says be not forsaking gathering together.
People believe that bad associations spoil useful habits. Those people who you deem bad, you should forsake gathering to. Correct?
Isn't it possible that you might judge someone unworthy of the presence of The Lord?
Those people you will forsake. Correct?
Isn't Hebrews 10:25 written to discourage such thinking?
Memos are usually written, so your question confuses me. Have I said something to lead you to believe that Jesus talks to me?
On the other hand, this is the second time you have referred to Jesus as 'dead'. Do you deny the Resurection? If not, then you should recognize that Jesus DIED but is not DEAD. That is sort of the whole point of the Gospels.
If I may offer an explanation of the pun as I perceived it:
Nobody alive today SAW Jesus die, nor can you visit the tomb and see the body for yourself, therefore the only source that we have for information about Jesus death is the written record. The best (most detailed) record of the events is found in the Gospels. Thus the 'memo' about Jesus' death is, in fact, the Gospels.
I was asked "How does anyone know what is said? The guy is dead. Didn't you get the memo?".
The irony and the pun is that the 'memo' that tells us that Jesus is dead (and that he was resurrected) is the exact same 'memo' that tells us what Jesus said. Thus the humor in asking how anyone knows what Jesus said while citing the answer to the question as proof that it is unanswerable.
So Yes I have read the 'memo' (called the Gospels) and THAT is how I know what Jesus said. The same source that tells you he died, tells you what he said. I have more evidence for what he said, then there is evidence that Jesus is dead.
(I found it humorous).
Not as written in context:
Hebrews 10:19 Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh, 21 and having a High Priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, 25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.
The sentence starts in Verse 24 and draws a contrast between what we are called to do (consider one another in order to stir up good works) and what we are called to not do (forsaking the assembling of ourselves together). If we "forsake assembling" then we cannot "stir up".
It is a literal assembly, not a metaphorical one because the call to all of the "one another" tasks of fellowship requires actually meeting with one another. It is only worded in the negative to contrast with the first part of the sentence in verse 24. An example of 'Do This, Not This'.
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
Jesus has been dead for 2000 years. None of the above has no longer any thing to do with him. (Ecclesiastes 9:5,6)
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
The only way to get saved as Jesus himself said, is to listen to "Moses" aka the Law. (Luke 16:29-31. It that's not true, why
is the gospel of Luke still doing in your NT?
psychoslice
Veteran Member
Well of course the whole silly idea is wrong, just as there are many other silly ideas that are wrong.
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
See what I mean? That's why I agree with Jeremiah 7:22 that God had never commanded that sacrifices be part of the religion of Israel. I have always been against sacrifices. If we are to return to the sacrifices with the rebuilding of the Temple, we are better off without it.
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
Including the silly ideas of the atheists.
psychoslice
Veteran Member
Well if you want to go there. your completely wrong, atheist are much more in turn with reality, where as religion is, well just a whole lot of crap !!.
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
"Even one lie!" Now, it is your turn to be dense. I don't believe there is any one who has never lied. "There has never been a person on earth who has said only the truth and never lied." (Ecclesiastes 7:20)
Ben Avraham
Well-Known Member
Okay, so why don't you answer my question about what or who caused the universe to exist? I have asked you this before.
I thought you might not be talking to me anymore.
Paul pictured the ecclesia as a human body. The foot will never, ever meet the eye to be encouraging it.
To be not forsaking the gathering together means (to me) that no matter how very much I would rather like a different foot, I must be content with the foot the Lord sees is fitting to put there if I am big toe, the baby finger or the hair . I shouldn't say this, but maybe I am some of the brain matter. I should be happy to fit in where the Lord puts me and I must be glad for each and every other part of the body. If I do not learn glad contentment with what The Lord God is putting together, that would be me in danger of forsaking the whole thing.
To be encouraging means that I have to peacefully and happily welcome every other single member who comes in. I can not ignore him or her for the reason that I don't believe he or she fits in.
I meant one lie about The Way. If you seem to be an authority to some poor sap and you lie to him about The Way it will be leading him in the wrong direction. If a person goes in the wrong direction in a straight line (the Way is straight) and the journey is long (the journey is long) he will end up in a place where there is no chance of getting back. (according to my understand of The Math)