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Is Jesus one of the four horsemen in Revelation?

Mike214

Member
Certainly Jesus is one of the four riders of Revelation.

"Let us pause now to explain something important that comes to my mind any time I read these scriptures in chapter nineteen of Revelation, especially verse 11: “And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.” Every time I read this scripture describing Jesus riding a white horse, I just want to cry out in frustration, recalling a prominent preacher who lately has been teaching on TV that the rider of the white horse appearing in chapter six of Revelation, and which is the same rider that represents Jesus in chapter nineteen, is the antichrist: “And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him; and he went forth conquering and to conquer” (Rev. 6:2).
I wonder sometimes where is the wisdom of our spiritual leaders. How can they allow this man to teach wrongfully that the rider of the white horse is the antichrist, instead of Jesus? Many will recognize this preacher, but even he, with his questionable interpretations of the scriptures, aids in validating the veracity of our doctrine, since traditional beliefs cannot recognize Jesus as one of the four riders with the Devil, His counterpart, the rider of the red horse: “And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they shall kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword” (Rev. 6:4).
Likewise, traditional doctrines do not accept God as the rider of the black horse, the mediator that keeps the balance between Jesus and the Devil, until everything in His plan is fulfilled, and Jesus sits on God‘s throne forever: “And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, ‘Come and see.’ And I beheld, and lo, a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hands” (v6); “And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say [God’s voice from His throne], A measure of wheat for a penny; and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine” (Rev. 6:5-6). For God, every human being has the same value, regardless of what others think of him, and this is implied when He says that three measures of barley have the same price as a measure of wheat. For Him, all humans are equal despite their contradictions, and no one will be hurt, like the oil and wine in the scripture, which represent antagonism. The oil and the wine will never mix. They stand for opposition, but for God, they are still equal. The fourth rider, on a pale horse, is death, the only way for men to go to Heaven: “And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth” (Rev. 6:8).
Yes, definitely, God and Jesus are two of the

four riders, and this is another astonishing

revelation that God wants us to transmit."

Excerpt from "The Last Prophecy" w..zondervansfall.com
 

Mike214

Member
I would like someone to explain me why many believe that the rider of the white horse is the antichrist instead of Jesus.
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
Because there is no suggestion that it is Jesus. Really, you have the burden of proof to show that Jesus is the rider of the white horse. If you don't form an argument, then there is nothing to really debate.
 

Ninez

Member
Because there is no suggestion that it is Jesus. Really, you have the burden of proof to show that Jesus is the rider of the white horse. If you don't form an argument, then there is nothing to really debate.

Revelations 19:11-13:

"And I saw the heaven opened, and, look! a white horse. And the one seated upon it is called Faithful and True, and he judges and carries on war in righteousness. His eyes are a fiery flame, and upon his head are many diadems. He has a name written that no one knows but he himself, and he is arrayed with an outer garment sprinkled with blood, and the name he is called is The Word of God."

Sounds like no one other that Jesus to me.
 

Beta

Well-Known Member
Certainly Jesus is one of the four riders of Revelation.
chapter nineteen of Revelation, especially verse 11: “And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.”
“And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him; and he went forth conquering and to conquer” (Rev. 6)
If we look at these 2 scriptures more carefully we see that the 2 white horses originate from different sources.
The Rider of Rev.19 comes from heaven with many crowns and a sharp sword and is followed by armies
while Rev.6 comes from the seals/thunders with one crown and a bow - being one of the 4 Riders.He goes out to conquer and is false christianity.
But the Rider of Rev.19 already has his army on white horses and HE IS JESUS CHRIST coming with the resurrected Saints.
The rider of Rev.6 is a FALSE christ - one that we are warned about by Jesus himself Mat.24v4,
So no - Jesus is not one of the 4 !
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
Revelations 19:11-13:

"And I saw the heaven opened, and, look! a white horse. And the one seated upon it is called Faithful and True, and he judges and carries on war in righteousness. His eyes are a fiery flame, and upon his head are many diadems. He has a name written that no one knows but he himself, and he is arrayed with an outer garment sprinkled with blood, and the name he is called is The Word of God."

Sounds like no one other that Jesus to me.
How. Jesus eyes were not fiery flames. And people knew his name. He never carried on war in righteousness.

The author has all the time to state, hey this is Jesus I am talking about, but he doesn't.

The only suggestion is that he is called the Word of God. However, you then have to show that Jesus was commonly known as such. And that the author was aware of that.


Simply quoting one verse is not showing evidence. You need to explain it.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
Because there is no suggestion that it is Jesus. Really, you have the burden of proof to show that Jesus is the rider of the white horse. If you don't form an argument, then there is nothing to really debate.


This horseman riding the white horse into battle is, also brought forth in Revelation 19:11-16. In Revelation 19:16 He is called the “King of Kings and Lord of Lords.” In both place this rider on the white horse is the Jesus Christ, time he appears in judgment theme and motif.

This first seal judgment was fulfilled in early February 67 AD when Rome officially declared war on Israel, and Nero formally commissioned Vespasian as his general to lead the war to crush the Jewish rebellion. This took place 3.5 years before Jerusalem’s downfall in August 70 AD.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
I would like someone to explain me why many believe that the rider of the white horse is the antichrist instead of Jesus.

The rider on the white horse who went out to conquer was Constantine, the 7th head of the beast of Revelation 17:11. He was sent out to conquer under the sign of the cross by Sol Invictus, the sun god, the "dragon", at the battle of Milvian Bridge in 312 AD.. He has been wearing "down the saints of the Highest One" ever since by virtue of his instituted Roman Catholic religion (Daniel 7:25). We are now in the era of the 8th head of the beast, whose power is welded by the 10 horns of said beast, whose authority is derived from the "dragon" (Revelation 13:4). Tomorrow is the Easter Sunday, the day that Constantine decreed that one is to worship the sun god in 321 AD, and the day that Constantine's Council of Nicaea decreed one is to observe Passover according to the day of the pagan god Astarte. Now tell me, what is the mark of the beast, since the beast with two horns like a lamb is Constantine?
 

sooda

Veteran Member
The rider on the white horse who went out to conquer was Constantine, the 7th head of the beast of Revelation 17:11. He was sent out to conquer under the sign of the cross by Sol Invictus, the sun god, the "dragon", at the battle of Milvian Bridge in 312 AD.. He has been wearing "down the saints of the Highest One" ever since by virtue of his instituted Roman Catholic religion (Daniel 7:25). We are now in the era of the 8th head of the beast, whose power is welded by the 10 horns of said beast, whose authority is derived from the "dragon" (Revelation 13:4). Tomorrow is the Easter Sunday, the day that Constantine decreed that one is to worship the sun god in 321 AD, and the day that Constantine's Council of Nicaea decreed one is to observe Passover according to the day of the pagan god Astarte. Now tell me, what is the mark of the beast, since the beast with two horns like a lamb is Constantine?

The dragon is just satan aka the serpent.. Jesus rides a white horse.. The only time a Jew rode a horse is if he was going to war.

The message is that Jesus won the battle.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
This horseman riding the white horse into battle is, also brought forth in Revelation 19:11-16. In Revelation 19:16 He is called the “King of Kings and Lord of Lords.” In both place this rider on the white horse is the Jesus Christ, time he appears in judgment theme and motif.

This first seal judgment was fulfilled in early February 67 AD when Rome officially declared war on Israel, and Nero formally commissioned Vespasian as his general to lead the war to crush the Jewish rebellion. This took place 3.5 years before Jerusalem’s downfall in August 70 AD.

You are a little confusing. Is Nero the King of Kings and Lord of Lords", or is Vespasian "King of Kings, and Lord of Lords"? And as Revelation 19:16 is with respect to the "Word of God" "smiting the nations", in what way does Jerusalem become the "nations"/Gentiles, and Nero or Vespasian, the "King of Kings, and the Lord of Lords"? Are you sure you are not in the southern hemisphere where up is down and down is up? And since Nero was the 5th horn of the 6th beast of Revelation 17:10, what happened to the 7th and 8th head of the beast, and the 5 remaining horns of the 6th head of the beast?
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
The dragon is just satan aka the serpent.. Jesus rides a white horse.. The only time a Jew rode a horse is if he was going to war.

The message is that Jesus won the battle

If "Jesus" won the battle, why did Titus, the 10th horn of the 6th head of the beast get credit? And why are the nations not being ruled by a "rod of iron" (Revelation 19:15)? And why is the dragon/serpent/devil/Satan not in the "abyss" (Revelation 20:1-3), and when was the 1st resurrection (Revelation 20:4)?
 

sooda

Veteran Member
If we look at these 2 scriptures more carefully we see that the 2 white horses originate from different sources.
The Rider of Rev.19 comes from heaven with many crowns and a sharp sword and is followed by armies
while Rev.6 comes from the seals/thunders with one crown and a bow - being one of the 4 Riders.He goes out to conquer and is false christianity.
But the Rider of Rev.19 already has his army on white horses and HE IS JESUS CHRIST coming with the resurrected Saints.
The rider of Rev.6 is a FALSE christ - one that we are warned about by Jesus himself Mat.24v4,
So no - Jesus is not one of the 4 !

Its just repeating itself.. the Bible does that a lot.. says the same thing in different ways over and over again. The false prophets are trying to use current events to explain what happened in the first century.

Revelation 13:5 says the beast would continue for 42 months.

The Neronic persecution was instituted in 64 AD and lasted until his death in June 68 AD, which is three and a half years, or 42 months. Nero was even called the beast.

Apollonius of Tyana specifically states that Nero was called a beast: "In my travels, which have been wider than ever man yet accomplished, I have seen man, many wild beasts of Arabia and India; but this beast, that is commonly called a Tyrant, I know not how many heads it has, nor if it be crooked of claw, and armed with horrible fangs. ... And of wild beasts you cannot say that they were ever known to eat their own mother, but Nero has gorged himself on this diet."
 

sooda

Veteran Member
You are a little confusing. Is Nero the King of Kings and Lord of Lords", or is Vespasian "King of Kings, and Lord of Lords"? And as Revelation 19:16 is with respect to the "Word of God" "smiting the nations", in what way does Jerusalem become the "nations"/Gentiles, and Nero or Vespasian, the "King of Kings, and the Lord of Lords"? Are you sure you are not in the southern hemisphere where up is down and down is up? And since Nero was the 5th horn of the 6th beast of Revelation 17:10, what happened to the 7th and 8th head of the beast, and the 5 remaining horns of the 6th head of the beast?

  • Nero Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus
  • Servius Sulpicius Galba
  • Marcus Salvius Otho
  • Aulus Vitellius Germanicus
  • Titus Flavius Vespasianus
  • Titus Flavius Vespasianus
  • Titus Flavius Domitianus
  • Marcus Cocceius Nerva

Its Jesus.. The futurists are leading you astray.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
If "Jesus" won the battle, why did Titus, the 10th horn of the 6th head of the beast get credit? And why are the nations not being ruled by a "rod of iron" (Revelation 19:15)? And why is the dragon/serpent/devil/Satan not in the "abyss" (Revelation 20:1-3), and when was the 1st resurrection (Revelation 20:4)?

Rev 19:15 is about Jesus. The sword in his mouth is the word of God.

And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
The dragon is just satan aka the serpent.. Jesus rides a white horse.. The only time a Jew rode a horse is if he was going to war.

The message is that Jesus won the battle.

If "Jesus won the battle" why is the battle still going on? And if the dragon/devil was the authority behind the "beast" (Revelation 13:4), why does the dragon/devil, father of lies, still roam the earth? And what does Nero have to do with Revelation 19:15 whereas the "Word of God" smites the nations? Nero was part of the nations/Gentiles. I think you have listened to the Jesuits, and have got in front of yourself.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
  • Nero Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus
  • Servius Sulpicius Galba
  • Marcus Salvius Otho
  • Aulus Vitellius Germanicus
  • Titus Flavius Vespasianus
  • Titus Flavius Vespasianus
  • Titus Flavius Domitianus
  • Marcus Cocceius Nerva
Its Jesus.. The futurists are leading you astray.

What does that mean? Does Titus Flavius Vespasianus have 2 heads? And if you are saying that Marcus Nerva is the 8th head, if Titus Flavius Vespasianus had two heads, then who are the 10 horns of Nerva who supposedly hated the "harlot" (Revelation 17:16)? And if Nerva "was and is not" (Revelation 17:11) at the time of the writing of Revelation, who was he in the first place, and if he was considered a nice guy, how did he persecute the "harlot"? It seems his son Trajan would be a better villain, as he put down another Jewish revolt, but that would be past the time of the destruction of Jerusalem. Where has the "kingdom" been set up that will not be destroyed (Daniel 2:44), following the crushing of all other kingdoms of Daniel 2:35 & 45? Your scenario seems to have more holes than a colander.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
If "Jesus won the battle" why is the battle still going on? And if the dragon/devil was the authority behind the "beast" (Revelation 13:4), why does the dragon/devil, father of lies, still roam the earth? And what does Nero have to do with Revelation 19:15 whereas the "Word of God" smites the nations? Nero was part of the nations/Gentiles. I think you have listened to the Jesuits, and have got in front of yourself.

What "nations" are they talking about?

The Jesuits started all that futuristic crap in response to Martin Luther claiming that Rome was the Whore of Babylon. Yet scripture says that the whore of Babylon is where Jesus was crucified.
In Revelation 11:8, the great city is Jerusalem, where Jesus was crucified.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
roman-empire-map-1pxh3zp.png
 

sooda

Veteran Member
What does that mean? Does Titus Flavius Vespasianus have 2 heads? And if you are saying that Marcus Nerva is the 8th head, if Titus Flavius Vespasianus had two heads, then who are the 10 horns of Nerva who supposedly hated the "harlot" (Revelation 17:16)? And if Nerva "was and is not" (Revelation 17:11) at the time of the writing of Revelation, who was he in the first place, and if he was considered a nice guy, how did he persecute the "harlot"? It seems his son Trajan would be a better villain, as he put down another Jewish revolt, but that would be past the time of the destruction of Jerusalem. Where has the "kingdom" been set up that will not be destroyed (Daniel 2:44), following the crushing of all other kingdoms of Daniel 2:35 & 45? Your scenario seems to have more holes than a colander.

The kingdom of heaven was not destroyed... and the beast did "hate" the harlot Israel.


The discussion of Daniel 7 identifies the beasts as follows:

  1. Lion = Babylonian Empire
  2. Bear = Mede-Persian Empire
  3. Leopard = Grecian Empire
  4. Dragon = Roman Empire
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
Rev 19:15 is about Jesus. The sword in his mouth is the word of God.

And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Your problem is squaring this up with Nero or Vespasian being the one the "Lord of Lords", and King of Kings, and fulfilling Revelation 6:2.
 
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