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Is it right that Israel Folau should get the sack for his 'Hell awaits gay people' comments?

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by The_Fisher_King, Apr 12, 2019.

  1. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    Such as managers who can't make a profit unless their footballers become socialist philosophers.
     
  2. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    I don't understand this.
     
  3. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Riboflavin
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    Of course, "gay people should be allowed to marry" doesn't encourage hatred or violence toward anyone, so not quite the same thing.

    The opposite to "hell awaits gay people" isn't "gay people should get married;" it's something like the Diderot quote "men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest."
     
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  4. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    It's the business owner's decision to decide which course of action is best.
    I once ran afoul of some anti-abortion group which threatened me with
    protests if I didn't refuse to lease to an abortion doctor. I chose to lease
    to whomever I wanted.
    I make the decisions about what is best for my business.
    And I'm under no obligation to keep an employee who cause it harm.
    Only my judgement matters.
     
  5. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Riboflavin
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    He wasn't fired for having a controversial opinion; he was fired for breaching the Australian Rugby Code of Conduct.
     
  6. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    Three takeaways from this

    1. Folau, who signed a four-year deal with the Waratahs in March and had a deal with Rugby Australia until 2022, escaped punishment for similar comments last year.

    2. He's in the public eye and should mind his P's and Q's because people do associate him with the team.

    3. If he worked in a factory bottling soda, no one would care.
     
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  7. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    The above is taken from: Code of Conduct

    For information there is the code in question.
     
  8. A Vestigial Mote

    A Vestigial Mote Well-Known Member

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    I completely agree! Funny that you think I said anything to contradict this.

    What I said fits more in line with these little nuggets - when it comes time for me to purchase the goods or services: Only my judgment matters. I make the decisions about what it best for me, and who I think either best deserves my money, or who can provide me the best service without forcing me to set aside my principles. I choose to purchase from whomever I want. And I am under no obligation to buy from anyone who I think wears a butt for a hat.

    You see, as with so many other things in life, you have to keep in mind the street runs two ways. You can't just throw things around that you wouldn't want to be hit with yourself. And if you do, there may very well be consequences.
     
  9. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    The tweets were not made while working in a factory and did not affect his ability to bottle sodas.
     
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  10. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    It wouldn't matter if it was done at the factory or not. The point was a factory worker isn't in the eye of the public and no one would care.

    When you are in the eye of the public, and the public associates you with that team on field and off field,, you need to mind your P's and Q's.
     
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  11. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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  12. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    Do those P's and Q's involve forgetting who you are and what you believe?
     
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  13. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
    Premium Member It's My Birthday!

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    I agree with everything you have said here.
     
  14. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    There's nothing to understand; it's hyperbolic strawman garbage.
     
  15. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    I'm not only slow on the uptake, I also post on RF while eating & watching TV.
    That's my excuse, & I'm sticking to it.
    Detente is so much easier.
     
  16. adrian009

    adrian009 Well-Known Member
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    Here are excerpts from the code of conduct that Israel Folau signed and agreed to.

    CODE OF CONDUCT - PLAYERS

    1.3 Treat everyone equally, fairly and with dignity regardless of gender or gender identity, sexual orientation, ethnicity, cultural or religious background, age or disability. Any form of bullying, harassment or discrimination has no place in Rugby.

    1.7 Use Social Media appropriately. By all means share your positive experiences of Rugby but do not use Social Media as a means to breach any of the expectations and requirements of you as a player contained in this Code or in any Union, club or competition rules and regulations.

    1.8 Do not otherwise act in a way that may adversely affect or reflect on, or bring you, your team, club, Rugby Body or Rugby into disrepute or discredit. If you commit a criminal offence, this is likely to adversely reflect on you and your team, club, Rugby Body and Rugby.


    All Policies and Guidelines

    Israel Folau is in breach of his contract, therefore Rugby Australia are justified in sacking him.
     
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  17. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    Of course not. He has a right to his opinion no matter if its a popular one. Now if he starts physically assaulting said people that's a different story.
     
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  18. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise

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    Yes he should. He can hold whatever opinion he so chooses. But fact is, he is part of the public face of a brand. If this were on a private message to close friends then nothing would have happened. He shared this on a social media profile that is seen by thousands of fans. Not just a social media account we all use to chat with family and friends. His is technically part of the workplace for him.
    He has the right to free speech, not a right to be absolved of the consequences. He said this rather publicly, instead of privately. He chose to publicly endorse a message that is incompatible with that of his employers and did so as their public face. His employers are reacting to already established rules on online etiquette. Hell this sort of thing is taught in schools nowadays. If you’re going to post a message that could get you into hot water with your employer, for goodness sakes make sure it’s private and not “in the workplace” in any shape or form. This tweet was technically in his workspace. It would be the same if someone shared hateful messages among their work colleagues on employer time.
    He is no doubt a talented player, perhaps he can talk them down to a suspension and community service.
     
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  19. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    He's a public figure and that kind of message can trigger all kinds of trouble.

    And it's daft.

    Jesus liked his meat and drink, and could get inebriated. . So much so that the Baptist was worried about what he heard about this. So have a glass of wine on Jesus!

    As for this hypocrisy about Gays etc, Jesus never said a word. Sure, 2000 years ago closed couples were ideal because illness could be transmitted through polygamy, but today we have better protections etc.

    Thing is, some Christians make a big fuss about polygamy and Gays etc, but I wonder how many Christians have made a big effort to install safety rails or balconies around any of their flats roofs on their homes? The law that speaks against Gays also demands safety rails on flats roofs! (Deut 22:8). Some Christians just Cherry pick what they think is important and discard the other 'non-sacrificial' laws, there are 507 of them!

    Yeah........... he doesn't deserve to get off lightly imo.
     
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  20. Rival

    Rival Noachide
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    All that appears to be being done here is that people with socially conservative and religious views are being shut down and told to keep them to themselves, while their liberal counterparts are allowed to speak freely. No, this isn't alright. It's just culture's way of holding yet another group down just because it's not socially acceptable to have a certain view right now. Sorry, you don't get to do that.
     
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