stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Seems good to me. Nothing wrong with this. Even excellent.
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Is Fascism worse than other forms of Abrahamic Monotheism?
- Thread starter Spiderman
- Start date
Spiderman
Veteran Member
You are refusing to acknowledge that I repeatedly condemn Mussolini's mistakes, and am not even saying he was a "good guy".
I'm saying he was courageous, audacious, diligent, determined, steadfast, ingenious, charismatic, and had completely amazing superhuman qualities that go unnoticed. He had another side to him with positive qualities, that I fail to see in practically any other leader. I'm saying he is my greatest inspiration, and even his mistakes inspire me to avoid what brings about those errors in judgment and those consequences.
But that doesn't make him a good guy, because his dream of being the Caesar of a Roman Empire destroyed him, which warns me of the dangers of pride, ambition, and vain glory.
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
The man was a coward who hid behind a facade of blustering buffoonery. It was all an act. Like the Wizard of Oz
Would I be right in assuming that Popeadope is the first self-described Fascist you've met online? Or have you met other Fascists online or in real life before?
(I'm just trying to gauge how best to respond here so the dialogue is productive and understand where you are coming from in terms of past experiences).
Spiderman
Veteran Member
"Last name: Mussolini
This very interesting medieval surname has a confused origin. Like the personal name and subsequent surname Jacob, it has its origins in the Hebrew given name "Yaakov". This was Latinized first as "Jacobus", and then in the period known as "The Dark Ages" upto the 11th century a.d., as "Jacomus". "
Surname Database: Mussolini Last Name Origin
Either way, it got me back into practicing the spirituality of Saint Louis De Montfort, my favorite author, who taught me about Jacob and how he symbolized and prefigured the elect ,and his Mother who got him the blessing prefigured and symbolized Mary. Mussolini's surname got me back into the devotion that De Montfort calls the quickest easiest way to Christian perfection. I had abandoned it. He claims that as Jacob did none of the work to win the greatest of blessings (which wasn’t intended for him), but relied on his Mother, those who rely on Mary receive the same blessing, though they don’t deserve it, and it isn’t intended for them. I can’t thank Mussolini enough for leading me back to what was my favorite consecration and devotion.
Anyhow, De Montfort died April 28, the same day Mussolini was executed, and April 28 is De Montfort’s feast day, the one who made Jacob a significant figure in my life and spirituality.
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The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
That website is full of ****. Giacobbi is Italian for Jacob
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
How many fingers am I holding up
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
Yup. One in each hand.I'm guessing two.
Spiderman
Veteran Member
He lived every day in danger of death and imprisonment before his rise to power. As prime minister, he was the target leftists wanted assassinated more than others. As Dictator, his opponents were pretty much crushed, so he could be a "Wonderful wizard of Oz", but he lived in chronic danger prior to that. He was facing constant imprisonment or death for his march on Rome (which should have been a disaster) and constant other actions prior to that which made him perhaps the most despised man in Italy for a time. There were multiple attempts to assassinate him. When it was time for him to die, I read that he showed no signs of fear.
Spiderman
Veteran Member
A man does not rise from nothing, march on a nation’s capitol, replace a communist-influenced democracy without a coup or military intervention, become the youngest prime minister of Italian history, then dismantle democracy and replace it with his own form of government, working miracles for the economy, creating new jobs, make Italy great again, be celebrated internationally, and other miracles, all through being a good actor. Sorry, not gonna happen!
Spiderman
Veteran Member
Amen! Wow! Happy birthday, comrade!
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
A little.Feeling better?
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
It happens all the time.
Spiderman
Veteran Member
You are probably thinking of politicians who win votes by being a good actor. Others get into power through their parents, through a coup, or through military intervention. Mussolini was not voted in, had no coup, neither did he have military intervention. His form of government spread to Spain, Germany, Japan, and beyond, creating economic miracles, and became easily the most powerful form of government on earth. NO, that doesn’t happen all the time. In fact, I can’t think of another instance of it happening. Certainly not in the 20th or 21st century.
I'm glad to hear it.
If my response to @PopeADope looks a bit strange, it's because I'm an ex-communist and have had to deal with issues of my own because of what I believed. I was involved in the movement (mainly online) for over ten years and really had to struggle to come to terms with the fact I was supporting a system that killed 100 million people. I have tried pulling myself out of it, but it remains a daily struggle and you have to deal with really dark, difficult stuff that makes you deeply uncomfortable. You have to root yourself back in "reality" where people get hurt and hurt each other when thinking about the ideas of a "perfect world" is much more attractive and reassuring. (if anything that kind of exposure temporarily makes your beliefs stronger and you even more fervent out of the insecurity) I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but going through it has proven to be ultimately the right thing to do.
It's worth keeping in mind that everyone has their own story behind the label. No-one is born a fascist and the story of how someone becomes involved in Fascism (or Communism in my case) is usually much more interesting that what their beliefs are. There is always a chance they can find a way to become someone without those beliefs, as they had been before they got involved with them.
If you can get someone to think about where they are from, how they got there and whether it was inevitable, you might be able to find ways to show them their are alternatives and they have a choice about who they are and can become. It's as much an emotional journey in to and out of a belief system (much like a cult) as it is a purely rational question of the right arguments.
I hope that clears things up a little bit.
The Reverend Bob
Fart Machine and Beastmaster
How many fingers am I holding up? This isn't about him being a fascist. Okay?I'm glad to hear it.
If my response to @PopeADope looks a bit strange, it's because I'm an ex-communist and have had to deal with issues of my own because of what I believed. I was involved in the movement (mainly online) for over ten years and really had to struggle to come to terms with the fact I was supporting a system that killed 100 million people. I have tried pulling myself out of it, but it remains a daily struggle and you have to deal with really dark, difficult stuff that makes you deeply uncomfortable. You have to root yourself back in "reality" where people get hurt and hurt each other when thinking about the ideas of a "perfect world" is much more attractive and reassuring. (if anything that kind of exposure temporarily makes your beliefs stronger and you even more fervent out of the insecurity) I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but going through it has proven to be ultimately the right thing to do.
It's worth keeping in mind that everyone has their own story behind the label. No-one is born a fascist and the story of how someone becomes involved in Fascism (or Communism in my case) is usually much more interesting that what their beliefs are. There is always a chance they can find a way to become someone without those beliefs, as they had been before they got involved with them.
If you can get someone to think about where they are from, how they got there and whether it was inevitable, you might be able to find ways to show them their are alternatives and they have a choice about who they are and can become. It's as much an emotional journey in to and out of a belief system (much like a cult) as it is a purely rational question of the right arguments.
I hope that clears things up a little bit.
Right. Whatever it is I'll leave you to it then.
He wrote well thought out paragraphs for you....