Is Enlightenment a Choice?

[SalixIncendium]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened? Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

 

[Sunstone]

Disclaimer: I'm only talking here about what I might know. Other people might know more than me. At the same time, only a crashing bore would disagree with me.

Enlightenment is usually not much of a choice (so far as I know). I mean that in two senses:

1) There does not appear to be much in the way of free will (except possibly in a negative way). Hence, how much of a choice can enlightenment be?

2) There are no guaranteed paths to enlightenment: At best, a means, technique, or path only increases your chances of being enlightened. Hence, how much of a choice can enlightenment be?​

But there are perhaps two senses in which it might be a choice at times.

First, in a "Not this, not that" sense. That is, via a negative path, so to speak.

Second, via a vision or other such weirdness during which perfect free choice comes to you as a "miracle" -- as a moment when the normal rules are suspended, so to speak.​

But I'm probably wrong about all that. I've been married twice, so I know I'm probably wrong about everything.

 

[BSM1]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened? Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

Like @Sunstone said, enlightenment is usually actively sought or passively forced on a person. I think the bigger question is will that person acknowledge and accept the enlightenment.

And, please, lose the paisley socks.

 

[Sunstone]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

See post #2.

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened?

I would tell anyone who asked me except that annoying @Terese. I wouldn't tell that annoying Terese, "Yes, enlightenment can at times come about through an experience or series of experiences -- so far as I can find out."

Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

I'm guessing, of course, but I would guess that learnedness about enlightenment is a two edged sword that can at times hinder or prevent enlightenment experiences, but can at other times provide a interpretative framework for the experiences -- a framework that might help you to deal with having had the experience or experiences.

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

None is required for an experience, but discipline might help bring one about. No guarantees, though!

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

Last month alone, during your visit to that Zen monastery, six monks attained satori by mentally fleeing from the pain of witnessing your outfit into a state of "no-thought".

 

[bobhikes]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened? Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

In my experience enlightenment has to be sought as such it is a choice. There is no special path to enlightening. You need an open mind to find it. It doesn't automatically come to you.

 

[Vinayaka]

In the view of my Hindu sampradaya, it's not a choice, but a natural outcome of dharma well performed over many lifetimes. We can choose to live dharmicly to the best of out abilities. Choice is not there for enlightenment because by the time it happens, the ego, or individual doing the choosing is no longer present.

But ... as you know, definitions of enlightenment vary, and I'm just using mine. Anyone can claim (choose?) to say they are enlightened, but that wouldn't fit the definition I go on.

 

[Sunstone]

Choice is not there for enlightenment because by the time it happens, the ego, or individual doing the choosing is no longer present.

Excellent point!

 

[Sunstone]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened? Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

This is one of the best threads I've seen in a long time. Thanks, Scott!

 

[shunyadragon]

Like @Sunstone said, enlightenment is usually actively sought or passively forced on a person. I think the bigger question is will that person acknowledge and accept the enlightenment.

And, please, lose the paisley socks.

The problem with 'enlightenment' is that in reality it is plagued by delusions of claiming to the search, how to become enlightened, and the claim to acquire 'enlightenment.' Unfortunately there are too many conflicting claims concerning 'enlightenment.

In simple terms my view of enlightenment is the realization that all we can achieve in reality is the realization of nothingness and you achieve nothing. Like the Tao and God it is not knowledge nor Truth you can attain. If you do make these claims it is an illusion. More to follow . . .

"Claims of enlightenment are a luxury of human vanity, and Truth is another."

 

[socharlie]

Does one, at some point in their life, make a moral or ethical conscious choice to become enlightened or to have enlightenment experiences?

Is it experience, mystical or otherwise, that either leads one to the path of enlightenment or to automatically 'become' enlightened? Or does one become familiar with the term and its definition and make the choice to seek enlightenment?

What measure of discipline, if any, in your opinion, does it take to become enlightened or to have an enlightenment experience?

Most importantly, is my fashion sense really all that bad?

45“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant seeking fine pearls, 46and upon finding one pearl of great value, he went and sold all that he had and bought it Matt. 13

 

[Sunstone]

45“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant seeking fine pearls, 46and upon finding one pearl of great value, he went and sold all that he had and bought it Matt. 13

Could you elaborate please on how what you quoted addresses the questions in the OP?

 

[socharlie]

Could you elaborate please on how what you quoted addresses the questions in the OP?

Entering the Kingdom of Heaven = Enlightenment.

 

[shunyadragon]

Entering the Kingdom of Heaven = Enlightenment.

Too many conflicting claims concerning 'Entering the Kingdom of Heaven' to be even guided by a wet match.

 

[osgart]

Enlightenment would have to be a needle in a haystack of endless haystacks. Yet so simple that you could find it if so desired.

Than to claim the needle you would have to be worthy of it or fail at its simple comprehension. That is enlightenment to me.

 

[BSM1]

Enlightenment would have to be a needle in a haystack of endless haystacks. Yet so simple that you could find it if so desired.

Than to claim the needle you would have to be worthy of it or fail at its simple comprehension. That is enlightenment to me.

To me, enlightenment would mean you realize you don't have to look for the needle. It's enough to know the needle will be there when you need it.

 

[socharlie]

Too many conflicting claims concerning 'Entering the Kingdom of Heaven' to be even guided by a wet match.

just read what is written and understand, I have no other suggestion, it is all explained there.

 

[BSM1]

just read what is written and understand, I have no other suggestion, it is all explained there.

What is the "Kingdom of Heaven..." to you?

 

[crossfire]

Entering the Kingdom of Heaven = Enlightenment.

Kingdom of Heaven=Brahmavihara=Brahma Abodes? (Four sublime states.) They will naturally arise when you rid your mind of greed, hatred, and delusion. (Which can be a whole heck of a lot of work.) I guess that could be like selling your greed, hatred, and delusion, if that is all you had.

 

[WalterTrull]

Uh.. I think it's holy ghost stuff. So, probably a path leading to it. I have a hunch it's very seldom a bolt of lightening moment. (hiding socks)

 

[socharlie]

What is the "Kingdom of Heaven..." to you?

spiritual world, different levels of it, not just afterlife but one that you enter while possessing physical body.