1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Is Christianity logical?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Muffled, Apr 13, 2017.

  1. syo

    syo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2016
    Messages:
    3,855
    Ratings:
    +1,089
    Religion:
    pagan, omnist
    as far as I've read, christianity is logical.
     
  2. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2017
    Messages:
    16,825
    Ratings:
    +8,027
    Religion:
    Baha'i Faith
    Christianity is not logical nor illogical, but the arguments for Christianity are problematic heavily using circular arguments, and selective assumptions.
     
  3. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,221
    Ratings:
    +1,295
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe there is no evidence that man was created evil and the Biblical evidence is that God called man good at creation.

    I believe this is not a main tenet of Christianity. Forgiveness was already provided in the OT.

    I believe you will find in the account that Mary did consent before the conception.


    I believe this is eminently logical.

    Christianity is all about the Holy Spirit dwelling within and saving people from their sin.
    The expiration of Jesus on the cross meant the brain was dead.
    The resurrection shows that it isn't the brain that has the memory of life but the Spirit.
    The resurrection also shows that the spirit can be in the body.
    Therefore the resurrection shows that the Holy Spirit can be in believers as Jesus promised it would be.
     
  4. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,221
    Ratings:
    +1,295
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe a lot of people believe it is illogical to depend on ancient writings. However we do that every day. We still educate students on the Pythagorean theorem even though Pythagoras wrote in ancient times. The reason is simple: his theorem can be shown to apply in everyday life. I believe the same is true for Christianity. What was written has played out constantly in lives that have been saved from sin.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2017
    Messages:
    16,825
    Ratings:
    +8,027
    Religion:
    Baha'i Faith
    We educate students on how the ancient writings deveoloped math, because the math can be objectively confirmed today to understand the history of math, and the thought behind the development of the logic of math.

    The problem with ancient religious writings of religions like the Bible is that it does not have that consistent logical train of proof connecting the ancient writings to the present.
     
    #185 shunyadragon, May 13, 2017
    Last edited: May 13, 2017
  6. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2008
    Messages:
    46,687
    Ratings:
    +15,104
    Religion:
    Advocate of letting go of theism. Buddhist with an emphasis on personal understanding.
    I don't think so. I fail to see how any doctrine that makes such a big deal of a deity could possibly be logical.
     
  7. JustWondering

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2009
    Messages:
    2,886
    Ratings:
    +793
    Religion:
    No thanks.


    There is no evidence that any life on earth required and intelligent creator. Biblical creation myths are just that, myths. Regardless, the god of the bible created man, so LOGICALLY if we are sinful and don't measure up to his standards that is representative of his bad craftsmanship. Yet the biblical god buts the blame on HIS creation instead of owning up to the fact that he is responsible for our behavior.



    I thought Jesus taught that the only way to salvation was through him. You'll have to provide verses to back that up.




    Her consent was never asked for. An angel showed up and said, hey god's gonna knock you up by the way.

    I do not find the stories of the Bible logical, it is nothing but ancient mythological stories to me. The biblical god is supposed to be the most powerful entity in the universe yet can only communicate through a chosen person in secret. That is not only illogical for a powerful entity that craves worship and obedience as the biblical god is described to be, but it is also obvious that people are using the self proclaimed title of gods "chosen" to secure influence and power for themselves. The oldest con in the book. I don't entertain mystical thinking. The claims of the bible do not impress me.
     
  8. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,221
    Ratings:
    +1,295
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe it is logical.

    Humans are intelligent beings.
    Intelligent beings are able to change things based on the power they have to do so,
    Therefore an intelligent being with superior power to change things can exist.

    I believe we have more power to change things today than we ever did in history. We can wipe a city off the map with one bomb and we can raise a building in a few days. We can clone sheep.
     
  9. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2008
    Messages:
    46,687
    Ratings:
    +15,104
    Religion:
    Advocate of letting go of theism. Buddhist with an emphasis on personal understanding.
    @Muffled

    Your belief is yours to hold, of course. But what you are actually proposing is nothing more than a statement of aesthetical preference.

    There is no logical attempt at an argument there to be found.
     
  10. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,221
    Ratings:
    +1,295
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe there is no evidence that an alternative was available.

    I believe a creation story being told by God is not a myth. God speaks the truth of things that are and have been.

    I believe it is good craftmanship. The bad things are not a necessary result of the craftmanship.

    Ps 103:12 As far as the east is from the west, So far hath he removed our transgressions from us.
    John 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for except ye believe that I am, ye shall die in your sins.

    I believe the person who forgives sins is God and that Jesus is God in the flesh.
    Forgiveness is not salvation from sin; it is salvation from the enmity of God. Yes He is the only savior from sin because He is the only one without sin.


    I believe the contrary is true. Everyone is responsible for his own actions. The people who say God told me to do it are lying.

    I believe her consent did not have to be requested because God already knew she would give it.

    I believe that is because you do not reason logically.

    I believe you are assuming that God can't do it another way. It is also possible because it is the best way. God did try to communicate with a mass of people but it didn't go well.

    I believe there are those who do that but there are those who are doing what God asked them to do.
     
  11. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    18,221
    Ratings:
    +1,295
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe that means you either lack the ability to reason or you don't like the conclusion no matter how valid since you have so adeptly avoided addressing the logic.
     
  12. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2008
    Messages:
    46,687
    Ratings:
    +15,104
    Religion:
    Advocate of letting go of theism. Buddhist with an emphasis on personal understanding.
    Nope. A third option is valid: I am no theist and I have no interest in attempting to become one, let alone in pretending to be one.

    Once again: there is no logic in there to be addressed. You are presenting aesthetical claims and nothing more.
     
    #192 LuisDantas, May 25, 2017
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  13. JustWondering

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2009
    Messages:
    2,886
    Ratings:
    +793
    Religion:
    No thanks.


    Everywhere you look there is evidence that the natural world exists. On the other hand there is zero evidence for your ancient middle eastern god's existence.



    The bible claims the earth was created before the sun. There are at least two magic rituals in the bible, one for curing yourself of leprosy that involves standing in a stream holding two birds, the other involves giving a special potion to a woman who is believed to have committed adultery. There's a talking snake. A talking burning bush. There are massive events described in the bible that are not supported by ANYTHING else outside the bible. Its just ancient mythology like ancient Greek mythology, it doesn't portray reality.



    That is not logical. Your religion claims that your god created EVERYTHING but when something goes off the rails your god says "Not my fault!". That's like a train going off the tracks because someone built the tracks wrong then blaming the passengers on the train for the accident. Your religions claims make your position illogical.




    So no salvation unless you believe in Jesus? Thank you for proving my point.



    Did you create your own nervous system. Did you write the genetic code in your DNA that dictates every trait you possess? Did you create the environment that you where born into? If a god created EVERYTHING than that same god is responsible for everything that it created and what it does? If someone has violent, psychotic urges and your god exists that would mean that god gave that person those violent, psychotic urges. There's no way around that. Why would your god make someone psychotic? Why would god make homosexuals even though he seems to hate them so much? The claims of your religion are illogical.



    According to the bible, women are to do what they're told, period.



    Please demonstrate how my reasoning is illogical in regards to your religions wholly unsupported claims.



    So your god is a horrible communicator as well as a horrible craftsman? Mankind can create a communications network that spans the globe and allows instant dissemination of information to millions yet your god has to whisper his demands to a "chosen one". Yea, I'm obviously the illogical one when it comes to all this.

    I believe ALL those "chosen ones" that claim to speak on gods behalf are delusional or conmen.
     
Loading...