No, that's belief. Knowledge has an additional component--it actually is true.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Is Belief a Choice?
- Thread starter Monk Of Reason
- Start date
There is a very thin line between thinking something is true and something actually being true.
I'm talking about belief that requires at least a bit of faith, like my belief that my kids did not eat all the sweets yet. Belief, unlike knowledge, doesn't require for something to actually be true.
Knowledge is just those beliefs that we think are certainly true.
Many people claim to know God exists, for instance, and yet simply calling it knowledge doesn't mean that it must actually be true. It just means that the person calling it knowledge believes it certain that it is true.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
Sure and I've heard plenty that say they know god exists. I accept that to mean gnostic theist. A person can still say they don't know for certain but they believe it to be true in which case the belief is a choice. Which is because theism requires faith even if someone says they know.
Not necessarily. A person who, for instance, doesn't know for sure that they have cancer but believes they might may be basing their belief on signs, such as pains, a lump under the skin, or a similarity of symptoms described on the radio by a doctor on an interview show. Is it fair to say they chose to believe when the signs are all there?
Sure but it is all educated guessing until it becomes knowledge. Symptoms can be from a multitude of causes until it is confirmed by testing.
Actually, it's no less superstitious guessing than the person who trusts signs enough to avoid walking under a ladder.
But is it fairly "choosing to believe"? The signs are there.
I can't choose there to be 5 apples, but if I'm just hoping there are more than five then that is faith and a choice.
But if you had overheard Mary telling William that she misplaced 6 apples, and the smell apples is in the air, then you are in the same circumstance but with reason to believe there may be 6 apples. An inductive conclusion is not certain, but is it a choice?
I think for many "God" is an inductive conclusion.
Last edited:
Perhaps which works with the type of theism I believe. It doesn't work for others where we have to take a peek outside of the universe which has to use deductive reasoning based on an unknowable premise. We can't very well know what is outside our box of universe.
underthesun
Terrible with Titles
Wow, I think this thread is really a very fascinating topic that I am surprised I hadn't considered before. We always talk about religion as if people choose to believe them, but... is it so?
To a degree, I think that one can make him/herself believe something, in the same sense that one's mind can truly remember that the mugger they saw had a blue hat on, when in all actuality he didn't. This might fall under your definition of denial, but I do think that the brain has the ability to lie to itself into believing something.
But aside from the few cases of one convincing him/herself to believe something? I think that you really can't choose what you believe in, in the same sense that you can't choose what you're attracted to.
I know I couldn't choose my beliefs; I had to search for them and really open up to myself to find them. I had tried for so long to believe in the Abrahamic God in the way that the scriptures taught, but I simply couldn't force myself to do it, and I promise this was not for lack of effort. And then I tried just as hard (albeit for much less time) to convince myself to be a polytheist, but no matter how much I wanted to believe, I couldn't. It just wasn't the belief that worked for me; it wasn't the connection between the divine and myself. So, I can only speculate, perhaps it is that each individual has a belief that exists to explain the connection between the divine and his/herself, and they really do not have any choice in it. No conscious choice, at the very least.
:candle:
Fascinating!
To a degree, I think that one can make him/herself believe something, in the same sense that one's mind can truly remember that the mugger they saw had a blue hat on, when in all actuality he didn't. This might fall under your definition of denial, but I do think that the brain has the ability to lie to itself into believing something.
But aside from the few cases of one convincing him/herself to believe something? I think that you really can't choose what you believe in, in the same sense that you can't choose what you're attracted to.
I know I couldn't choose my beliefs; I had to search for them and really open up to myself to find them. I had tried for so long to believe in the Abrahamic God in the way that the scriptures taught, but I simply couldn't force myself to do it, and I promise this was not for lack of effort. And then I tried just as hard (albeit for much less time) to convince myself to be a polytheist, but no matter how much I wanted to believe, I couldn't. It just wasn't the belief that worked for me; it wasn't the connection between the divine and myself. So, I can only speculate, perhaps it is that each individual has a belief that exists to explain the connection between the divine and his/herself, and they really do not have any choice in it. No conscious choice, at the very least.
:candle:
Fascinating!
Lady of Permutations
New Member
I haven't read the whole thread yet, but from my own experience I've come to the conclusion that belief is not a choice. I used to try to make myself believe in God by reading the works of philosophers who argued that God existed, but they didn't help. Even if it were somehow proven that God existed, I wouldn't necessarily believe on an emotional level. I'd believe it intellectually, but I'd still probably be surprised if a miracle happened.
I also think there are different kinds of belief. On some level, I think you can know something and not really believe it. (Which is an incorrect way to phrase it, because knowledge is a type of belief.)
For example, science books tell me there are trillions and trillions of stars, many of them bigger than the sun, bigger than I can possibly imagine. But when I look at the sky, the stars I can see are impossibly small and most of them are completely invisible to me. I haven't really had a personal experience of any of those stars - at least not one that shows their true magnitude and amazingness - so they aren't real to me in the same way that grass, trees, etc. are real to me.
The idea that belief is not a choice makes sense to me. If God exists, then faith/belief must be a gift from God. We can't create it in ourselves.
I also think there are different kinds of belief. On some level, I think you can know something and not really believe it. (Which is an incorrect way to phrase it, because knowledge is a type of belief.)
For example, science books tell me there are trillions and trillions of stars, many of them bigger than the sun, bigger than I can possibly imagine. But when I look at the sky, the stars I can see are impossibly small and most of them are completely invisible to me. I haven't really had a personal experience of any of those stars - at least not one that shows their true magnitude and amazingness - so they aren't real to me in the same way that grass, trees, etc. are real to me.
The idea that belief is not a choice makes sense to me. If God exists, then faith/belief must be a gift from God. We can't create it in ourselves.
Last edited:
I agree, what I see occurring is when people want something to be true. As if they would choose god, they want god to be true, but they can't because they have no choice in the matter. Well believing in god is faith and is a choice, if we could empirically point out a god it wouldn't be an issue and everyones theism would be a matter of fact instead of faith.
Sir Doom
Cooler than most of you
Not exactly what I was saying. I see no difference between believing in God or believing in the moon. The fact that you can see the moon changes nothing. You still possess a conceptual version in your mind designed and implemented intentionally by you. And it changes every single time you think about the moon. What it is, was and will be is 100% within your control. And thus it is 100% choice to believe whatever it is you believe.
Draka
Wonder Woman
How in the world is how I see the moon entirely under my control? I look up in the sky, there it is. I go to school, I am taught about it. I go outside at night I am surrounded by moonlight. I have been given reason, influenced, into accepting the existence of the moon. Of course I would believe in its existence, but I certainly didn't choose to believe. Same goes for when someone feels they have been given reason to accept the existence of deity. It's a matter of convincing to a point of not having a "choice" not to believe. If something is a "choice" then that means that you are presented things which are equally plausible and you choose between them. That simply is not so for the vast majority of theists.
HankHill
Indian-American Ex-Hindu
I haven't read the whole thread but I am noticing that many more people feel belief is not a choice than it is. I personally think it is a choice in the sense that belief is something we can either accept or deny and have to be responsible for such choices. That being said, it is in a more subtle and a different way than a choice involving say a pro-con list or some type of inner dialogue/argument.
Sir Doom
Cooler than most of you
I thought I just explained that.
Who is it that looks in the sky? Magical sky-looking trolls? Or do you make that choice yourself? I'm curious, when you look in the sky do you have any expectations about what you might find there?
Taught by people in the same boat as you. Naturally, you trust these fallible meat-sacks implicitly. There is absolutely no chance whatsoever that anyone would ever decieve you for any reason. Education deals with facts only. This fantasy brought to you by the letter 7 and the number Y.
K.
So, why do you keep believing in it?
Theists are generally unaware of alternatives to their beliefs? Is that really what you think? I'm pretty sure its the opposite. A vast majority of theists are constantly bombarded by the alternatives to their beliefs. And whether they have been a theists since they were a young child, or whether they adopted the idea much later in life... the choice is always happening NOW. Not 5 minutes ago, not yesterday, not 10 years ago. Right now.