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Is America a Babylonian society?

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by jvi, Jun 28, 2005.

  1. jvi

    jvi Member

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    From the NIV

    1. 2 Kings 23:5 He did away with the pagan priests appointed by the kings of Judah to burn incense on the high places of the towns of Judah and on those around Jerusalem—those who burned incense to Baal, to the sun and moon, to the constellations and to all the starry hosts.
    2. Psalm 16:3 As for the saints who are in the land, they are the glorious ones in whom is all my delight. [ Or As for the pagan priests who are in the land / and the nobles in whom all delight, I said: ]
    3. Isaiah 57:8 Behind your doors and your doorposts you have put your pagan symbols. Forsaking me, you uncovered your bed, you climbed into it and opened it wide; you made a pact with those whose beds you love, and you looked on their nakedness.
    4. Lamentations 1:10 The enemy laid hands on all her treasures; she saw pagan nations enter her sanctuary— those you had forbidden to enter your assembly.
    5. Amos 7:17 "Therefore this is what the LORD says: " 'Your wife will become a prostitute in the city, and your sons and daughters will fall by the sword. Your land will be measured and divided up, and you yourself will die in a pagan [ Hebrew an unclean ] country. And Israel will certainly go into exile, away from their native land.' "
    6. Zephaniah 1:4 [ Against Judah ] "I will stretch out my hand against Judah and against all who live in Jerusalem. I will cut off from this place every remnant of Baal, the names of the pagan and the idolatrous priests-
    7. Matthew 18:17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.
    8. Luke 12:30 For the pagan world runs after all such things, and your Father knows that you need them.
    9. 1 Corinthians 10:7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: "The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in pagan revelry." [ Exodus 32:6]
     
  2. Isabella Lecour

    Isabella Lecour dreaming of paradise

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    Hear!! Hear!! You deserve frubles Mister Emu.

    Could we also agree on a dictionay verison for the meaning of words while we are at it? I like dictionary.com myself, or even answers.com too.

    Isabella
     
  3. jvi

    jvi Member

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    Religion is something that people practice as a way of life. Celebrating man created holidays as a way of life is a pagan religion.Do some simple research on your holidays.Go to a search engine,type in Nimrod Christmas Bible and read away. Many Christians will be very surprised to find they celebrate the religion of Nimrod of Babylon.
     
  4. jvi

    jvi Member

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    Does everyone know the difference between a Judean Christian and a Nimrod Christian? Both worship God in spirit but only one worships God in truth. We are to worship God in spirit AND in truth. Nimrod Christians celebrate the manmade holidays of Nimrod roots{based on lies) and Judean Christians celebrate the Feasts of Yahweh God(truth).
     
  5. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    JVI,

    you assume I do not know the origins of my religious celebrations.

    You are incorrect.

    I know where they come from. Also, I know why they chose the dates they did.

    Biblical support please. I do not, nor have I ever celebrated the nimrod religion of Babylon.

    Also, your quotes are why I use the KJV. Take for instance 2 Kings 23:5, the word, Kawar, means priest and idolatrous priest. Not pagan.

    From now on, if you make a reference to Nimrod or Babylon in conjuction with anyone else worshipping or celebrating, cite evidence.
     
  6. jvi

    jvi Member

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    Mister Emu you have no Biblical support for your holidays.However the Feasts of God are Biblically supported and we are told to do them forever. Aren't we supposed to obey God? Granted that love of one another fufills God's laws and both a Nimrod holiday Christian and a Judean Christian fulfill God's law just by loving one another but it still leaves the fact that Nimrod Christians are worshipping God by celebrating days that originate from confusion and lies.

    John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

    John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
     
  7. jvi

    jvi Member

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    So Mister Emu can you show the Bible origin of your holidays? I have done the research and know they are related to Nimrod with a twist given to them to act like they are about God.If you could show where they are in the Bible then maybe you could change my mind about them being pagan.
     
  8. Isabella Lecour

    Isabella Lecour dreaming of paradise

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    Where in the Bible does it instruct that Gentiles, or even Christians, are to celebrate these holy days?
    And just how do you get around the fact that the temple no longer exists and without the temple these holy days are only wispers of what they are suposed to be.

    My parants belived much like this but they would have never continued to call another Christian a "Nimrod Christian" for the shear disrespect that it is! If anything they would have used "worldy" instead.

    Isabella.
     
  9. jvi

    jvi Member

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    I use Nimrod Christian because the holidays are associated with Nimrod.What will the Gentiles do when the time of the Gentiles end? Gentiles are just nonJudeans.What will they do when there time is up because the Bible says the time of the Gentiles ends? It must mean they become Judean correct?
     
  10. jvi

    jvi Member

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    "Where in the Bible does it instruct that Gentiles, or even Christians, are to celebrate these holy days?
    And just how do you get around the fact that the temple no longer exists and without the temple these holy days are only wispers of what they are suposed to be."

    Nobody has to celebrate them.God does not force anyone to do anything.People will just go towards them as they learn truth. I used to be a Nimrod Christian but as I learned the true roots of the holidays I was celebrating and how they relate to Nimrod and Babylon, I also ended up learning about the Feasts God gave us. I chose to switch to the Feasts of God because now I felt I was worshipping God in spirit and in truth. I think as people learn truth they will do the same thing.It just feels better plus they outline god's plan to keep us from manmade religions.
     
  11. jvi

    jvi Member

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    I also believe that is what it means to come out of Babylon and worship God like Revelation tells us to do.
     
  12. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    Wow, there's no end to man's ability to utterly pervert the ways of God.
     
  13. Isabella Lecour

    Isabella Lecour dreaming of paradise

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    That is incorrect as well. You are arbortally choosing a word to use outside of historical context. I know that may mean absolutely nothing to you. Those holidays are American, historicaly speaking.
    Nimrod is a name of a King in the OT. He is not a founder of a religion. To use a different name to describe a religion, other than what those members use, is to just a slang term. As I'm sure you know, in America the word "nimrod" is a slang word that means "stupid."

    To give the benfit of the doubt, none of the holidays listed has anything to do with the Religion of Sumar and Mesopotamia. So again, you are using "Nimrod" very incorrectly.

    No. That's not correct. One can not "just" become Judean. It's a bloodline, a people, a tribal group. Not a religion.

    Isabella
     
  14. Ronald

    Ronald Well-Known Member

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    Le 23:4 ¶ These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.AV (appointed times) (NT cancellation notice?
    Nu 15:29
    Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them. AV (grafted in Believers)
    Ac 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; AV( who are ignorant of the Torah of God)
    Ac 15:21
    For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.AV (Gentiles who come to know the Lord will hear the Torah and no longer be ignorant)

    11 ¶ But you who forsake the LORD, who forget my holy mountain, who set a table for Fortune and fill cups of mixed wine for Destiny; RSV read Tanach (Christmas forbidden)
    4 And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people.AV(Paschah) (KJ wanted to celebrate easter)
    Ge 15:1 ¶ After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward. (the Torah/Jesus came into Abraham)Mt.22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.38 This is the first and great commandment.39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.AV
    Mt 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    Re 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
    Re 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. AV
    A minimum of commentary.
     
  15. jvi

    jvi Member

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    Good stuff Ronald.

    Here is something I wrote in another forum:

    First off, anyone who loves one another is fulfilling the law of God in spirit.A Nimrod Christian can do it, a Nimrod Islam or Nimrod Buddhist can do it, a Nimrod Jew or Nimrod Hinduist or even a pagan witch or an atheist.

    Anyone who loves one another is fulfilling the law of God in spirit.

    But only a Judean Christian who celebrates the Feasts of Yahweh is doing it in spirit AND in truth.

    Now God won´t force anyone to worship him in truth. This is just something that will happen as people realize all their holidays and traditions come from Nimrod Babylon and are manmade and based on lies and are the cause of all the confusion in the world today that starts wars and stuff.

    Sure would be nice if mankind could settle on one set of rules.

    I used to be a Nimrod Christian but as I learned the true roots of the holidays I was celebrating and how they relate to Nimrod and Babylon, I also ended up learning about the Feasts God gave us. I chose to switch to the Feasts of God because now I felt I was worshipping God in spirit and in truth. I think as people learn truth they will do the same thing.It just feels better plus they outline God´s plan to keep us from manmade religions so we don´t run into the chaos we see today.
     
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  16. jvi

    jvi Member

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    A typical delusion that many Christians think is that Jesus came to do away with the law of God. Jesus did away with the traditions of men pharisee law and showed us love fulfills the law. Jesus nailed pharisee traditions of men to the cross not the law.

    The pharisees did not accept Jesus so that is why you see Jews today still in bondage to traditions of men.They have all sorts of wacky traditions that they are in bondage to.
     
  17. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

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    Another typical delusion that many pseudo-Christians think is that Jesus did not completely fulfill the law. Paul called them Judaizers and thought that perhaps that if they emasculated themselves that it would be no "big loss" :D . I am sure that he repented of this, but I can sure see how these people must have vexed him. Can you believe that they are STILL trying to work their way to heaven rather than submitting to God's grace?
     
  18. jvi

    jvi Member

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    Yes Jesus completely fulfilled the law.Now if only people followed his example and celebrated the feasts.
     
  19. jvi

    jvi Member

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    NetDoc what does it mean to you to come out of Babylon?What is Babylon to you?Try to be specific.
     
  20. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Babylon occurs in the Christian New Testament both with a literal and a figurative meaning. Babylon was later the nominal seat of a Latin archbishop, of a Chaldean patriarch and of a Syrian archbishop. But according to the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia: "Babylon" [1], there was probably no Christian community in the actual city of Babylon during the time when the New Testament books were written (roughly, the second half of the first century). There are passing references to the historical Babylon of the Jewish past in Matthew 1:11,12,17 and in Acts 7:43, but these are literary. In 1 Peter 5:13 Babylon is designated as the place from which that Epistle was written, but this has traditionally been interpreted as an example of the figurative sense of "Babylon", as a euphemism for Rome, which will be discussed below. There no reason to believe that any of the events of the New Testament literally transpired in the actual city of Babylon, nor has that been claimed by any significant commentator.

    In the Book of Revelation the destruction of Babylon, a city which seems to be a symbol of every kind of evil, is foretold. The connection with the actual historical city of Babylon is purely metaphorical, as the connection of "Jerusalem" in the poetry of William Blake can bear no relation to the actual history or geography of the city of Jerusalem. Virtually all New Testament scholars believe that "Babylon" is here used as a metaphor or euphemism for the power of the Roman Empire, which was oppressing the nascent church as the Babylonian empire had oppressed the Jewish people in Old Testament times.

    Elsewhere in the Book of Revelation, Babylon is the name of a whore who rules over the kings of the earth and rides upon a seven-headed beast. In one of the Bible's most famous cases of numerology, the beast is assigned the identifying number 666. See also: Whore of Babylon

    Whom or what Babylon refers to in the Book of Revelations has been the subject of much speculation over the centuries:

    • As noted above, the standard scholarly interpretation is that Babylon symbolises Rome and the "Whore of Babylon" therefore either refers to the Roman emperor, or personifies the power of the Roman Empire.
    • Some Protestant commentaries on the Book of Revelation treat the occurrences of the city Babylon in that book as both the City of Rome and the Roman Catholic Church personified in the institution of the papacy.
    • Some have believed, as a variation of the mentioned possibility, Babylon to be all false religion.
    • San Francisco is sometimes called (in varying degrees of seriousness) as "Babylon by the Bay".
    • A modern intepretation is that the Whore of Babylon refers to the institution of multinational corporations. (whore - one whose loyalty can be bought; rules over the kings of the earth - is more powerful than any individual secular government.) While this might be acceptable as an oratorical figure of speech, serious Biblical scholars would regard it as an abuse of an ancient text to suppose that this was the intended meaning of the phrase.
    • See below for the Rastafarian interpretation.
    • Fritz Lang's film Metropolis interpreted Revelation's "Whore of Babylon" as the android Maria.
    • In William Shakespeare's play Henry V, Falstaff's dying words refer to the Whore of Babylon. This is probably a final touch of comic relief in Falstaff's career, since he intends a spiritual or Biblical meaning, while Mistress Quickly takes it to mean a literal prostitute, one he knew and she had not.
    Source:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylon_%28New_Testament%29:)
     
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