Iranian general: Israel stealing Iran's clouds

[Shaul]

Are you sure it was 'clouds' the Israelis were accused of stealing...not 'clowns'?

Oh, you got them. The Israelis are attempting to corner the world market of clowns. I’ll bet you imagine the Jews control the media and world banks too, right?

 

[siti]

So? Nobody ever called Samaria and Judea the “West Bank” until Jordan did it when it, by their own admission, occupied the territory in a deliberate attempt to deny its Jewish connection. It is still Samaria and Judea. Nobody tries to call Jordan the “East Bank”.

No we used to call it Transjordan - which kinda means the seem thing.

 

[siti]

Oh, you got them.

No but they got you it seems!

 

[lukethethird]

It's almost refreshing to hear someone from another country making such ludicrous claims, it's not just us.

 

[Shaul]

No we used to call it Transjordan - which kinda means the seem thing.

You mean Ammon? Transjordan doesn’t mean “East Bank”, it means across the Jordan. The corresponding term used with Transjordan is Cisjordan, not “West Bank”.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

So? Nobody ever called Samaria and Judea the “West Bank” until Jordan did it when it, by their own admission, occupied the territory in a deliberate attempt to deny its Jewish connection. It is still Samaria and Judea. Nobody tries to call Jordan the “East Bank”.

Ah but we can't forget it's okay for Arabs to invade and occupy other peoples' territory. It's only bad when the Jews do it, apparently.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Come to think of it that Iranian General would make a very good congressman.

He could sit next to this guy....

 

[siti]

You mean Ammon? Transjordan doesn’t mean “East Bank”, it means across the Jordan. The corresponding term used with Transjordan is Cisjordan, not “West Bank”.

OK - if we're insisting on semantic pedantics and ancient history according to Jewish legend, Ammon really belongs to the descendants of Lot through his incestuous relationship with his daughter. Transjordan of course literally means "across the Jordan" - i.e. the "other" side of the Jordan from the bit rightfully designated as a home for the Jews by Elohim or YHWH in Jewish mythology as interpreted by some British politicians in the 19th century.

Samaria comes from the name of a Canaanite tribe from whom King Omri bought a hill and was later called Samerina by the Assyrians when they captured it some time before the Babylonia exile (i.e. a very long time ago).

Judea is the anglicized version of the Roman name for a province that included what is now referred to as "Judea and Samaria" (and some other bits).

If you want to call Jordan Ammon, then you should really call Judea "Yehuda" (or even "Yehuda and Binyamin") and Samaria by the names of the other ten tribes. But of course nobody except the Jews has used those names (including Ammon) for the last two and a half millennia.

If you want to go by Roman nomenclature then Judea is OK but Jordan would be either "Nabataea" or "Arabia Petraea" - depending on whether you want to go back to the 4th century BC or the 1st century AD.

All that said, I personally feel there is something to be said for moving the language of politics in that region forward from iron age mythology. Don't you?

 

[Shaul]

OK - if we're insisting on semantic pedantics and ancient history according to Jewish legend, Ammon really belongs to the descendants of Lot through his incestuous relationship with his daughter. Transjordan of course literally means "across the Jordan" - i.e. the "other" side of the Jordan from the bit rightfully designated as a home for the Jews by Elohim or YHWH in Jewish mythology as interpreted by some British politicians in the 19th century.

Samaria comes from the name of a Canaanite tribe from whom King Omri bought a hill and was later called Samerina by the Assyrians when they captured it some time before the Babylonia exile (i.e. a very long time ago).

Judea is the anglicized version of the Roman name for a province that included what is now referred to as "Judea and Samaria" (and some other bits).

If you want to call Jordan Ammon, then you should really call Judea "Yehuda" (or even "Yehuda and Binyamin") and Samaria by the names of the other ten tribes. But of course nobody except the Jews has used those names (including Ammon) for the last two and a half millennia.

If you want to go by Roman nomenclature then Judea is OK but Jordan would be either "Nabataea" or "Arabia Petraea" - depending on whether you want to go back to the 4th century BC or the 1st century AD.

All that said, I personally feel there is something to be said for moving the language of politics in that region forward from iron age mythology. Don't you?

I prefer to call it the name Eretz Yisrael, because that is what it is.

 

[siti]

I prefer to call it the name Eretz Yisrael, because that is what it is.

Maybe - but the people who are claiming it are either naturally or religiously ammei ha'aretzoth (or most likely both). Anyway, I'm not pursuing this any further - political claims based on religious mythology have no place in our world IMO - and that cuts both ways in the middle east. It will never be solved until everyone abandons preposterous religious dogmatism as the basis for 21st century politics - and when they do that, it will solve itself. That's my ha'aretz hamuvtahat - a world in which politics is based on humanistic reason not ancient mythology. But I'm certainly not holding my breath - I reckon in that, I'm a bit like Moshe on Har Nevo - I can see it in the distance but I'll never actually be there.