Interfaith Marriage

[etana4310]

I am in the process of studying to become part of the Jewish family. Currently both myself and my husband are Catholic (he is a convert). I was told that we both would have to convert to Judaism - that in a sense the entire household (which includes six children) would have to keep a Jewish home in order for a conversion to take place.

Is this true?

 

[HiddenDjinn]

I am in the process of studying to become part of the Jewish family. Currently both myself and my husband are Catholic (he is a convert). I was told that we both would have to convert to Judaism - that in a sense the entire household (which includes six children) would have to keep a Jewish home in order for a conversion to take place.

Is this true?

In a word, 'yes'.

 

[Levite]

I am in the process of studying to become part of the Jewish family. Currently both myself and my husband are Catholic (he is a convert). I was told that we both would have to convert to Judaism - that in a sense the entire household (which includes six children) would have to keep a Jewish home in order for a conversion to take place.

Is this true?

If you are converting through the Conservative movement, then your husband would have to convert also: our movement does not permit intermarriage. If the children are of a reasonable age to expect some independence (let's say, teenagers), I would suspect that most Conservative rabbis would not require their conversion, but would still require that you and your husband keep a Jewish home.

Keeping a Jewish home is extremely, extremely important-- it cannot be overstated how much so.

But if the children are younger (let's say, pre-adolescent or younger), I would assume that most Conservative rabbis would require their conversion also.

 

[Dena]

I am sure you could find a Rabbi who would help you but do you really want to do that? I think a marriage between a convert to Judaism and a convert to Catholicism could potentially be a disaster. I'm sorry, that sounds a bit rude doesn't it? I'm trying to be honest with you. This is a very serious decision and like Levite has said, having a Jewish home is extremely important. I can't imagine any Conservative Rabbi would approve of your converting unless your husband is going to convert too. Reform, maybe. Event hen I'd expect your husband has to approve of what you are doing. How does he feel about it?

Judaism and Catholicism are worlds apart. How would you deal with raising the children? Would they be Jewish? Would they be Catholic? How about keeping kosher? Would he be on board too? Kosher food can be more expensive (meat for example) and you'd likely have to buy extra dishes. What about for the children? Would it be a constant battle at dinnertime trying to ensure they keep kosher without his support?

How would Shabbat work in your home? Would he be willing to let you observe or would he continually hound you to do things you aren't comfortable doing? What about the kids? Would he push for soccer games on Saturday? Would he be willing to pay synagogue membership dues which can get a little pricey? Hebrew school for the kids (if any of them converted too)? Any children who convert along with you will need to take off school for religious holidays, will he be okay with that or will he refuse?

Of course, maybe you intended for only you to convert and none of the children. You haven't given us their ages.

I personally think it would be confusing for the children. I do know a Jewish man and a Catholic woman who have a child but she's is raising the little girl Catholic. This is the way it was from birth. Christianity and Judaism don't mix so essentially you have to choose one over the other for the younger kids. That's going to be very difficult if both of you are committed to your particular religion.

The last time you posted you said you were interested in Judaism. Now you say you have started studying to become a Jew. Does this mean you really intend to convert? Have you met with more than one Rabbi? Are you 100% ready to set aside the belief in Jesus as any sort of savior or deity? You definitely do not believe Christianity is valid? Is there any chance your husband would consider conversion? Are you tired of my questions yet?

 

[etana4310]

Dena - I thank you and welcome the questions. I NEED the questions :yes:

I am sure you could find a Rabbi who would help you but do you really want to do that?

No. In a perfect world I would like our entire family to convert. At this point it would take a miracle from G-d to make that happen, but with Him all things are possible and can happen.

I think a marriage between a convert to Judaism and a convert to Catholicism could potentially be a disaster. I'm sorry, that sounds a bit rude doesn't it?

No, it sounds honest and I appreciate the honesty.

I'd expect your husband has to approve of what you are doing. How does he feel about it?

Well......I haven't exactly told him yet. He kind of has a notion because I asked him to listen to Rabbi Singer's lectures of Judaism and Christianity and he has this sense something is amiss. He and I are going on retreat soon and I plan to tell him on retreat. He loves me and has supported everything I have ever wanted to pursue. He is always saying over and over that he only wants to see me happy. We've been married 18 years.

Judaism and Catholicism are worlds apart.

Universes is probably a better word.

How would you deal with raising the children? Would they be Jewish? Would they be Catholic?

It would depend on how G-d moves my husband's soul. I am not certain the children would understand and would be thoroughly confused. My children are 14, 10, 9, 6, 5 and 2.5. I would think the 2.5-6 year olds would not be affected with conversion, but the older three would be utterly devastated, but by an extreme grace of G-d in their life. Again, this would depend on my husband's reaction. If he wants to remain Catholic the children would remain Catholic. I see my husband introducing them to Judaism and what I am learning - educating them on "mommy's faith" - it would be an intregal part of our lives I am sure, especially given that my husband's father is Jewish.

How about keeping kosher? Would he be on board too? Kosher food can be more expensive (meat for example) and you'd likely have to buy extra dishes. What about for the children? Would it be a constant battle at dinnertime trying to ensure they keep kosher without his support?

Okay, you have thrown me on the dishes thing. Why new dishes? I am guessing because our other dishes have been contaminated with non-Kosher food or is it that Jews need a certain type of dishes? I sound so infantile in the ways of Judaism Again, I don't see a battle - we are a closely knit family and have always worked together as a unit.

How would Shabbat work in your home? Would he be willing to let you observe or would he continually hound you to do things you aren't comfortable doing?

This would not be an issue if he does not want to convert. He would be behind me. The kids do not play sports. Our Saturdays are usually boring.

Christianity and Judaism don't mix so essentially you have to choose one over the other for the younger kids. That's going to be very difficult if both of you are committed to your particular religion.

I agree. Again, I firmly believe that G-d has led me here - to Judaism. I can't explain it. I have NO logical explanation for it. In fact when I dropped this bomb shell on my sister just yesterday, she said, "I am not surprised. I, too, have always longed for the Jewish faith." Now mind you, we both have been brought up Catholic then 10 years in a Protestant/Fundamentalist church, so why the two of us would have such longings is very odd. Being in a "conservative" Catholic circle I have burned with anger at the slightest hint of anti-semitism and have been quite vocal to the point where these people who voice negativity towards the Jews look at me like I have five heads. I can't explain that either.

The last time you posted you said you were interested in Judaism. Now you say you have started studying to become a Jew. Does this mean you really intend to convert?

I would like to convert, yes. But if my husband does not want to I don't think I will be able to convert though I will attend Synagogue and follow the Law of the faith.

Have you met with more than one Rabbi?

Not yet. I just recently moved to New England from NJ, which by the way had a HUGE Jewish population. I find here it is VERY scarse I am still looking for a conservative temple. Before I meet with a Rabbi I need to talk to my husband to see where he is with all of this. If he is okay, then I plan on meeting with at least two, if not three Rabbis to see if I can find a fit.

Are you 100% ready to set aside the belief in Jesus as any sort of savior or deity?

I actually thought this was going to be much more difficult than it was. I am taking baby steps with this. Yesterday I took down all the Christmas decorations (I know you are all gagging out there lol) and I pondered when and if it would be the final time of taking them down. We had a bust of J on the shelf and I had to throw it away. I 'had' to just to see if I 'could'. I did. Today, I took off my crucifix, my miraculous medal (medal of Mary) and my brown scapular (it's a catholic thing that goes around your neck). I've worn these for YEARS and years. It just wasn't hard. I had no feeling either way. It HAS to be G-d working in me because even two months ago I would have been afraid of lightening striking me dead had I done any of those things.

You definitely do not believe Christianity is valid?

In my heart I have ALWAYS known that the Jews were the chosen people - G-d's annoited people. After listening to Rabbi Singer explain what happened AFTER J's time on earth - how the new testament was written and how the Hebrew Bible was changed - I just somehow instantly knew. I can only say G-d changed my mind and heart.

Is there any chance your husband would consider conversion?

Let us hope so One can only hope and pray.

Are you tired of my questions yet?

No! Not at all. This is exactly what I need and I thank you!

 

[Levite]

I hope you and Dena don't mind my interjecting my two cents here....

In a perfect world I would like our entire family to convert. ... I am not certain the children would understand and would be thoroughly confused. My children are 14, 10, 9, 6, 5 and 2.5.

Just so you know, with kids that young, I would be very surprised if any Conservative rabbi considered converting you but not them also.

Okay, you have thrown me on the dishes thing. Why new dishes?

Observant Jews must keep two sets of dishes, and two sets of pots and pans: one for meat, and one for dairy. Meat and dairy may not be mixed in the same meal, or cooked in the same vessel, or served on the same plate, or eaten with the same utensils. And kosher dishes and pots become unkosher if non-kosher food is cooked in them or served on them.

All this is, of course, in addition to the extra sets of meat and dairy dishes/pots one needs for Passover, during which time we are prohibited from using dishes or vessels used to make food containing leavening, or to serve food containing leavening.

Jewish households spend a lot of money on dishes and cookware, unfortunately. I've been told by other converts that there should be a warning label about this!

The kids do not play sports. Our Saturdays are usually boring.

Shabbat is not merely about what can't be done, it's about what should be done instead. On Shabbat, we refrain from all melachah (usually translated as "work," but that's a bit deceptive, because the word actually refers to a body of actions many of which would not easily be construed as "work" in the way we understand the term in modern English. But it includes not only things related to employment, but to buying and selling things, to carrying objects outside the house, to baking and cooking) and from anything that disturbs the ruach shabbat ("shabbat spirit," which is an atmosphere of supreme tranquility, peace, togetherness, and enjoyment of the basic pleasures of life with those we love. It should be something measurably different than the atmosphere of even a pleasant and loving household during the rest of the week, and so, for example, it is for that reason even those who believe it is not prohibited to play music or use televisions or other electronic devices on Shabbat will usually refrain from their use, either entirely or mostly). And instead, we eat good meals (prepared before Shabbat), study Torah, sing Shabbat songs, nap, take walks, play games with our children, make love with our spouses, and enjoy other simple pleasures.

In the spirit of honesty, without wishing to be rude or hurtful, I find it very hard to imagine how a household that is not, as a whole, really committed to Shabbat, could produce an atmosphere of ruach shabbat.

I just recently moved to New England from NJ, which by the way had a HUGE Jewish population. I find here it is VERY scarse. I am still looking for a conservative temple. Before I meet with a Rabbi I need to talk to my husband to see where he is with all of this. If he is okay, then I plan on meeting with at least two, if not three Rabbis to see if I can find a fit.

If your talk with your husband goes well, and you decide to move on to talking with a rabbi, let me know where in New England you are. I'm a Conservative rabbi and my wife is a Reform rabbi, and I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that we could find you some quality rabbis to talk to in your general area.

 

[etana4310]

Just so you know, with kids that young, I would be very surprised if any Conservative rabbi considered converting you but not them also.

Meaning all of my children or just the ones under 10?

Thank you for telling me about the dishes, which I am sure over the course of learning I will learn all these things. I am guessing all the dishes must be brand new as well?

Shabbat is not merely about what can't be done, it's about what should be done instead. On Shabbat, we refrain from all melachah (usually translated as "work," but that's a bit deceptive, because the word actually refers to a body of actions many of which would not easily be construed as "work" in the way we understand the term in modern English. But it includes not only things related to employment, but to buying and selling things, to carrying objects outside the house, to baking and cooking) and from anything that disturbs the ruach shabbat ("shabbat spirit," which is an atmosphere of supreme tranquility, peace, togetherness, and enjoyment of the basic pleasures of life with those we love. It should be something measurably different than the atmosphere of even a pleasant and loving household during the rest of the week, and so, for example, it is for that reason even those who believe it is not prohibited to play music or use televisions or other electronic devices on Shabbat will usually refrain from their use, either entirely or mostly). And instead, we eat good meals (prepared before Shabbat), study Torah, sing Shabbat songs, nap, take walks, play games with our children, make love with our spouses, and enjoy other simple pleasures.

This is not unlike what Traditional Catholics do on their day of rest. We are only permitted three hours of work and ONLY if we absolutely have to. If we do more than that, we must confess it as a sin. A day of rest and observing the Lord's day is supposed to be just that. So in a sense we already do these things, only on Sunday. For instance the children are not allowed movies or Wii or computers etc... I can do laundry, but I might not fold them. We can mow the lawn, but only for a half an hour. Another example - we had to mend a fence when we lived on a farm because the horses broke out. It took about four hours when all was said and done. We went to our priest and he just said that there was nothing we could do and that this was okay. It was all in the "intent". Just an aside.

If your talk with your husband goes well, and you decide to move on to talking with a rabbi, let me know where in New England you are. I'm a Conservative rabbi and my wife is a Reform rabbi, and I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that we could find you some quality rabbis to talk to in your general area.

I thank you greatly. Our "talk" is going to happen soon on retreat. I think he has a feeling, but I am not sure he know the depths of my intent to convert. I am preparing to leave for Mass and I actually have some Jewish books in my bag to read while there. Fortunately I have a 2-year old who never sits through service....EVER and we wind up outside anyway, so I will bring good reading to do. G-d is good.

 

[etana4310]

Today, at Mass after the sermon, as usual my 2-year old began to fuss and I had to leave. Since there is nowhere to take her we sit in the van together. I brought a few books with me, one is of particular interest called, "Ordained to be a Jew: A Catholic Priest's Conversion to Judaism," by John David Scalamonti. Almost every single word jumps off the page and smacks me in the face and says, "See, I told you so!"

At any rate - after Mass my children were all in line for confession and I joined them to "confess" to the priest (as it was suggested to me by many Jewish folks here and other places - to "talk to my priest about it"). He was surprisingly gentle and understanding, though greatly puzzled. He is elderly, probably in his 80's. He actually got up and wrote on a piece of paper and handed it to me - it was his email address. Now Traditional Catholic priests do not do this - he wanted me to explain in more detail WHY I was being led in such a direction.

And so, I do that now. He told me to keep praying, "Help thou Lord my unbelief." and said that should set things to right

 

[Levite]

Meaning all of my children or just the ones under 10??

I think all of them. If your oldest was more like 16 or 17, s/he might get a pass, but especially with there being so many other children, and all the other siblings being younger, most rabbis worth their salt would be gravely concerned about the family dynamic being set up by only the eldest child being permitted not to convert.

Such a move just seems likely to set up tension and discord within the household about religion.

I am guessing all the dishes must be brand new as well?

Yes, unfortunately, they must be, unless you can acquire a set of dishes which you personally know for absolute certain has not been used in over one year. Putting dishes or pots away for a year and not using them at all is considered to render them kosher for use.

He told me to keep praying, "Help thou Lord my unbelief." and said that should set things to right

Um....

 

[Rhiamom]

Oh, come on. You can always use paper plates and plastic utensils for Pesach/Passover. I do! There just is not enough room in the average abode for four sets of dishes and pots and pans and flatware.

But this conversion does not sound like a good idea to me. I doubt any Conservative rabbi would perform it unless your husband also converts. Then, the whole family can be converted.

You say your sister and you both feel strongly drawn to Judaism. I would suggest you do a bit of genealogical work - you may already be Jewish and not know it. Anusim are not limited to Hispanics in the Southwest. Proving it can be nearly impossible, though, so I went through conversion.

 

[Deut 13:1]

I am in the process of studying to become part of the Jewish family. Currently both myself and my husband are Catholic (he is a convert). I was told that we both would have to convert to Judaism - that in a sense the entire household (which includes six children) would have to keep a Jewish home in order for a conversion to take place.

Is this true?

I guess my first question is why do you want to be a Jew?

Was your husband Jewish before he converted to Catholicism?

There is a lot involved with being Jewish. Levite does an excellent job discussing some of the challenges many face. My main question is why do you want to be a Jew? It's a lot more work and you can be a perfectly acceptable person without being Jewish.