Inerrancy of the Bible and other Religious Texts

[Fade]

phone numbers change more often than the phone book does./QUOTE]
I'm sorry, Wolf. I've lost my ability to ask a simple question. But I'll keep trying.

If someone asked you to call Joe's Pizza Pavillion down the street, and you didn't know the phone number, would you look it up in a phone book?

If so, can we correctly surmise that if you took THAT number, and dialed THAT number, that you have placed your faith in THAT phone book on THAT particular day?

In other words, would you expect Joe's Pizza Pavillion to answer the number you dialed?

Do you even know what a logical argument is? You are wasting his time with meaningless twitter. He doesn't have to have faith in the phonebook. It is a useful tool. He knows that in all likelyhood the number in the book is correct. The point is if the number turns out to be incorrect his world isn't going to collapse around him. If you have the same kind of faith in the bible that you appear to have in a phonebook then I pity you.

As for the bible - My view is that it is an interesting read. Other than that I think it has absolutely no relevance to modern society. Our world is completely different to the one that existed at the time of its compilation. Its stance on topics as diverse as slavery and womens rights are woefully in direct conflict with the way we live today.

 

[michel]

He doesn't have to have faith in the phonebook.

The whole point about that is that when he needed guidance in the form of which number to use to make the call, he chose the phone book as his authority. You see, faith without works is dead. Then when the phone book "told" him what number to use, he acted on that information without question, and as a result, benefited from it. Try that same thing with the Bible and see what happens.

 

[Fade]

The whole point about that is that when he needed guidance in the form of which number to use to make the call, he chose the phone book as his authority. You see, faith without works is dead. Then when the phone book "told" him what number to use, he acted on that information without question, and as a result, benefited from it. Try that same thing with the Bible and see what happens.

Do you have Gods phone number? At least an up to date one, cos I'd like to give the old fella a call and ask him if the bible is inerrant.
There is absolutely no way to verify anything in the bible. A phone book can be verified simply by calling the number. In this regard I'd say the yellow pages is inerrant. You need faith in the bible because it can't be verified, you don't need faith in the phonebook because it can be verified. Do you understand the difference?

 

[michel]

Do you have Gods phone number? At least an up to date one, cos I'd like to give the old fella a call and ask him if the bible is inerrant.

I sure do, Fade. It's JEREMIAH 333. And the call is free too.

 

[michel]

There is absolutely no way to verify anything in the bible.

Au contrare ... go to it's Author and ask Him yourself ... like I said Jeremiah 333.
Make the call today!

 

[Fade]

I sure do, Fade. It's JEREMIAH 333. And the call is free too.

Mmm, I got some dude in bangladesh trying to sell me an extended warranty for my laughing buddha statue. I guess Gods job has been outsourced. It's a damn shame.

 

[michel]

Mmm, I got some dude in bangladesh trying to sell me an extended warranty for my laughing buddha statue. I guess Gods job has been outsourced. It's a damn shame.

It sure was, Fade! Right again! It was outsourced to His Son. But don't worry, He's knocking at your heart's door right now - (Revelation 3:20). You're not scared to go to the door, are you?

 

[Fade]

It sure was, Fade! Right again! It was outsourced to His Son. But don't worry, He's knocking at your heart's door right now - (Revelation 3:20). You're not scared to go to the door, are you?

If it's those blasted jehovahs witnesses again I may have to get medievil on someones ***.

 

[Fade]

By the way AV, in another thread you mentioned that the old laws no longer applied. Does that mean the 10 commandments don't count anymore?

 

[Fade]

It sure was, Fade! Right again! It was outsourced to His Son. But don't worry, He's knocking at your heart's door right now - (Revelation 3:20). You're not scared to go to the door, are you?

Ah yes, revelations. You mean you believe in this? If you do then yes I would be afraid to go to the door for fear that someone like you might be behind it.

Revelation Highlights

1. John believes "the time is at hand," and that the things that he writes about in Revelation will "shortly come to pass." 1:1, 3
   
2. Jesus has white hair, eyes of fire, feet of brass, and has a sword sticking out of his mouth. 1:13-16
   
3. False Jews are members of "the synagogue of Satan." 2:9, 3:9
   
4. God has seven spirits. 3:1, 5:6
   
5. John has Jesus lie by saying: "Behold, I come quickly." 3:11
   
6. God gave power to someone sitting on a red horse "to take from the earth ... that they should kill one another." 6:4
   
7. God makes some horse-like locusts with human heads, women's hair, lion's teeth, and scorpion's tails. They sting people and hurt them for five months. 9:7-10
   
8. Four angels, with an army of 200 million, killed a third of the earth's population. 9:15-19
   
9. An angel tells John to eat a book. He does, and it tastes good, but it makes his belly bitter. 10:10
   
10. God will send an earthquake that will kill 7000 people. 11:13
    
11. " And there was a war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon." So even in heaven, one can't be safe from war or dragons. 12:7
    
12. Only 144,00 celibate men will be saved. (Those who were not "defiled with women.") 14:3-4
    
13. Those who receive the mark of the beast will "drink of the wine of the wrath of God ... and shall be tormented with fire and brimstone ... and the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever." 14:10-11
    
14. "The great winepress of the wrath of God ... was trodden ... and the blood cam out of the winepress, even unto the horses bridles." 14:19
    
15. The seven vials of wrath: 1) sores, 2) sea turned to blood, 3) rivers turned to blood, 4) people scorched with fire, 5) people gnaw their tongues in pain, 6) Euphrates dries up, 7) thunder, lightening, earthquake, and hail. 16:1-21
    
16. The great harlot is described as being "full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication." She has a rather large and prominent sign on her forehead, will be made "desolate and naked," and her flesh will be eaten and burned with fire. 17:1-16
    
17. Jesus, whose clothes are dipped in blood, has a sharp sword sticking out of his mouth. Thus attired, he treads the winepress of the wrath of God. 19:13-15
    
18. An angel calls all the fowls to feast upon dead human bodies, or as the angel calls it "the supper of the great God." (Angel food?) 19:17-18
    
19. The beast and the false prophet are cast alive into a lake of fire. The rest were killed with the sword of Jesus. "And all the fowls were filled with their flesh." 19:20-21
    
20. When the thousand years are over, God will send Satan to deceive us all. 20:7-8
    
21. God will send fire from heaven to devour people. 20:9-10
    
22. Whoever isn't found listed in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire. 20:15
    
23. Those who are fearful or unbelieving will be cast into "the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." 21:8
    
24. John quotes Jesus (1900 years ago) as saying he will come "quickly." 22:7, 12, 20
    
25. Anyone who adds to the words in Revelation (or to the rest of the Bible) will be struck with plagues, and anyone that tries to remove anything from it will have his name removed from the book of life. 22:18-19

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

To recap; in post#2, I said Quote "Yes, part of religion is Faith - which is what it says - accepting the package on trust. The only thing we can do for God to prove that we love him, is to accept him on trust - that is why he doesn't come around proving to people he exists - that would be too easy for us, if you see what I mean."

To which you replied in post #6 Quote "You clearly have not thought out the contradiction inherent in needing to provide proof to an omniscient God. :biglaugh:

My post #7 to you read quote"Maybe proof is a wrong word - we are being asked to place our entire trust - body and soul in God's hands; we will not get any sign from him while we are choosing whether to do this or not..........is that less funny?"

To which you replied post#8 quote "Yes, thanks. You moved it from the category of absurdly funny to sadly pathetic. How very primitive and anthropomorphic your God turns out to be. So much like the primitive Chieftain demanding loyalty from his tribe. It's almost as if a primitive people made him in their image."

< --- snip --- >

I understand that I said that you had called me 'pathetic', whereas in reality I think I can now see that it was my belief which you see as 'pathetic' ...

No, I did not call your belief "pathetic". I called an omnipotent and omniscient God who demands "entire trust - body and soul" sadly pathetic and primitive. Do you make such demands upon your children?

... I therefore withdraw my accusation, and therefore retract the distortion as a result of my post.

Thank you.

 

[Sunstone]

**MOD POST**

Let's get back to the topic of the thread: The inerrancy of the bible and other religious texts.

 

[Fade]

Does the bible state that it is inerrant?

 

[Sunstone]

Does the bible state that it is inerrant?

To my knowledge, it doesn't.

 

[Scuba Pete]

The Bible cleary states that it is "inspired". Inerrancy has been added by man as far as I can tell.

But God continually works through what is imperfect so that the glory is his alone. It is the Spirit that gives meaning to the Scriptures for us. If you can't see the wisdom in it, it's not the Bible's fault.

 

[michel]

No, I did not call your belief "pathetic". I called an omnipotent and omniscient God who demands "entire trust - body and soul" sadly pathetic and primitive. Do you make such demands upon your children?
Thank you.

However you care to define God is up to you, but I think to describe the God that many of the members here believe in as sadly pathetic and primitive is a little tactless; but of course you have a perfect right to your opinion.

As to would I make such demands upon my children, the answer is "No" - because I am not God.

Thank you for accepting the apology, which I need to reiterate, because once again, I had misinterpreted your post.

 

[Fade]

The Bible cleary states that it is "inspired". Inerrancy has been added by man as far as I can tell.

But God continually works through what is imperfect so that the glory is his alone. It is the Spirit that gives meaning to the Scriptures for us. If you can't see the wisdom in it, it's not the Bible's fault.

Well that settles it for me then.

I'm going to take a swing at some circular logic here, bear with me...

If the bible is the inerrant word of God (presumably the only object in the world that can claim this status) and the Bible itself doesn't state that it is inerrant. And no other inerrant document exists to make the claim then by definition the bible cannot be inerrant. Because only someone/something that isn't inerrant has made the claim.

Does that make sense?

 

[Scuba Pete]

Who's on first?

But really, who are you suggesting is making this claim of innerancy?

 

[Melody]

Does that mean that the Bible makes mistakes on some things?

Ceridwen,
I'm still studying and praying on this issue, but I'm seeing less that the Bible makes mistakes than that man interprets it with his own political agenda (consciously or subconsciously)...hence all the denominations and the wide range of beliefs within a denomination.

For example, some would interpret (can't resist, Katzpur ) the few mentions of tithing in the Bible to mean that we are required to tithe 10% of our income while others do not.

 

[Fade]

Who's on first?

But really, who are you suggesting is making this claim of innerancy?

Anyone who claims that the bible is inerant? I thought thats what this thread was about?