If Christianity is the truth then Judaism is also the truth

[Pilgrim Soldier]

Hm... well in my 34 years I've done stuff like factory work and construction all my life.. So I come from a world of hard work.. I never found those things you mentioned to signal an absence of the grit you need to get high up the ladders.. I mean I don't know what you've done in your life, but it kinda sounds like we're coming from two different worlds here bud

I run a small auto service and repair workshop, I wouldn't employ certain types of people as I rely on our reputation as decent and honest people.
Most of our customers are family oriented hard working people, I'm sure they wouldn't be comfortable with having freaks working on their cars. I'm not legally allowed to discriminate when choosing a worker, based on their sexual preference or their appearance but I don't respect the law when it tries to impose their views on me.

It's like the movie 1984, where they punish people for having the wrong thoughts. The law can never stop people from hating each other or discriminating

 

[amorphous_constellation]

I run a small auto service and repair workshop, I wouldn't employ certain types of people as I rely on our reputation as decent and honest people.
Most of our customers are family oriented hard working people, I'm sure they wouldn't be comfortable with having freaks working on their cars. I'm not legally allowed to discriminate when choosing a worker, based on their sexual preference or their appearance but I don't respect the law when it tries to impose their views on me.

It's like the movie 1984, where they punish people for having the wrong thoughts. The law can never stop people from hating each other or discriminating

well you're more blemishlessly clean then, then all the conservative press mechanics I work with. (though there are liberals like me as well) Like by the end of the day, we're covered in oil and dirt. I work with biker types that have skull tattoos and have three foot long beards

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

well you're more blemishlessly clean then, then all the conservative press mechanics I work with. (though there are liberals like me as well) Like by the end of the day, we're covered in oil and dirt. I work with biker types that have skull tattoos and have three foot long beards

We wouldn't tolerate any abominations in our shop, we just sacked a Muslim guy who returned from his holiday break with a long beard. I asked him to cut it shorter or he would lose his job and he chose to leave.

I don't understand why anybody would chose to vandalise and mutilate their bodies, with piercings and tattoos. The only possible motivation for that sort of thing, must be rebellion towards God and a sign of Satan worship. Those kinds of people make me sick

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Most of our customers are family oriented hard working people, I'm sure they wouldn't be comfortable with having freaks working on their cars.

People who have tats, long beards, piercings, etc. are not "freaks." They simply have a different culture than you. Do you know that there are people in the world that think Americans are bizarre and backwards because we only use toilet paper? It's called ethnocentrism.

I understand that you may need to set certain limits on appearances for the sake of attracting customers, like no tats can be seen outside of the uniform they wear, piercings have to be removed, beards must be trim, etc. That's being business-practical.

But calling them freaks? That's just bigotry (especially class bigotry, since these things are quite common in the working class).

BTW, just so you know, not every middle class person is a bigot. I was raised middle class and I don't care if the person working on my car looks like a Hessian. I only care if he's an expert in auto mechanics! If the owner of a shop said to me, "I know he looks kind of wild, but I tell you, he's the best out there," that guy would be the one I'd want. In fact, half of the time, the work on my car is done by the guy who lives in the front house, who has a long beard and tats, but is gifted with anything requiring a screw driver.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

People who have tats, long beards, piercings, etc. are not "freaks." They simply have a different culture than you. Do you know that there are people in the world that think Americans are bizarre and backwards because we only use toilet paper? It's called ethnocentrism.

I understand that you may need to set certain limits on appearances for the sake of attracting customers, like no tats can be seen outside of the uniform they wear, piercings have to be removed, beards must be trim, etc. That's being business-practical.

But calling them freaks? That's just bigotry (especially class bigotry, since these things are quite common in the working class).

I'm expressing my view as a Christian, our God strictly forbids cutting and self mutilation. These things were done by the Pagans, even modern western society started piercing the left ear of ******* children to identify them as ********.
We see people who pierce themselves and tattoo themselves as vandals and rebels, since their body is the property of God, it's not their body to vandalise. We punish teenagers for spraying graffiti on private property, so I believe we should punish those who vandalise God's property.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I'm expressing my view as a Christian, our God strictly forbids cutting and self mutilation. These things were done by the Pagans, even modern western society started piercing the left ear of ******* children to identify them as ********.
We see people who pierce themselves and tattoo themselves as vandals and rebels, since their body is the property of God, it's not their body to vandalise. We punish teenagers for spraying graffiti on private property, so I believe we should punish those who vandalise God's property.

God forbids these things to the People of Israel (not non-Jews), just as he forbids such things as mixing linen and wool in garments, or having sex during a woman's menstrual period, or the eating of unclean meats. Do you keep all of the 613 laws? I don't think you aspire to it, so why do you choose this one particular law to follow? You are picking and choosing only because it is traditional for your culture and class.

Again, by saying those who tat and pierce and wear long bears are nothing more than vandals and rebels simply shows your bigotry.... classism and ethnocentrism to be exact.

 

[Spirit of Light]

We wouldn't tolerate any abominations in our shop, we just sacked a Muslim guy who returned from his holiday break with a long beard. I asked him to cut it shorter or he would lose his job and he chose to leave.

I don't understand why anybody would chose to vandalise and mutilate their bodies, with piercings and tattoos. The only possible motivation for that sort of thing, must be rebellion towards God and a sign of Satan worship. Those kinds of people make me sick

Growing a beard is mandatory for muslim men. It is according to Islamic teaching. So fire him for following His religion is wrong.
Would you accept if someone fire you because you are Christian?

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

God forbids these things to the People of Israel (not non-Jews), just as he forbids such things as mixing linen and wool in garments, or having sex during a woman's menstrual period, or the eating of unclean meats. Do you keep all of the 613 laws? I don't think you aspire to it, so why do you choose this one particular law to follow? You are picking and choosing only because it is traditional for your culture and class.

Again, by saying those who tat and pierce and wear long bears are nothing more than vandals and rebels simply shows your bigotry.... classism and ethnocentrism to be exact.

God has only one set of commandments for the Jews and Gentiles, the old temple worship was abolished by Jesus forever and it will never be returned.
So now there are no more Jews and Gentiles, God's people are One. Jesus fulfilled all the requirements of the law on our behalf so we don't need to keep the ceremonial law any more.
The new temple is the Lord Jesus Christ who is Jehovah God Himself, and all of Gods children are in him. We are members of His body.
All of those Jews who reject the Messiah, are lost, they will join all the other unbelievers in hell.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

Growing a beard is mandatory for muslim men. It is according to Islamic teaching. So fire him for following His religion is wrong.
Would you accept if someone fire you because you are Christian?

Growing that kind of beard, may be acceptable in an Islamic country but it's not acceptable ina Christian country.
I could never understand why Muslims are so desperate to run away from Islamic countries, they are willing to die at sea or in the back of semi trailers to escape Islam and join the free world.
Islam is forced upon people, nobody would ever choose to became a Muslim unless they were threatened with beheading.
Christianity is the opposite, people choose to join freely, thye even risk death by their Muslim families to become a Christian. so you can see a big difference, one is like a Mafia organisation which uses the threat of death to force you to join and they use the threat of death to keep you hostage in it. While people are willing to risk death to become a Christian.
The evidence shows Islam in a very bad light, it's supposed to be a religion of peace but it's history is soaked in blood and hatred.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

God has only one set of commandments for the Jews and Gentiles

I couldn't disagree more. When you read the Torah, it says, "And God said to Moses, Speak to the Children of Israel..." Not to the world.

 

[Inquire of God]

If Christianity is the truth then Judaism is also the truth, Why? Because Judaism is the original, first Abrahamic religion. Without Judaism, Christianity would never have existed.

This also applies to Islam and the Baha'i. Without Judaism, the two religions would not have existed. Therefore, Judaism is definitely the truth

What do you think about that?

I like that and I think it is something that is uniting rather than dividing.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

I couldn't disagree more. When you read the Torah, it says, "And God said to Moses, Speak to the Children of Israel..." Not to the world.

This is where we differ, you believe God stopped speaking with us in the book of Malachi and I believe it was with the apostle John on the isle of Patmos many years later.
You're still waiting for your Messiah but mine came 2000 years ago, and proclaimed that there is no more Jew or Gentile

I couldn't disagree more. When you read the Torah, it says, "And God said to Moses, Speak to the Children of Israel..." Not to the world.

The Messiah came to save Jews and Gentiles alike, so now there's no more Jews and Gentiles. All of God's children are equally wicked, we all sin.

You can keep every one of the 613 laws but God will still punish you if your heart isn't perfectly clean and your motives for keeping the law are just to earn God's favour and not for His glory alone.

Don't forget, hell will be populated by Jews and Gentiles alike and so will heaven.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

This is where we differ, you believe God stopped speaking with us in the book of Malachi and I believe it was with the apostle John on the isle of Patmos many years later.

This is just a sidebar, but our Tanakh places the Prophets before the Writings. It ends not with Malachi, but with Chronicles. It ends with the Jews triumphantly returning to the Land to rebuild the Temple.

You're still waiting for your Messiah but mine came 2000 years ago, and proclaimed that there is no more Jew or Gentile

Actually you are still waiting for Jesus' return, since he hasn't fulfilled all the prophecies.

The Messiah came to save Jews and Gentiles alike, so now there's no more Jews and Gentiles. All of God's children are equally wicked, we all sin.

It is not the job of the Messiah to save anyone from their sins.

You can keep every one of the 613 laws but God will still punish you if your heart isn't perfectly clean and your motives for keeping the law are just to earn God's favour and not for His glory alone.

Is your heart perfectly clean? Are your motives always perfectly pure? Of course not. Dont think you are any better.

Don't forget, hell will be populated by Jews and Gentiles alike and so will heaven.

Jews have a different view of the afterlife, one with gehenna, a temporary hell, and the world to come, where we live with physical resurrected bodies.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

This is just a sidebar, but our Tanakh places the Prophets before the Writings. It ends not with Malachi, but with Chronicles. It ends with the Jews triumphantly returning to the Land to rebuild the Temple.

Actually you are still waiting for Jesus' return, since he hasn't fulfilled all the prophecies.


It is not the job of the Messiah to save anyone from their sins.


Is your heart perfectly clean? Are your motives always perfectly pure? Of course not. Dont think you are any better.

Jews have a different view of the afterlife, one with gehenna, a temporary hell, and the world to come, where we live with physical resurrected bodies.

 

[Pilgrim Soldier]

This is just a sidebar, but our Tanakh places the Prophets before the Writings. It ends not with Malachi, but with Chronicles. It ends with the Jews triumphantly returning to the Land to rebuild the Temple.

Actually you are still waiting for Jesus' return, since he hasn't fulfilled all the prophecies.


It is not the job of the Messiah to save anyone from their sins.


Is your heart perfectly clean? Are your motives always perfectly pure? Of course not. Dont think you are any better.

Jews have a different view of the afterlife, one with gehenna, a temporary hell, and the world to come, where we live with physical resurrected bodies.

There will never be Temple worship again, Jesus put an end to that forever. Jesus is the Temple now and we are the Israel of God. Jesus predicted the destruction of the Temple and it happened exactly as predicted, He never said it would be rebuilt .

Jesus will return and full fill His promises, He will return as a Man of war and destroy the enemies of God, this means all the rulers of the world will be destroyed and He will set up His everlasting Kingdom and His people will rule the world forever.

It is the absolute job of the Messiah to save His people from the penalty of their sins, as there is no other way for anyone to be saved. He is the One and Only way to be saved.

My heart is just as dark and dirty as every other human's heart in the history of mankind. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. Nobody can ever be saved by trying to keep the law, the law was given to show us that it's impossible to keep. This pints us to the saviour.

We have a similar view of the afterlife, we believe everyone goes to Sheol which is a holding place before everyone is reunited with their bodies then they go to heaven or the lake of fire (hell)

 

[Flankerl]

I love. At first you try to put Jews and Christians into the same camp against the vile Muslims and then slowly but steadily you yourself demask yourself by stating how we aren't alike at all.

Christians are so fun if you aren't around them and can close the browser tab at any time.

 

[Muffled]

If Christianity is the truth then Judaism is also the truth, Why? Because Judaism is the original, first Abrahamic religion. Without Judaism, Christianity would never have existed.

This also applies to Islam and the Baha'i. Without Judaism, the two religions would not have existed. Therefore, Judaism is definitely the truth

What do you think about that?

I believe Judaism today does not follow the original teachings any more than Christianity does. Each religion must defend its own beliefs.

 

[Muffled]

I don't think Christianity was ever intended to become a religion.

Jesus was Jew, and he remained a Jew until he died. And Jews then and now do not believe that anyone else needs to become a Jew to be aright with God. So Jesus was not preaching adherence to any religion, except as a Jew preaching to his fellow Jews. To the rest of us he was simply preaching a spiritual revelation. Modern day Christians who think they are supposed to adhere to Old Testament religiosity because "Jesus said so" are very confused, and I think, quite wrong. They are imposing religiosity where Jesus had no intention of imposing it.

Christianity was simply a spiritual revelation that was applicable to Jews, non-Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, atheists, and whomever else with "ears to hear". It was not intended, by Jesus, to become a religion of it's own.

I believe Jesus tells us how to worship; that is a function of religion.
John 4:23 But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.

 

[Muffled]

In Judaism, Jesus is a convicted criminal (however the Pilat has announced, that Jesus is
completely innocent).

I believe I have never heard a Jew say that. What is your source?

 

[IndigoChild5559]

There will never be Temple worship again, Jesus put an end to that forever. Jesus is the Temple now and we are the Israel of God. Jesus predicted the destruction of the Temple and it happened exactly as predicted, He never said it would be rebuilt .

Boy are you in for a big surprise.

Hmm replacement theology. Kind of strange considering the Genesis states that the covenant for us is "everlasting."

It is the absolute job of the Messiah to save His people from the penalty of their sins, as there is no other way for anyone to be saved. He is the One and Only way to be saved.

Nope. Sorry, not mentioned in the Tanakh (OT).

My heart is just as dark and dirty as every other human's heart in the history of mankind. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. Nobody can ever be saved by trying to keep the law, the law was given to show us that it's impossible to keep. This pints us to the saviour.

Standard evangelical testimony. You guys really follow the formula.

The thing is, not everyone has a black heart or is in spiritual need. I already have God, who already forgives and helps me. God is my savior, I need no other.