I used to attend what many refer to today as church, but

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That's funny, <sarcasm> oh tons you wouldn't believe it, too much work, its so tiring. Please tell me you believe me, please (laughing big time) <sarcasm> Your allowed to believe what and how you want to but as for me I have NO DOUBT there is a God. I don't even want to use the words "no doubt" its beyond that, but "ME" you want ME to try and convince you about God or of Him. He's not stupid, He's a big boy He can do that on His own. You will laugh at this more than likely, but He knows more about you, than you about, you. That may sound foolish or stupid to you, I wouldn't be surprised if so.

I wouldn't call it foolish or stupid necessarily, but like I've been saying all along: I think it's putting the cart before the horse to invent characteristics of a god when we haven't even established that the god exists at all.

Edit: I get that you have no doubt that God exists. Understand that I see no particular reason to assume that your lack of doubt is justified.

 

[GodInUs]

so anything that is beyond the human mind is something that no human being believes in.

As you said earlier that you don't have much use of dividing the world into the natural and the supernatural. So I wouldn't expect you understand or see what I'm saying. What I believe is not only grasped with the human mind, maybe even a small percentage, maybe. It's much deeper than that, it's natural as humans to use our minds and so we should in natural matters but when it comes to the spiritual. Well let's see the "spiritual" alone what's in it, spirit. I can't give you a time in the natural that I've ever seen a spirit before, you? In the supernatural, I have sensed things, and know them, but not on my own ability though. See the Holy Spirit lives inside of me, if your not a believer in Christ, He's not in you, He's Spirit. There are things that I wouldn't expect you to understand or see the same way I do. Hence, "GodInUs" now this may all sound foolish and nonsense too you, I wouldn't be surprised. It's suppose to, I have the Spirit living in me, you don't. I don't mean to sound like I'm better than you, that's not what I'm trying to convey here. It's just that I will see things, certain things, such as spiritual, we wouldn't see eye to eye or necessarily agree with such things. I mean I can see where your coming from with saying some of the stuff you say.

 

[GodInUs]

If you've defined your God in a way that you have no way to justify your belief that it exists, then, well, you have no way to justify your belief.

You stated I had no way to justify my belief, I thought you were expecting justification of God, sorry.

 

[GodInUs]

Maybe I wasn't clear enough. I mean that if someone else calls something "supernatural" and they give good reasons to believe that the thing exists, I'll agree that it exists; I just won't call it "supernatural."


What way do you have to know about a thing - like reliably be able to tell whether it's true - that doesn't involve your "natural abilities?"

Are you a deep person, an intellectual, your a thinker? I'm like that myself, a bit too much at times. I'm not saying this is you but for me its been difficult for me to try and get to know God at times because I'm always in my own head, thinking and always trying to figure things out. Now with God, FORGET IT (chuckling) I can't imagine the MAAAAANY times I've tried to put my own mind/intellect in trying to figure God out. It's not going to happen. That's why I was saying earlier in trying to learn for myself to STOP!! and just Be STILL slow down and listen. Now you or anyone could say, "Oh you just imagine things!" No, not at all because imagining things comes through my own natural ability. There's that word again, natural. God is beyond me, well of course He would be though, He's God, He wouldn't be literally GOD if I as a human could figure Him out on my own. I wouldn't need Him, He would be no used to me, but what He has to offer is beyond me, beyond my own human reasoning or mind.

 

[GodInUs]

to invent characteristics of a god

What did you mean by this?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

What did you mean by this?

I mean that based on what you've said, knowledge of God is beyond human reach, so when you say things about God (e.g. "He knows more about you, than you about, you"), I have to assume that you've made it up... or that you're repeating something that someone else made up.

 

[GodInUs]

I mean that based on what you've said, knowledge of God is beyond human reach, so when you say things about God (e.g. "He knows more about you, than you about, you"), I have to assume that you've made it up... or that you're repeating something that someone else made up.

Well I wouldn't say it's beyond human reach, but it is beyond me, I'm not able to reach God on my own terms. As if it's going to be in my doing, my timing and this is going to happen like this and that like this, like I'm in control and not God, nope, He's God, I'm not. Yes, indeed He does know more about me, than I know about myself. I see this through the many many times in how I have talked with Him and what He does and how He does it all. I look back over time and sometimes I haven't gotten what I wanted when I asked and I can see why now and there's A LOT of things that He does in my spirit He enables me to see things differently at times. Now people could say, "Oh this is all you, the human body and mind does things that we can't understand or your just imagining or working things up to make yourself believe certain things to make yourself think that it was God when it wasn't." Oh believe me, like I've told you just a second ago, I'M A THINKER, deep sometimes and analytical, God is beyond me or my comprehension of my life and I've seen him work things out beyond what I could ever think or do. Those things He's done, at times it's nothing I've done.

 

[2ndpillar]

The church of God is wherever you are.
You don't have to see it to believe it
it's just there
-

Apparently that can also be said for the temple of "Satan" (Revelation 3:9).

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Well I wouldn't say it's beyond human reach, but it is beyond me, I'm not able to reach God on my own terms.

You kinda did say that it's beyond human reach:

God is not someone man can know God with his natural mind/brain.

Regardless, even if it's only beyond you... you're the one making the claims about God.

As if it's going to be in my doing, my timing and this is going to happen like this and that like this, like I'm in control and not God, nope, He's God, I'm not. Yes, indeed He does know more about me, than I know about myself.

How do you know that?

I see this through the many many times in how I have talked with Him and what He does and how He does it all.

But if you didn't learn this "with your natural mind/brain," how do you know that this is true?

I look back over time and sometimes I haven't gotten what I wanted when I asked and I can see why now and there's A LOT of things that He does in my spirit He enables me to see things differently at times. Now people could say, "Oh this is all you, the human body and mind does things that we can't understand or your just imagining or working things up to make yourself believe certain things to make yourself think that it was God when it wasn't." Oh believe me, like I've told you just a second ago, I'M A THINKER, deep sometimes and analytical, God is beyond me or my comprehension of my life and I've seen him work things out beyond what I could ever think or do. Those things He's done, at times it's nothing I've done.

When you say "God is beyond me or my comprehension," you're telling me that absolutely everything else you tell me about God is made up.

 

[GodInUs]

You kinda did say that it's beyond human reach

I'm not able to reach God in my own effort or ability, I can change my will to receive Him as the Savior of my life but to get to know Him comes only through having faith in Him and that's through Him. If that makes sense, its difficult to try explain this here, that is if I'm understanding where your coming from.

 

[GodInUs]

How do you know that?

I explained it already there

 

[GodInUs]

But if you didn't learn this "with your natural mind/brain," how do you know that this is true?

It's like when I was trying to explain to you about "spiritual" things

 

[GodInUs]

When you say "God is beyond me or my comprehension," you're telling me that absolutely everything else you tell me about God is made up.

If that's how your understanding it all, then run with that then. I'm not sure what else I could say to help you see what I have or trying to say to help you understand.

 

[GodInUs]

When you say "God is beyond me or my comprehension," you're telling me that absolutely everything else you tell me about God is made up.

Just keep in mind here, I'm not trying to win you over here to my way of thinking or to believe like me either. I'm trying to answer your questions but like I've already said, there will be most definitely some or more maybe things we won't see eye to eye on here or not even understand fully either.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I explained it already there

Not in any way that I can recognize.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

If that's how your understanding it all, then run with that then. I'm not sure what else I could say to help you see what I have or trying to say to help you understand.

I'm not sure either, but do you see where I'm coming from? It seems like you're contradicting yourself:

"This thing is completely incomprehensible, but we comprehend it well enough that we can know a laundry list of stuff about this thing."

 

[GodInUs]

I'm not sure either, but do you see where I'm coming from? It seems like you're contradicting yourself:

"This thing is completely incomprehensible, but we comprehend it well enough that we can know a laundry list of stuff about this thing."

If that's what your getting from it, o.k., so be it

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

If that's what your getting from it, o.k., so be it

Isn't it what you were trying to say? I'm not out to misrepresent you. If I'm not understanding you properly, please tell me where I went wrong.

 

[GodInUs]

Isn't it what you were trying to say? I'm not out to misrepresent you. If I'm not understanding you properly, please tell me where I went wrong.

What are you trying to get at mainly, what is it you really don't understand? If it's already something you said, sorry, can't help you anymore with it.

 

[VoidCat]

thanks!