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I don't support feminist movements

People are scared of mental illness. If you know how to handle it, know what you may be in for, and accept the person as they are, you can have good relationships with someone with BPD, or any disorder. I've often heard complaints about how people should not date those with Asperger's, because apparently we're selfish, incapable of caring, and will leave lovers feeling unsatisfied and unfulfilled in their relationship. And just like with much of what you hear about BPD, it's based on ignorance and quite painful to hear people saying you are not worthy of love, friends, or companionship.
And consider this. You have apriori knowledge of BPD. You know what people have told you. I know by interacting with people who have it. Just like I know from first-hand dealings that those with schizophrenia are not overtly and explicitly dangerous people despite "common knowledge" of everyone with their stories of someone with schizophrenia.

We haven't and we can't possibly deal with all the variations that fall under this category or any of these categories, but its just that BPD is a disorder that has as one of its symptoms or manifestations a tendency towards volatile reactions which can traumatize and frighten people and leave them feeling unsafe or unsettled frequently (it might be that Asperger's people are somehow a good match with BPD people if the Asperger's person doesn't have a neuro-typical as they say reaction to the BPD person going ballistic suddenly. It isn't all knowledge based on just what people have told me, I've first hand dealt with people with BPD or who claim to have it, and even if they are ok with me sometimes, I've seen the ballistic type outbursts and things with people of different ages, and I can totally understand where the stigma and fear might come from sometimes. Sure, they deserve a chance like everyone else, even schizophrenics, bi-polar, psychopaths might deserve chances, they all have stigma surrounding them, and it isn't always just for no reason though, its because of not only the stories and real life cases, but sometimes its from actually dealing with them and the struggles and difficulties involved, and its not for everyone. I seek out people with issues in order to talk to them and learn everything I can about them, but it hasn't left me with the opinion that a person who is perfectly healthy and has not experiences the extreme distress sometimes involved with these sorts of cases should eagerly pursue them, its real and its serious and it can't be taken lightly and there is even some threat to personal mental health and wellbeing overall by being immersed in difficult and unusual sorts of situations or situations which can turn volatile or people who are very difficult to reason with or provide therapies for even. BPD is particularly known for hostility and I've seen it also in volatile relationships people have had or with their parents who seem to have it and have made life a living hell for some kids and teenagers (I'm dealing with one person who has a Dad who was even diagnosed with it, and he was yelling at her on the phone for no apparent reason just the other day simply because she said that someday she might like to travel the world, a very typical sort of thing to say, and they went nuts because of perceived abandonment or something and said all sorts of abusive things).

So people who want an easy going experience and life, should be aware of these possibilities and conditions, and it might also be alright if people who don't think they can handle something like this or a life-long issue that doesn't even have medication for it, should maybe be a little wary of since it can take a lot out of a person, same with dealing the much maligned Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Psychopathy, Sociopathy, Anti-Social Personality Disorders and whatever else people tag some of the more feared mental issues and mental illnesses.

If you are a person with Asperger's that can meet the general psychological needs in a normal emotional relationship, then there should be no problem, but if its the case that a person may actually feel like they are not having their normal emotional needs met, they should know fully what they might be getting into as early as possible, I think that is probably the most fair, even if it seems to put the person with the disability or less common issues at a slight disadvantage or cause a person to seek something else which might not cause them a lot of emotional and psychological pain as well. Normal people have a lot of demands and are very sensitive too, so they are not immune to the outbursts of BPD people or the difficulties dealing with their loved ones going through Psychosis or Depression, and it really becomes a big ordeal in many of the stories I've been told by both the people who have these things and those dealing with them.

So a lot of the bad reputation that certain groups get may be also due to members who are taking on representing them but may also have certain issues which make them very unpleasant seeming or difficult to deal with due to mental illness. Its sad and unfair that its stigmatized but its also not entirely for no reason at all that people have had bad experiences that have led to their sometimes avoiding people with mental illnesses or expecting bad things from them, sometimes based on experiences or stories of experiences from people they know claiming direct contact or trusted figures who have some very negative stories to tell at times about certain people with mental illnesses they encountered or dealt with. My mother is a doctor, my sister is a therapist, and I personally have always had an interest finding out everything I can from people also, and there are genuinely a lot of negative tales being told from those dealing with people with mental illnesses and the people with mental illnesses themselves. If everything was perfectly hunky dory, these wouldn't even be considered disorders, abnormal behavioral problems, or illnesses of any sort or handicaps, but they can be pretty serious and terrible, hopefully your Asperger's is on the light side and doesn't cause too many major problems for you, but there are people with Asperger's that is very severe (and have been shown in documentaries as well), and its clear how those sorts of levels of Asperger's can surely be a huge difficulty for people who aren't well prepared to deal with it. I've also seen and heard of all the difficulties parents have when they unexpectedly end up having a child with Autism or special needs and major disabilities to their functioning or cooperativeness and abilities, and it drives some parents really crazy or makes them somewhat unhinged sometimes overtime due to the stresses involved, and they can't really even help it since they are the parents and aren't really as free to just avoid it or leave (but sometimes they even sort of do, but not usually as far as I've heard, usually at least one stays and is most involved).

So anyway, its very possible that at least some of the attacks on both men and women and accusations and stories may come possibly from people with issues or mental illnesses, but I think in the case of MeToo a lot of the very famous cases were probably true, especially the ones with lots of victims and which led to criminal convictions, and it was hard to face the truth (and I think the rapists are not normal people themselves, but are still doing criminal and bad things or have a lack of impulse control which isn't really excusable) when they are beloved figures like Bill Cosby for example who was convicted as a serial rapist who drugged people and had sex with them while they were incapacitated.
 
And, of course, you can't assume a person with a mental illness or other condition all present their symptoms the same, or even in a similar manner.

I have two sons with autism, and they are nothing alike. The way it manifests in them is entirely different.

I'd like to hear more about this if you make a thread about it possibly and can put in religion somehow also or how its taught to varying people with Autism for example, but what I'm really interested in is these hugely different manifestations you mentioned.
 

JustGeorge

Not As Much Fun As I Look
Staff member
Premium Member
I'd like to hear more about this if you make a thread about it possibly and can put in religion somehow also or how its taught to varying people with Autism for example, but what I'm really interested in is these hugely different manifestations you mentioned.

I'm not really comfortable making a thread with the purpose of discussing my kids' behaviors, but if you'd like to talk about it, you may send me a personal message.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
We haven't and we can't possibly deal with all the variations that fall under this category or any of these categories, but its just that BPD is a disorder that has as one of its symptoms or manifestations a tendency towards volatile reactions which can traumatize and frighten people and leave them feeling unsafe or unsettled frequently (it might be that Asperger's people are somehow a good match with BPD people if the Asperger's person doesn't have a neuro-typical as they say reaction to the BPD person going ballistic suddenly. It isn't all knowledge based on just what people have told me, I've first hand dealt with people with BPD or who claim to have it, and even if they are ok with me sometimes, I've seen the ballistic type outbursts and things with people of different ages, and I can totally understand where the stigma and fear might come from sometimes. Sure, they deserve a chance like everyone else, even schizophrenics, bi-polar, psychopaths might deserve chances, they all have stigma surrounding them, and it isn't always just for no reason though, its because of not only the stories and real life cases, but sometimes its from actually dealing with them and the struggles and difficulties involved, and its not for everyone. I seek out people with issues in order to talk to them and learn everything I can about them, but it hasn't left me with the opinion that a person who is perfectly healthy and has not experiences the extreme distress sometimes involved with these sorts of cases should eagerly pursue them, its real and its serious and it can't be taken lightly and there is even some threat to personal mental health and wellbeing overall by being immersed in difficult and unusual sorts of situations or situations which can turn volatile or people who are very difficult to reason with or provide therapies for even. BPD is particularly known for hostility and I've seen it also in volatile relationships people have had or with their parents who seem to have it and have made life a living hell for some kids and teenagers (I'm dealing with one person who has a Dad who was even diagnosed with it, and he was yelling at her on the phone for no apparent reason just the other day simply because she said that someday she might like to travel the world, a very typical sort of thing to say, and they went nuts because of perceived abandonment or something and said all sorts of abusive things).
Me having Asperger's has nothing to do with it, other than I know what it's like to be judged unfairly and quite harshly just for having a mental illness.
And your words "seem to have it." You aren't an expert and are judging based on what you've heard. Could be, and more likely, those people you think seem to have it more likely have impulse or anger issues (or something else entirely different).
Yes, any sort of relationship with someone with BPD can be rough and bumpy. But it's cruel to make their entire existence about their illness. It's cruel to hyper focus on one symptom and a few extreme cases and preach like they are all like that. They too are people, and this "big scary problem" they have often leaves them hurting. It leaves them scared and frightened. Uncertain about themselves and scared of abandonment.
And we "might" deserve a chance? (I'm also bipolar). No, everyone deserves a chance (I'm also have professional experience in the mental health field). We are all human, we all make mistakes, we all royally screw up sometimes. And "normal people" often have their own dire issues. Like widespread and accepted alcohol abuse. But they evade being recommended for treatment (though such abuse of an illegal drug certainly would not) because it's "socially acceptable" to abuse alcohol to the point of an over dose on many occasions throughout the year. And they look down on those with mental illness (even mental health professionals, who look down on those with illnesses and deny their own - and many of their clients are aware when this happens).
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I might have liked old style feminists if what @Stevicus is saying is accurate. I'm not a far righter after all.
I once surveyed the internet, & found about 2 dozen different
kinds of feminism. You get to pick which you favor or reject.

There was even "libertarian feminism". But I was informed
here that it cannot be. Why? Because it permits women to
voluntarily be sex workers & clients. That's officially anti-feminist.
Women's sexual actions must be restricted if commerce is
involved. I'd grant women too much liberty to be a feminist.
Go figure.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I once surveyed the internet, & found about 2 dozen different
kinds of feminism. You get to pick which you favor or reject.

There was even "libertarian feminism". But I was informed
here that it cannot be. Why? Because it permits women to
voluntarily be sex workers & clients. That's officially anti-feminist.
Women's sexual actions must be restricted if commerce is
involved. I'd grant women too much liberty to be a feminist.
Go figure.

I took an online quiz just now and it called me a "No, but" feminist and told me that I am a feminist but that I tend to deny it because I don't follow it too strongly.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I took an online quiz just now and it called me a "No, but" feminist and told me that I am a feminist but that I tend to deny it because I don't follow it too strongly.
I too took a feminism quiz.
It deemed me over 90% feminist.
But I find the "libertarian" prefix necessary because
the bulk of feminism's different flavors are statist &
largely silent on equality applying to men too.
 

Jesster

Friendly skeptic
Premium Member
I once surveyed the internet, & found about 2 dozen different
kinds of feminism. You get to pick which you favor or reject.

There was even "libertarian feminism". But I was informed
here that it cannot be. Why? Because it permits women to
voluntarily be sex workers & clients. That's officially anti-feminist.
Women's sexual actions must be restricted if commerce is
involved. I'd grant women too much liberty to be a feminist.
Go figure.
Every feminist I personally know, including myself, supports sexual liberation like that. I even consider that pretty central to feminism.

For what it's worth.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
I've decided I don't really support the feminist movement to the extent of being a strong advocate of it. They've done some good things. But things like the #MeToo movement which is often promoted by the feminists I've seen, have done an equal amount of destruction and good, and a lot of feminists are TERFs which can be harmful to me as a transgender person. I'm not completely against women speaking out in #MeToo, I just want there to be proof before destroying another person's reputation. And remember, #MeToo supporters can have allegations against them too, as well as feminists.

The alternative of the past was women suffered a degrading, humiliating submission to male violence and domination. Rape and abuse of women was tolerated in the old world cultures.

I do hope that with time women can attain a social and legal equality that is harmonious in a contemporary society.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Oh believe me. I hold many views that oppose RF's norm. That's not about to change.
I fit right in here, occasional disagreement notwithstanding.
I also don't think RF's norm represents the norm I know around me away from the internet.
I don't discuss feminism with feminists in venues other than RF.
Too dangerous.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I have a friend who's a sex worker if that changes anything. ;)
I wonder if you'd be allowed to post in the Feminist Only forum.
I got the boot.
But then....they couldn't kick out a girlie.

Btw, your current avatar is a really pleasant shade of blue.
 

Jesster

Friendly skeptic
Premium Member
I wonder if you'd be allowed to post in the Feminist Only forum.
I got the boot.
But then....they couldn't kick out a girlie.
I've posted there enough. My record remains clear. Maybe I'm not so extreme after all.

I don't hold any views that oppose feminism. Just specific extremes.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I've posted there enough. My record remains clear. Maybe I'm not so extreme after all.
Perhaps...possibly...sometimes membership in a group
is more about personalities involved than objectivity.
Your social skills are far superior to mine.
 
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