I am the truth.

[Just_me_Mike]

When pondering something yesterday, I realized I don't think anyone in any other religion or spiritual realm directly claimed to be the actual truth. Not a direction or a teacher, but He says he is the truth, which is why you have to eat him and drink him.

Unless I am wrong, and that is why I am posting here, all others claim to lead you to truth, or direct you to it, but never to be the truth.

Does that aspect of Jesus make him unique?

 

[Willamena]

But . . . you're the truth, too (or it doesn't work).

 

[Breathe]

but He says he is the truth, which is why you have to eat him and drink him.

How does that work?

Does that aspect of Jesus make him unique?

Possibly. But how do we know Jesus said that, or that it wasn't "I AM" (as in the name of God) is truth?

All we have are to go on are probably word-for-word translations of something that would have been passed on orally... anything could have been altered, perhaps on purpose, perhaps not..

 

[Storm]

When pondering something yesterday, I realized I don't think anyone in any other religion or spiritual realm directly claimed to be the actual truth. Not a direction or a teacher, but He says he is the truth, which is why you have to eat him and drink him.

Unless I am wrong, and that is why I am posting here, all others claim to lead you to truth, or direct you to it, but never to be the truth.

Does that aspect of Jesus make him unique?

Well, I'm sure this will shock you, but I don't think He meant it literally. I think He meant the path He taught was "the way, the truth, and the life," as opposed to His incarnation. I think Jesus would be sorely disappointed that the cult of personality has supplanted His teachings.

 

[Wookiemonster]

What I find most intresting about the quote "I am the way, the truth and the light", is that most people focus on the answer and not the question that provoked it and the person who asked it.

The questioner here was Thomas, a man who according the "NT" had been with Christ for at least 3 years.

If a man who walked daily with Christ himself didn't understand the answers how then can anyone claim to understand them after reading these things 1000's of years after they were recorded.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I don't think that Jesus said it. The "I am" sayings in John are theological reflections from a much later time in Christainity than the life of Jesus. Early Christian interpreters were aware of this...

 

[Just_me_Mike]

OK so when he says he is the door, and no one can come to the Father but by me.
Is that too a theological reflection?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

OK so when he says he is the door, and no one can come to the Father but by me.
Is that too a theological reflection?

You got it.:yes:

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Not much comfort in that is there?
Thanks for the reply!

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I realized I don't think anyone in any other religion or spiritual realm directly claimed to be the actual truth.

I bet I can find at least five.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I bet I can find at least five.

That is why I posted silly. It wasn't a challenge, I was just curious what was out there. Let me know if you find something, thanks!

 

[angellous_evangellous]

That is why I posted silly. It wasn't a challenge, I was just curious what was out there. Let me know if you find something, thanks!

I can give you some candidates, listed in no particular order:

Alexander the Great
Julius Ceasar
Nero
perhaps Antiochus Epiphanes IV

Xerxes
Artaxerxes

Maybe Cyrus the Great

Basically, the great conquerers of the Near East and the apotheized Roman emperors.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I can give you some candidates, listed in no particular order:

Alexander the Great
Julius Ceasar
Nero
perhaps Antiochus Epiphanes IV

Xerxes
Artaxerxes

Maybe Cyrus the Great

Basically, the great conquerers of the Near East and the apotheized Roman emperors.

Quick question because I have not studied these individual.
All these named, claimed to be the reason, truth, door, exclusive way to eternal life?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Quick question because I have not studied these individual.
All these named, claimed to be the reason, truth, door, exclusive way to eternal life?

Well, in the same way that Jesus did.

Many of the great kings of the Near East either claimed divinity and its rights and privlidges or it was bestowed upon them. The Persian and Babylonian kings said of themselves "I am the beginning and end, the morning and evening star" and in Greek "I am the alpha and omega" - parallel to the titles given to God in the Hebrew traditions and to Jesus in Christian traditions.

Remember that the Romans had a thing for emperor worship, and the dictators either claimed divinity or it was bestowed upon them by the senate on their death. Emperor worship was more intense in the provinces in an attempt to show loyalty to their Roman conquerers ... that is, emperor worship was seen as kinda silly in Rome and taken more seriously further away from Rome, even if it was only lip-service. Places like Jerusalem rejected it as idolatry and blasphemy... but in other cities it was quite prominent.

notes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apotheosis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_cult_(ancient_Rome)

"The Roman imperial cult is sometimes considered a deviation from Rome's traditional Republican values, a religiously insincere cult of personality which served Imperial propaganda.[2][3] Many modern historians disagree with this interpretation, and regard the Imperial cult as a well-integrated unifying feature of the Principate. Its ritual, organisational and ideological frameworks can be found as distinctive features of later institutions, especially those of Western monarchies and Roman Catholicism."

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Well, in the same way that Jesus did.

Many of the great kings of the Near East either claimed divinity and its rights and privlidges or it was bestowed upon them. The Persian and Babylonian kings said of themselves "I am the beginning and end, the morning and evening star" and in Greek "I am the alpha and omega" - parallel to the titles given to God in the Hebrew traditions and to Jesus in Christian traditions.

Remember that the Romans had a thing for emperor worship, and the dictators either claimed divinity or it was bestowed upon them by the senate on their death. Emperor worship was more intense in the provinces in an attempt to show loyalty to their Roman conquerers ... that is, emperor worship was seen as kinda silly in Rome and taken more seriously further away from Rome, even if it was only lip-service. Places like Jerusalem rejected it as idolatry and blasphemy... but in other cities it was quite prominent.

Thanks again. I am not sure though, and I will do some study. None of these claimed to be the door to eternal life though. In other words, will I find the names mentioned to be people that were self serving?

You provided some names, and I get it that they claimed to be divinely guided, but so did Muhammad and many others. I am not sure I see my original question answered though.
Jesus specifically claimed to be the ONLY way in which ANY human being can have eternal life. That seems to be his only message.

Sorry if I am sounding stubborn, I am just trying to understand if you are comparing the same thing.

 

[BucephalusBB]

Thanks again. I am not sure though, and I will do some study. None of these claimed to be the door to eternal life though. In other words, will I find the names mentioned to be people that were self serving?

You provided some names, and I get it that they claimed to be divinely guided, but so did Muhammad and many others. I am not sure I see my original question answered though.
Jesus specifically claimed to be the ONLY way in which ANY human being can have eternal life. That seems to be his only message.

Sorry if I am sounding stubborn, I am just trying to understand if you are comparing the same thing.

Sorry, but are you looking now for people who said exactly the same as jesus did? To point out he was unique? Because his DNA will point him out as unique..
btw, it seems so obvious that I can only imagine many other people claiming to be the only way..

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Thanks again. I am not sure though, and I will do some study. None of these claimed to be the door to eternal life though. In other words, will I find the names mentioned to be people that were self serving?

You provided some names, and I get it that they claimed to be divinely guided, but so did Muhammad and many others. I am not sure I see my original question answered though.

Jesus specifically claimed to be the ONLY way in which ANY human being can have eternal life. That seems to be his only message.

Sorry if I am sounding stubborn, I am just trying to understand if you are comparing the same thing.

I don't think that you're being stubborn... I do think that you have a lot to learn about ancient history --- as do we all.

The message of Christianity is given to conquered peoples. Remember that Peter's tradition and only one letter from Paul is addressed to Romans, and every other letter and Gospel is addressed to conquered people.

The early Christians use the honorary titles commonly used for divine rulers like Augustus and others to describe a heavenly kingdom of a living God. They simply hyper-extended normal language and applied it in an exclusive way.

Roman religion was very open - they tolerated any religion as long as sacrifices were made to the Emperor, or in the case of the Jews, sacrifices for the Emperor's health because they only worshiped one G-d. Christians were also killed because they refused to do this.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

By the way, itwillend, have you read this?

Pliny and Trajan on the Christians

"Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ--none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do--these I thought should be discharged."

 

[Just_me_Mike]

By the way, itwillend, have you read this?

Pliny and Trajan on the Christians

"Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ--none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do--these I thought should be discharged."

Nope, but I will give it a read.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

By the way, itwillend, have you read this?

Pliny and Trajan on the Christians

"Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ--none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do--these I thought should be discharged."

Cool letter, I wonder if this gets the beating and bruising of accuracy that the bible and other sacred texts get?