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Human Animals?

Kfox

Well-Known Member
What has this to do with humans animals being/not being beast. According to the definition of beast we qualify,
Below are a few outside sources (dictionaries) that disagree with you.
However, if you want to define mankind as beast, that's your choice we can agree to disagree on that one; but I do take issue when someone implies I am arrogant because I consider myself above a dog or an ape. However; if you want to consider yourself at that level; knock yourself out bruh!

 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Please don't include me in your "we." I don't.
I was refering to “mankind” not you specifically. But to clear things up, henceforth if I wish to refer to you, I will refer to you by name. Fair enough?
But in answer to your question, humans use other animals because humans can be cruel, egotistical, merciless creatures,
Not usually, usually when we use animals this way, we do it as their friends and with their consent.
and in my book that puts them below other animals, especially from a moral perspective.

Other species work together to accomplish a result rather than use each other.
Consider the following scenario:
Suppose I found a woman attractive and wanted to have sex with her, so I followed her home, kill her children; and rape her. Would you consider me evil to do this? How about if a male lion did this to a female lion? Would you judge the male lion the same way you would judge me if he did it?
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
That's a good question. I think at some point we considered ourselves "separate/above" the animals, and many still do, unfortunately.

So people seem to think animals are beneath them, which is not a healthy attitude.
Why is this attitude unhealthy?
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
I was refering to “mankind” not you specifically. But to clear things up, henceforth if I wish to refer to you, I will refer to you by name. Fair enough?

Not usually, usually when we use animals this way, we do it as their friends and with their consent.
How many friends do you have that you feel are beneath you?

Consider the following scenario:
Suppose I found a woman attractive and wanted to have sex with her, so I followed her home, kill her children; and rape her. Would you consider me evil to do this? How about if a male lion did this to a female lion? Would you judge the male lion the same way you would judge me if he did it?
Too many assumptions in your analogy...

You assume your and the lion's intent is identical.

You assume it's my place to stand in judgment.

Your behavior would align with that of a sociopath. Are lions, in your opinion, sociopaths?
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
The reason it is considered wrong is because people consider themselves above beasts; regardless of how you feel concerning the issue.
I think you should learn the difference between "I", "we", and "people". You appear to be conflating the three terms. You have already encountered at least three people in this thread that don't consider themselves above other animals.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
Why is this attitude unhealthy?
Why should humans not think that animals are beneath them? Because it is simply not accurate - in the sense of just seeing them as unthinking, unfeeling, almost automatons, and only reacting on instinct. There is plenty of evidence that many creatures exhibit feelings and have enough thinking going on in their heads to plan or to solve problems, for example.

Humans have undoubtedly progressed to a state far in advance of other life in many ways but this shouldn't therefore mean that we can't recognise the lives of non-humans and see how we often share so many features. The fact that so many people have pets should be one indicator as to how we so often share one essential component - our affection for others (seemingly reciprocated), even when they are of a different species.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Below are a few outside sources (dictionaries) that disagree with you.
However, if you want to define mankind as beast, that's your choice we can agree to disagree on that one; but I do take issue when someone implies I am arrogant because I consider myself above a dog or an ape. However; if you want to consider yourself at that level; knock yourself out bruh!


Yeah and there are definitions to the contrary. And trust me on this, i have met enough to form my own opinion
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
How many friends do you have that you feel are beneath you?
Several. All of my animal friends are beneath me. I hold my human friends to a much higher standard than I hold my animal friends.
Too many assumptions in your analogy...

You assume your and the lion's intent is identical.
In my scenario the intents are identical; so answer the question
You assume it's my place to stand in judgment.
I'm asking for your judgment; so answer the question.
Your behavior would align with that of a sociopath. Are lions, in your opinion, sociopaths?
I'm asking for YOUR opinion; you already know mine. So answer my question! Would you judge the lion the same as you would judge me?
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Why should humans not think that animals are beneath them? Because it is simply not accurate - in the sense of just seeing them as unthinking, unfeeling, almost automatons, and only reacting on instinct.
I don't feel that way about animals, that is not the reason I feel they are below humans.
Humans have undoubtedly progressed to a state far in advance of other life in many ways but this shouldn't therefore mean that we can't recognise the lives of non-humans and see how we often share so many features.
I agree! But recognizing this does not mean we are equal
The fact that so many people have pets should be one indicator as to how we so often share one essential component - our affection for others (seemingly reciprocated), even when they are of a different species.
Yeah; but the fact that we often have them as pets, but they never have us as pets, should indicate to you or anybody else that we do not see them as our equal.
 
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SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
Several. All of my animal friends are beneath me. I hold my human friends to a much higher standard than I hold my animal friends.
Human friends. How many of them are beneath you?

In my scenario the intents are identical; so answer the question

I'm asking for your judgment; so answer the question.

I'm asking for YOUR opinion; you already know mine. So answer my question! Would you judge the lion the same as you would judge me?
If I was forced to judge, and the lion was a sociopath, then yes, I would judge you both the same.

Now answer my question. Are lions, in your opinion, sociopaths?
 

Secret Chief

nirvana is samsara
However, if you want to define mankind as beast, that's your choice we can agree to disagree on that one; but I do take issue when someone implies I am arrogant because I consider myself above a dog or an ape.
It's not a matter of opinion or arrogance; you are a human therefore you are an ape.

"The Hominidae (/hɒˈmɪnɪdiː/), whose members are known as the great apes or hominids(/ˈhɒmɪnɪdz/), are a taxonomic family of primates that includes eight extant species in four genera: Pongo (the Bornean, Sumatran and Tapanuli orangutan); Gorilla (the eastern and western gorilla); Pan(the chimpanzee and the bonobo); and Homo, of which only modern humans (Homo sapiens) remain."

- Hominidae - Wikipedia
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Human friends. How many of them are beneath you?
None.
If I was forced to judge, and the lion was a sociopath, then yes, I would judge you both the same.

Now answer my question. Are lions, in your opinion, sociopaths?
Sociopath is a label that I only apply to mankind; because we are held to a higher standard than animals. When lions behave like lions, it's called nature. When mankind behave like lions, I call it Sociopath.
Are lions in your view sociopaths?
 

Little Dragon

Well-Known Member
Are humans really animals? Or are we some kind of Spiritually blessed non-animal entity?

Honestly, though, the other thread keeps making me think of this thread so I'm opening it up.

Come One, come All.
Humans are animals by every biological definition. I guess other people have different understandings of what the word animal means.
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
Then I don't believe you use other animals as your friends with their consent.

Now that I think about it, please explain to me the process of obtaining other animal's consent. Do they give verbal consent? Sign a consent form?

Sociopath is a label that I only apply to mankind; because we are held to a higher standard than animals. When lions behave like lions, it's called nature. When mankind behave like lions, I call it Sociopath.
Are lions in your view sociopaths?
No.

But then again, I wasn't the one who invented a scenario where a lion would follow a lioness home because he thought she was attractive and wanted to rape her.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
I don't feel that way about animals, that is not the reason I feel they are below humans.

I agree! But recognizing this does not mean we are equal

Yeah; but the fact that we often have them as pets, but they never have us as pets, should indicate to you or anybody else that we do not see them as our equal.
The impression was given that non-humans are below us though, as many do actually think this. We are just different, had a different evolutionary path than even our closest relatives (the other primates and hominids), will hardly be equal in many ways, but perhaps have as much value as other creatures. How can one species actually be the equal of any other?
 
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