How to End Poverty

[sayak83]

I understand you don't believe the Bible and I don't mean to beat it into anybody. I will simply repeat what it says and let the reader draw their own conclusion.

This life can be enjoyed to the max.

John 10:10,

The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have [it] more abundantly.
​

So it can be a pretty good life. Nonetheless it is clearly not eternal. Just go to a graveyard to see that. The folks in the graves are pretty dead.

Jas 4:14,

...For what [is] your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.
​

Again, I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else. The words are simple to understand. They are either believed or not. So what comes next? That would be the book of Revelations.

Rev 21:1,

And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
​

Rev 21:4,

And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
​

Not such a bad thing to look forward to.

What is your understanding of life and death? It would be best if you could give references from whatever sacred source you use. I'm interested to see what other religions believe. Thanks in advance.

This is Biblical debates section, so I won't discuss my religion here. But thank you for your interest. I think the issue I have with the Bible is it believes that this world is unsalvagable and will go from bad to horrible and the only hope is an apocalyptic intervention by God that remakes the universe. I consider this a very pessimistic way to look at this world that may encourage passive personal piety rather than an active social activism that is optimistic about realizing a better future world for all.

 

[Deeje]

But I digress. The question at hand is why the devil would not have killed Jesus had he known the mystery. Col 1:27 gives the answer. When Jesus was here there was one Jesus. The devil only had that one Jesus to contend with. But now that we know that Christ dwells withing each and every born again believer, the devil has countless Jesus' to contend with. Wherever there is a believer, there is Christ. When you walk into the grocery store, Christ walks into that store. What a fantastic truth!

Interesting angle again. I would not have thought of it like that....

You said..."Verse 8 says the devil would not have crucified Jesus had he known about this secret. That's interesting! Why!"

But on further investigation, I see from various translations that this verse refers to human rulers, not the devil.

ASV..."which none of the rulers of this world hath known: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory".

ESV..." None of the rulers of this age understood this, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory."

NASB..."the wisdom which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory".

NET..."None of the rulers of this age understood it. If they had known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory".

NLT..."But the rulers of this world have not understood it; if they had, they would not have crucified our glorious Lord."

It seems as if only the KJV infers that this is speaking about the devil.

In context that scripture reads....
"But the rulers of this world have not understood it; if they had, they would not have crucified our glorious Lord. 9 That is what the Scriptures mean when they say, “No eye has seen, no ear has heard, and no mind has imagine what God has prepared for those who love him.”
10 But it was to us that God revealed these things by his Spirit. For his Spirit searches out everything and shows us God’s deep secrets." (NLT)

Who were the rulers of that world? The Roman government and its representatives. They had no idea what they were doing, and who it was that they were executing....hence why Jesus asked his Father to forgive them.

Christians today have the same holy spirit protecting them today as their 'brothers' did in the first century....though perhaps not so spectacularly.

John 1:14,
And the Word [logos] was made [Greek ginomai, to become] flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Jesus was not sitting together with God when He created the universe. The logos was, but until it become flesh it was not flesh. That fits with the many clear verses [around 500] that says Jesus was the son of God and not one says he was God the son. If Jesus is mistaken as being God, the two main characters of the logos are mixed up in such a way that the brilliance of the logos is somewhat unclear. But that is a good description of what orthodox church doctrine have done to God's word.

As the one "through whom" all creation came, then the Logos was most certainly "with" God as John 1:1 states.
Genesis 1:26 fits that description perfectly. But his "becoming flesh" was an act of God. The pre-human Jesus was a separate entity both before and after coming to this earth on his mission. He was divinely provided as the "ransom" for mankind. He has many roles, and a different name for each one. He was "Jesus" on earth. Others found in the Christian Greek Scriptures are “the Amen,” “Faithful and True,” “the Faithful Witness,” “King of kings and Lord of lords,” “the Lamb of God,” “Leader,” “the Lion that is of the tribe of Judah,” “Lord,” “Potentate,” “Savior,” as well as “the Word.”

When he returned to heaven to his God, he was given another new name, suggesting another role in the Kingdom arrangement. (Revelation 3:12) The Father has but one name....YHWH. (Jehovah in English) (Exodus 3:13-15)

 

[Deeje]

I think the issue I have with the Bible is it believes that this world is unsalvagable and will go from bad to horrible and the only hope is an apocalyptic intervention by God that remakes the universe. I consider this a very pessimistic way to look at this world that may encourage passive personal piety rather than an active social activism that is optimistic about realizing a better future world for all.

Perhaps the biggest problem that people have with the Bible is the ridiculous interpretation given it by those who don't seem to have a clue even about its most basic message.There is no heaven or hell...there is no getting rid of the universe....there is only a cleansing of this planet of all the things that contaminate it....both physically and spiritually.

God does not have to remake the universe or this planet. All he has to do is evict its bad tenants. He is entitled to do that once he has served notice on them. This is his earth which he prepared for habitation....if humans are trashing it and he has told them to stop their wicked ways and they refuse, he is entitled to kick them out. Unfortunately there is nowhere else for them to go...so it is the end of their existence. Who is ever sorry to see a bad tenant evicted? Who wants them to go somewhere else and continue their bad habits? Not God I can assure you.

 

[sayak83]

Perhaps the biggest problem that people have with the Bible is the ridiculous interpretation given it by those who don't seem to have a clue even about its most basic message.There is no heaven or hell...there is no getting rid of the universe....there is only a cleansing of this planet of all the things that contaminate it....both physically and spiritually.

God does not have to remake the universe or this planet. All he has to do is evict its bad tenants. He is entitled to do that once he has served notice on them. This is his earth which he prepared for habitation....if humans are trashing it and he has told them to stop their wicked ways and they refuse, he is entitled to kick them out. Unfortunately there is nowhere else for them to go...so it is the end of their existence. Who is ever sorry to see a bad tenant evicted? Who wants them to go somewhere else and continue their bad habits? Not God I can assure you.

I was implying the same thing by the word remake. My problem is that you (and others like you influenced by Abrahamic ideology) think that the world is unsalvagable and will go from bad to worse till God intervenes in a big way and "cleanses" the planet. This is a horribly pessimistic outlook to live with and encourages one to passive personal piety rather than constructive social activism that believes that human effort can and will improve the future world for all.

 

[Deeje]

I was implying the same thing by the word remake. My problem is that you (and others like you influenced by Abrahamic ideology) think that the world is unsalvagable and will go from bad to worse till God intervenes in a big way and "cleanses" the planet.

This world is going from bad to worse....or can't you see it? The Creator and has sets the standards for morality and law, so only his intervention will suffice to fix the rot that has been eating away at humanity for thousands of years. The reason why humans never learn from the mistakes of the past is because they can't be told....so they are therefore doomed to keep repeating them....only in a different era.
Super heroes are not coming to save the day.

And human beings are useless when it comes to ruling themselves and solving the problems that they created for themselves.

This is a horribly pessimistic outlook to live with and encourages one to passive personal piety rather than constructive social activism that believes that human effort can and will improve the future world for all.

On the contrary, it gives us hope of something being done by someone who actually cares about the planet and has the power and the will to make things better. That will benefit the whole human race instead of only the very wealthy "few" who seem to think everything is hunky-dory in their world. They have no thought for those trapped in poverty with abandoned women and children living on the streets, open to all manner of abuse because there is no money to feed or house them.

What social activism to date has ever come close to solving the world's problems? Those who try are usually buried under the magnitude of the problem. It continues to escalate when people flee their own country and try to seek refuge in a different country and culture. Terrorism makes people feel insecure to travel overseas or even to relax and enjoy a coffee in a cafe because they don't feel safe anywhere anymore. Children don't feel safe at school. Who is in control of all that? What schemes of man are addressing these problems?

 

[sayak83]

This world is going from bad to worse....or can't you see it? The Creator and has sets the standards for morality and law, so only his intervention will suffice to fix the rot that has been eating away at humanity for thousands of years. The reason why humans never learn from the mistakes of the past is because they can't be told....so they are therefore doomed to keep repeating them....only in a different era.
Super heroes are not coming to save the day.

And human beings are useless when it comes to ruling themselves and solving the problems that they created for themselves.



On the contrary, it gives us hope of something being done by someone who actually cares about the planet and has the power and the will to make things better. That will benefit the whole human race instead of only the very wealthy "few" who seem to think everything is hunky-dory in their world. They have no thought for those trapped in poverty with abandoned women and children living on the streets, open to all manner of abuse because there is no money to feed or house them.

What social activism to date has ever come close to solving the world's problems? Those who try are usually buried under the magnitude of the problem. It continues to escalate when people flee their own country and try to seek refuge in a different country and culture. Terrorism makes people feel insecure to travel overseas or even to relax and enjoy a coffee in a cafe because they don't feel safe anywhere anymore. Children don't feel safe at school. Who is in control of all that? What schemes of man are addressing these problems?

Your attitude will be the typical example of why I have strong reservations about the Bible. And ...
https://i.imgflip.com/2360tj.jpg

 

[Deeje]

Your attitude will be the typical example of why I have strong reservations about the Bible. And ...
https://i.imgflip.com/2360tj.jpg

If every word I said was wrong....show me where you're right.

You might not like what I said but it's all true. Humans can't solve the problems because humans ARE the problem.

 

[rrobs]

I was implying the same thing by the word remake. My problem is that you (and others like you influenced by Abrahamic ideology) think that the world is unsalvagable and will go from bad to worse till God intervenes in a big way and "cleanses" the planet. This is a horribly pessimistic outlook to live with and encourages one to passive personal piety rather than constructive social activism that believes that human effort can and will improve the future world for all.

There has been no real improvement in the state of the world for 6,000 years now. For example, are we any closer to ending war, poverty, racism, depression, disease, etc? And even if it can be said that we have improved on those fronts, what about death? That certainly hasn't been alleviated as of this date. I know many say something like, "death is just part of life" as though that makes it something we all want. Go to any funeral and see how happy everybody is that their now dead loved one is no longer with them. Hypocrisy comes to my mind. Death is no friend.

1Cor 15:26,

The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.​

I don't understand why you can't see that someone can live this life in a most happy manner while still believing it will someday end only to be followed by something so good it is beyond comprehension. I'm not sure why you make such a definitive conclusion. I'm about as happy and go-lucky as they come. My accomplishments are many. It seems to me that someone who believes in a perfect paradise to come will live this life to a much fuller extent than someone who believes there is nothing after death. Reincarnation? Well, no matter how many times someone comes back, they will never have a life anywhere near the future life God promises in the Bible. Once is enough for me. Let's get to the good one!

 

[rrobs]

Interesting angle again. I would not have thought of it like that....

You said..."Verse 8 says the devil would not have crucified Jesus had he known about this secret. That's interesting! Why!"

It was necessary for Jesus to die in order to redeem us. Had he not died we would still be living with nothing but our old sinful nature.

What would Pontius Pilate have to loose by allowing Jesus to live and thus avoid having many millions of people with Christ in them walking around? Nothing. What would the devil have to lose in the same situation? Everything!

1Cor 2:8,

Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known [it], they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
​

The question arises as to how to interpret the words, "princes of this world?" How about not interpreting it at all and let the Word interpret itself? Is there anywhere else in the Bible where this phrase is used? Turns out it is used several times.

John 12:31,

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
​

Eph 2:2,

Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
​

These verses are certainly not talking about Pontius Pilate, Herod, or any other world leader.

 

[Deeje]

It was necessary for Jesus to die in order to redeem us. Had he not died we would still be living with nothing but our old sinful nature.

What would Pontius Pilate have to loose by allowing Jesus to live and thus avoid having many millions of people with Christ in them walking around? Nothing. What would the devil have to lose in the same situation? Everything!

1Cor 2:8,

Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known [it], they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
​

The question arises as to how to interpret the words, "princes of this world?" How about not interpreting it at all and let the Word interpret itself? Is there anywhere else in the Bible where this phrase is used? Turns out it is used several times.

John 12:31,

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
​

Eph 2:2,

Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
​

These verses are certainly not talking about Pontius Pilate, Herod, or any other world leader.

Thank you once again for giving me some homework. The Bible does indeed interpret itself.

The Greek word used in all these scriptures is "archōn" which in Biblical usage means..."a ruler, commander, chief, leader". A "Prince" can be any of those things...Jesus is called "the Prince of Peace" because he fits those descriptions too.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G758&t=NASB

...so the title "prince" (which is the son of royalty,) means little with reference to satan. "Ruler", "leader" "commander" or "chief" would be a more appropriate term for him. Who does he rule? Who does he lead?

You will notice that in 1 Corinthians 2:8 it mentions "princes" (plural) so again, I believe that it is speaking about the Roman authorities, not satan.

And in the other scriptures you mentioned, the "prince" there is singular and obviously referring to a single entity...satan.

I hope you can see that your premise here is not supported by the scriptures.

 

[rrobs]

Thank you once again for giving me some homework. The Bible does indeed interpret itself.

The Greek word used in all these scriptures is "archōn" which in Biblical usage means..."a ruler, commander, chief, leader". A "Prince" can be any of those things...Jesus is called "the Prince of Peace" because he fits those descriptions too.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G758&t=NASB

...so the title "prince" (which is the son of royalty,) means little with reference to satan. "Ruler", "leader" "commander" or "chief" would be a more appropriate term for him. Who does he rule? Who does he lead?

You will notice that in 1 Corinthians 2:8 it mentions "princes" (plural) so again, I believe that it is speaking about the Roman authorities, not satan.

And in the other scriptures you mentioned, the "prince" there is singular and obviously referring to a single entity...satan.

I hope you can see that your premise here is not supported by the scriptures.

Homework is always good, especially when it involves the Bible!

Here's my thinking on the subject. When God created Adam and Eve he gave them authority over the earth.

Gen 1:26,

And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.​

According to this verse it is not true that God had dominion. That is part of the reason God couldn't have come down right after Adam's sin and set things right right then and there. But what happened to Adam's dominion after his disobedience? Clearly, Adam was no longer in control. His and Eve's life took a major turn for the worse. Thorns, thistles, sweaty labor, ending in death. So what happened to Adam's dominion? He transferred that power to the devil.

Luke 4:6,

And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.
​

The devil was quite correct in claiming power over the earth. That is why he is called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2 and "the god of this world" in 2 Cor 4:4. The only reason the earth didn't go completely bananas is that there has always been a flicker of light. There has always been at least one person who carried the flaming torch of God and therefore avoiding complete darkness which is what the devil would like. Are not we now called the light of this world? We keep the devil restrained by our believing in the words of life. And that not by our good works, but by the grace of God.

1John 5:19,

[And] we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
​

I don't see that as being God's idea of how things should be. That is the result of Adam's disobedience and not God's doing at all. Man, by his God given free will, is the reason the whole creation groans in pain (Rom 8:22).

As beautiful as we tend to think of the mountains, clouds, oceans, etc, they are really nothing compared to the new earth that is coming. The second chapter of 2 Thessalonians (and many other places, most notably Revelations) tell us how Jesus Christ will once again reclaim dominion at his second appearance. When Jesus is in charge things will be a lot different, that's for sure!

What would have been the motivation of either the Romans or Pharisees to keep Jesus alive? The Pharisees hated him and he was becoming a pain in the you know what to the Romans. Neither party had anything to gain by keeping him alive, nor anything to lose by killing him. At least that's what they thought. But the devil had everything to lose by making it available for believers everywhere to have Christ in them. That's why, had the devil known the mystery kept secret in God (Rom 16:25), he would never have crucified him.

 

[rrobs]

I hope you can see that your premise here is not supported by the scriptures.

I'm afraid I don't see that, my friend.

It is clear that there is someone who would not have killed Jesus had they known the mystery.

1Cor 2:8,

Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known [it], they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
​

That someone is identified as the princes of this world. Why, whoever these folks are, would they have not killed Jesus?

First of all, we must know what this "mystery" is. It is not a matter of opinion or guesswork. The Bible is clear on what this mystery is. We can know it was hidden in God until He revealed it to the Apostle Paul.

Rom 16:25,

Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my (Paul's) gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
​

Eph 3:3,

How that by revelation he made known unto me (Paul) the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
​

1Cor 2:7,

But we (Paul & company) speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, [even] the hidden [wisdom], which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
​

Until it was revealed to Paul by God nobody knew this mystery. God's purpose in this mystery is clearly stated in Ephesians.

Eph 3:4-6,

4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my (Paul's) knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:​

Verse 6 states the end purpose of the mystery in clear terms. In the OT the Gentiles were without God and had no hope (Eph 2:12). The Jews were God's chosen people and the Gentiles were not His chosen people. I know that they could convert to Judism, but short of that they were flat out of luck when it came to salvation. It was quite an unexpected turn of events when God revealed to Paul that the Gentiles could now share fully with Israel. It probably fried the minds of many an Israelite when first revealed!

We saw in 1 Corinthians 2:7 that this mystery was ordained by God to our glory. That was nice of Him! What is the glory of the mystery?

Col 1:25-27,

25 Whereof I (Paul) am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;
26 [Even] the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
27 To whom God would make known what [is] the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
​

Now I can understand why the devil would not have wanted a whole bunch of folks running around with Christ in them. That is pretty easy to see. Had he not killed Jesus, who being free from sin, would have lived forever (death comes by sin, Rom 5:12). The power of God to us is not in the crucifixion, but in the resurrection (it would be more appropriate for churches to have a picture of an empty tomb rather than crucifixes all over the place). It was the resurrection that allowed the plan of God to come into fruition. The devil had to kill Jesus in order for God to raise him from the dead. Once Jesus rose from the dead the mystery kicked in and it is Christ in me, Christ in you, and Christ in every born again believer. That was certainly not what the devil intended when he had Jesus killed!

The human leaders had nothing to lose by killing Jesus, but the devil had everything to lose. Why would Pontius Pilate have cared? He wanted nothing to do with the scriptures. Why would the Jewish leaders have cared? Wouldn't they have been more than happy to share their favor with God with the Gentiles had they known that was going to happen after Jesus died and rose as per the mystery? If not, why not?

 

[Al Ibn Al Amra]

Be exactly .

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

Deut 15:4-5,

4 Save when there shall be no poor among you; for the LORD shall greatly bless thee in the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee [for] an inheritance to possess it:
5 Only if thou carefully hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all these commandments which I command thee this day.​

Incredibly simplistic, especially to economists I suppose, but the words are nonetheless as straight forward as words ever get.

I of course understand that such a revival in believing God will never occur. Jesus knew that, and that is why he said we will always have the poor (John 12:8). Still, it's interesting to see how poverty could be eliminated.

Oh yeah everyone deserves to suffer because they don't believe in God. Father why has thou forsaken us?

 

[Milton Platt]

Sounds like something Victor Maslov said. He was a pretty smart guy, but not as smart as God.

How about this one?

3John 1:2,

Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.​

As my grandfather used to say, “wish in one hand and spit in the other and see which one gets full faster”.

 

[rrobs]

As my grandfather used to say, “wish in one hand and spit in the other and see which one gets full faster”.

That's a good one! My grandpa used to say, "If wishes were horses, beggers would be riding."

But with God, neither wishing nor spitting does anything to procure the promises of God. Believing is the key.

Mark 11:23,

For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
​

When Christians believe in verses like 3 John 1:2 they get whatever it says, in this case prosperity, not necessarily unlimited riches, but enough to be comfortable. God will honor believing.

 

[rrobs]

Oh yeah everyone deserves to suffer because they don't believe in God. Father why has thou forsaken us?

The verse you are referring to doesn't actually say "us."

Matt 27:46,

And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
​

It was Jesus who said that and it has nothing to do with poverty or riches. Read the context and you'll see what he was actually talking about.

It's important to read and study the scriptures for yourself. Most people's ideas of God come from what the churches say and not from their own study. If you read my posts you will quickly see that I have a very low opinion of the churches. They have been teaching their own doctrine which is largely at odds with the scriptures they claim to follow. It begins with the trinity. God is not 3 in 1 oil. To make Jesus and God the same ruins the entire story as it would any story in which the 2 main characters are somehow considered to be one person in the reader's mind. I don't blame anyone who refuses to believe the nonsense that comes from the church. It is a sign of intelligence in that person.

Who knows, maybe someday you will discover the truth of the scriptures for yourself. If you ever do decide to study them for yourself, I would only advise you forget everything you've learned from the churches. I can guarantee that the words in the Bible are quite a bit different than the words heard form the pulpits every Sunday morning.

 

[Milton Platt]

That's a good one! My grandpa used to say, "If wishes were horses, beggers would be riding."

But with God, neither wishing nor spitting does anything to procure the promises of God. Believing is the key.

Mark 11:23,

For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
​

When Christians believe in verses like 3 John 1:2 they get whatever it says, in this case prosperity, not necessarily unlimited riches, but enough to be comfortable. God will honor believing.

Gotta admit, I like “horses and beggars” better. It’s a little more, shall we say ‘tidy’? Think I’m gonna steal it........

My point was that the passage you quoted was someone “wishing” things for someone.

 

[rrobs]

Gotta admit, I like “horses and beggars” better. It’s a little more, shall we say ‘tidy’? Think I’m gonna steal it........

My point was that the passage you quoted was someone “wishing” things for someone.

Hmmm. I like your grandpa's ditty a little better, mess and all. We'll swap!

I see what you mean by wishing.

First of all, everything I've said and am about to say is meaningless to anybody who does not believe in God or the Bible. I understand and respect that. I'm just trying to relate what the book says, not trying to convince everybody it's actually true. Having said that, here goes;

The word translated "wish" is a form of the same Greek word usually translated as pray. It's not like making an idle wish to become rich or something. According to the scriptures prayer must be accompanied by believing. The petitioner must take an active part in the process, which I don't think describes what we normally think of as "wishing" for something.

If the King "wishes" for you to have prosperity, you will most certainly have the opportunity to be prosperous. I'm talking about a regular king, a man. Wouldn't a wish from God be even more sure than a mere human king?

While it may have been John that penned that verse, it was God who told him what to write (2 Tim 3:16, 2 Pet 1:21, et.al.). That's why the Bible is often called the Word of God. So it was really God saying He wishes us to be prosperous.

To make it actually happen, it is necessary for the person to believe God wants them to be prosperous. God is a god of free will. He will not force anything on anybody. He says, "Here it is. Come and get it" and we respond one way or the other.

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

The verse you are referring to doesn't actually say "us."

Matt 27:46,

And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
​

It was Jesus who said that and it has nothing to do with poverty or riches. Read the context and you'll see what he was actually talking about.

It's important to read and study the scriptures for yourself. Most people's ideas of God come from what the churches say and not from their own study. If you read my posts you will quickly see that I have a very low opinion of the churches. They have been teaching their own doctrine which is largely at odds with the scriptures they claim to follow. It begins with the trinity. God is not 3 in 1 oil. To make Jesus and God the same ruins the entire story as it would any story in which the 2 main characters are somehow considered to be one person in the reader's mind. I don't blame anyone who refuses to believe the nonsense that comes from the church. It is a sign of intelligence in that person.

Who knows, maybe someday you will discover the truth of the scriptures for yourself. If you ever do decide to study them for yourself, I would only advise you forget everything you've learned from the churches. I can guarantee that the words in the Bible are quite a bit different than the words heard form the pulpits every Sunday morning.

I know, I misquoted it on purpose. But the verse deals with the flesh of Jesus crying against his crucifixion even though his spirit knew that it was for the greater good. Just like your op about poverty and God. As if God's plan is always best for people.